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IWantMyHD
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Ashland, MA
TV/Projector: Electrohome ECP 4100
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| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:45 pm Post subject: Universal Remote Recommendation - 8 remotes to 1 |
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This forum has been very useful in getting me the best picture out of my Electrohome ECP4100. By upgrading my DVD player and adding the HD-Fury/Monoprice HDMI switcher, my 104 inch picture now looks great. The downside is that I now have to use 4 remotes to make it all work. The Monoprice for HDMI source, the ECP remote to turn on and channel selection, the source remote (DVD, VHS, Comcast Cable or Blueray) and the Bose Lifestyle 50 remote for audio. BIG PAIN. Even bigger when I have to hear it from my wife.
I like the Logitech offerings (I have had great luck with their other computer products) although it seems there are several great options out there. But the problem seems to come down to compatability with the ECP4100 and how to get an RF signal to the Bose LS 50. Does anyone have any experience with universal remotes and these two devices?
I obviously would like one with macro abilities so that when, say, I hit the DVD button, the DVD and projector are fired up, the projector is set to the apppropriate channel, the Monoprice switch is set and the Bose input source is set to DVD and put into film mode. Four remotes, several setting changes down to one button! My wife won't complain so much when I buy a new toy.
Thank you in advance for any advice,
Thom
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rabies_70
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 1189
Location: Carlsbad, CA
TV/Projector: Sony G70Q
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| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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Try this link
http://www.remotecentral.com/index.html
These guys know much about remotes. I personally don't think I will ever use anything but a pronto tsu7000 in my theater ever again, but it has a steeeeep learning curve to make it perfect, and it won't do RF for your bose. Before my pronto I had 10 different remotes lying around. NO WAY the wife could figure that out, I barely could. Now she just presses a button the pronto starts asking her question, what do you want to watch, is this on is that on , is the projector warmed up, and everything just comes on and switches inputs and you're watching a movie. When your done, push one button , answer what you were watching, and it all turns itself off. Sweet.  Plus the pronto interface is really cool to look at
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Ray
I am an iconoclast
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IWantMyHD
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Ashland, MA
TV/Projector: Electrohome ECP 4100
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| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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I just looked at the Pronto and it does look slick. But for those bucks, I want to make sure I can get something that works with the ECP4100 and the Bose Lifecycle 50.
I have already been all over that forum link you sent. Your right they are a great resourcee for general remote recommendations. However, although the question was often asked about a remote that could handle RF for the Bose and IR for everything else, none of the threads I followed ever gave an answer...and most of the posts were from several years ago.
Bose sold alot of the Lifestyle 50's. Electrohome sold alot of ECPs. I'm hoping some third party has figured out a way to make this work. Hopefully somebody out there knows.
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:37 pm Post subject: |
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No remote with RF capability will work with an RF device like the Bose. The RF in universal remotes is only for them to talk to their base station and convert it to IR. So, no universal remote will replace your Bose remote.
Secondly, if you do go touchscreen, make sure you play with one alot before going that way. I would personally NEVER use something like the tsu7000. Remotes like that are for showin' not goin'  . They have fewer functions per page than a hard button remote and pretty much cannot be used by touch.
For "affordable" remotes, it comes down to a harmony or URC. If your needs are exactly what lines up with the harmony, you'll love it. If your needs are different than that, you'll hate it. Basically, the only think the harmony does better than a comparably priced URC remote is power and input state tracking. The thing that URC remotes do better than harmonies are macros. If you have no TOAD devices (or can leave them on all the time), I always recommend URC. If you have some TOAD devices or your usage would benefit by some of the harmoy's extra hard buttons (for instance on the 880/890), I'd say go harmony.
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Dave
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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look for a harmoney 1000 or the lessser 990. I use the 1000 for my home theater and it works great. I have a marquee and 4 different recalls for differetnt aspects and scan rates ect. It was 269 on e-bay you should be able to find one. Also you will need the rf extender about 65 the cheapest i found...be patiant and they do show up for those prices.
Athanasios
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rabies_70
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 1189
Location: Carlsbad, CA
TV/Projector: Sony G70Q
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| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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Oh yeah, and I forgot to add. Some folks HATE the Prontos. Can't say that I blame them. The Pronto is a real bear to get your head wrapped around and program a real Pain In The @$$. Photo shop, learning codes testing etc. Not really for those who want to have a remote up and running in 20 minutes after putting the batteries in But the result was that my 80 yo mother in law can sit in the theater and turn on everything in the theater and watch a movie by answering questions on the screen.
Person 99 is right though, controlling RF devices is definitely not in the Prontos' bag of tricks,URC's are nice, and that URC mx3000 is one slick remote.
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I am an iconoclast
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greg_mitch
Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 5320
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:09 am Post subject: |
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| Person99 wrote: | No remote with RF capability will work with an RF device like the Bose. The RF in universal remotes is only for them to talk to their base station and convert it to IR. So, no universal remote will replace your Bose remote.
Secondly, if you do go touchscreen, make sure you play with one alot before going that way. I would personally NEVER use something like the tsu7000. Remotes like that are for showin' not goin' . They have fewer functions per page than a hard button remote and pretty much cannot be used by touch.
For "affordable" remotes, it comes down to a harmony or URC. If your needs are exactly what lines up with the harmony, you'll love it. If your needs are different than that, you'll hate it. Basically, the only think the harmony does better than a comparably priced URC remote is power and input state tracking. The thing that URC remotes do better than harmonies are macros. If you have no TOAD devices (or can leave them on all the time), I always recommend URC. If you have some TOAD devices or your usage would benefit by some of the harmoy's extra hard buttons (for instance on the 880/890), I'd say go harmony. |
I found that the hard buttons on the URC remotes worked way better by feel than the little harmony hard buttons.
I like my URC 850 with RF (although i have yet to set up the RF yet.).
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IWantMyHD
Joined: 28 Nov 2007
Posts: 20
Location: Ashland, MA
TV/Projector: Electrohome ECP 4100
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:05 am Post subject: |
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So if I get this right, what I am hearing is that there is no way I can be unchained from the Bose LS 50 remote from my home theatre. This just boggles my mind - even Microsoft provides APIs. I'm not going to let this rest - to have my audio forever disconnected from my video remote will not make me the KING of my home theatre.
I am also