CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[lyd]

Couldn't decide what forum to post this in, but since the PJ will be one of the main benefactors of the purchase, I figured here made at least some sense. Feel free to move it if it should be elsewhere.

So, I have a box full of crappy radio shack uncontrolled irons in various sizes, none of which work terribly well. I'd like to pick up a decent soldering station just on general principles, but with two immediate tasks specifically in mind. The first is replacing components on the projector boards, for which I want something that I am less likely to do damage with, and the second is restoring a 50 year old tube amp, for which I need something with some oomph to handle the point-to-point wiring and big, heavy terminals. I'd ideally like something that will do decently with everything from SMD to big clunky connections like the amp, with appropriate tip changes of course, if that is possible.

The Weller WES51 seems highly recommended as a good all-around station -- would you guys concur? Any better suggestions? I'd entertain spending anywhere up to around $200 USD, but the ~$100 price point the WES51 is nicer.

Thanks for your input.

[David_Web]

Make sure you buy coated tips. And treat them well.

I have a Weller EC 2002. Don't know much about it other then that dad took it home from work when they throw away a lot of things.
Working beautifully for many years. Good tips makes a LOT of difference though.
(digital readout and temperature set. up to 450*C. electrostatic protection. Think it is 60W)

Buying used soldering irons might not be a bad idea as the irons them selfs usually lasts pretty well. You might even score one for free.

[Curt Palme]

Frankly, for tube stuff, I use a good old Weller soldering gun. Nothing beats HEAT to loosen those large connections.

For my soldering station, all I've ever used is the Weller WTCPS. Temperature controlled, but no variable temp dial. I get maybe 4 years out of each pencil, but I've also now gotten good at repairing/replacing the thermostat which is what always fails..

[Curt Palme]

Frankly, for tube stuff, I use a good old Weller soldering gun. Nothing beats HEAT to loosen those large connections.

For my soldering station, all I've ever used is the Weller WTCPS. Temperature controlled, but no variable temp dial. I get maybe 4 years out of each pencil, but I've also now gotten good at repairing/replacing the thermostat which is what always fails..

[jkruger]

I snagged a Weller EC 2002m out of the dumpster about five years ago, bought some nice tips for it and it's been wonderful to use. A little underpowered for the big stuff but like Curt said the weller gun works well for that.

[kal]

I have a Weller WES51. Paid about $100 for it. The seem to go for less than that now. You don't need the digital readout.. get the cheaper WES51. The tips will last you x20 longer than the crappy tips used on the $10 radio shack irons. I also went through a bunch of those over the years before switching to Weller.

You're less likely to do damage with the Weller too as it's temp controlled and always hot. The radio shack ones cool down too fast if you do a lot of bigger work in which case you end up heating things up but not enough to melt solder. Or even worse, you get cold solder joints.

The Weller is also 100 times faster to heat up. Only takes about 10 seconds.

The WES51 doesn't come with a very fine tip for SMD stuff so you may want something finer.

Kal

[kal]

I have a Weller WES51. Paid about $100 for it. The seem to go for less than that now. You don't need the digital readout.. get the cheaper WES51. The tips will last you x20 longer than the crappy tips used on the $10 radio shack irons. I also went through a bunch of those over the years before switching to Weller.

You're less likely to do damage with the Weller too as it's temp controlled and always hot. The radio shack ones cool down too fast if you do a lot of bigger work in which case you end up heating things up but not enough to melt solder. Or even worse, you get cold solder joints.

The Weller is also 100 times faster to heat up. Only takes about 10 seconds.

The WES51 doesn't come with a very fine tip for SMD stuff so you may want something finer.

Kal

[Tinman]

Metcal MX-500. Nothing even comes close. Almost INSTANT heat, too.

I owned every other crap weller on the planet. Junk. Hakko's are a lot better.

But once you go Metcal/Oki, with all the tips and options.... NO comparison.

Metcals are ALWAYS controlled to +/- 1 degree.

Steep to buy into, but worth every penny.

The Metcal is so flexible that it will solder SMD stuff to Tube gear with the SAME tip. It uses RF feedback temp control. You CAN'T fry a board with it.

However, at your price point, you get what you pay for. I picked up my whole system, solder and de-solder handpiece, talon (that's 2 tip solder tweezers) and about 30 different tips for around $500.

Someone let me test drive it, and tossed the Hakko the next day.


Marc

[dculberson]

Metcal irons are amazing. I happened upon a deal for a couple of them, SP200's, and didn't know at the time how awesome they were. I bought them, and once I used one I had a Barney moment: "WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN ALL MY LIFE??" They can sink amazing amounts of current into the tip, but without ever overheating. They go from dead cold to full soldering temperature in ~15 seconds.

Cost is a big factor, though, and you're probably not gonna get one with an assortment of tips for $200. A friend of mine borrowed one and decided he had to get one. He managed to score an SP200 on eBay for $200, with one tip. The tips determine the temperature, but one or two tips will do 90% of hobbyist soldering. I had a dozen or more, but use just one of them pretty much all the time. They have awesome SMD tips that are like needles - I've used that one once.

If you get an MX-500, you can get SMD rework stuff for it like soldering tweezers and such. Probably overkill, but it would be nice to have that option.

I sprung for a Metcal desoldering station, that uses shop air through a venturi to generate vacuum. I haven't been as happy with that one but it was used and might have problems. I haven't had motivation to pick up a new handpiece yet.

[1031]

This one is not same league that metcal, but best one that i have used

http://www.all-spec.com/1/viewitem/WD1/ALLSPEC/prodinfo/i=rss

I have that station with WP80 handle,
http://www.all-spec.com/1/viewitem/WP80/ALLSPEC/prodinfo/w3path=cat

tips are cheap and really easy to change.
Best Weller (for that price)

[Curt Palme]

OK, ya know, I haven't really imposed any limits of topics here, but I think I need to ban talking about equipment that is better than mine.

All this looking at high end soldering irons has me aroused..

[Curt Palme]

OK, ya know, I haven't really imposed any limits of topics here, but I think I need to ban talking about equipment that is better than mine.

All this looking at high end soldering irons has me aroused..

[lyd]

That Metcal stuff looks fantastic, but too much dough for the amount of use I'll give it.

I think I'll go with the Weller, despite Tinman's condemnation of them. It will still be a big step up from the RS irons.

Thanks again everyone for the replies.

[lyd]

Hey, look at this Weller iron!

I'm not sure how many watts it is, but the tip is big enough for the tube-amp rework...

[Tinman]

[Tinman]

[David_Web]

If you solder every day quality quickly takes priority and the Metcal would easily be justified.
However the Weller that lasted you six months would last the casual user for many years.


That Metcal looks nice.
If it could make the coffee as well I would buy it.

[lyd]

[lyd]

Okay, I thought the Metcal irons were really nifty, based on the quick lookups I did after reading your recommendations, but was just reading about them a little more and found out that they heat the tip with RF. Aside from all the positive effects this turns out to have on the way it works, that's just cool as hell!

I found a used SP-200 on ebay for $110 + shipping. (Metcal's SP200 product page). This is their bare-bones budget unit, but it looks like it might be right for my level of use and the price is right.

The Ebay unit comes with a hand-piece and tip, no stand. I will assume the tip is junk, just to play it safe.

What do you think? It seems like kind of a little guy, will it do the job, with the proper tip, on those big tube-amp connections I was talking about, or would I need to budget an additional unit (probably a cheap gun as Curt suggested, if neccesary) to do that sort of work?

Thanks again.

[Tinman]

You'll be surprised just what that little tip can heat up. Don't assume the tip is junk, either. Also, you can buy used ones. They can, but rarely go bad. The neat thing is that it'll never be too hot or cold to do the job.

The really neat thing is that you can always expand the system as you need it.


Hey, let's all post pics of ourselves with our high end irons and piss Curt off! LOL!

Curt, get a metcal. You'll wonder HOW you worked without one. Trust me.

Marc

[dculberson]

Lyd, that's the same model as I use and it works great. You should be able to do tube amp connections just fine, especially with a larger tip - that power supply can sink a decent amount of current. The tip looks okay in the picture, assuming that's the one you'd get with it.

I do have a few extra SP200 tips. I will look at what I have tonight and let you know if I can part with any. Unfortunately I don't have any extra holders!

[WTS]

I've been using the same 2 Weller WTCPS stations for 30 years now and I've only ever had to replace the tips, they are work horses.

[lyd]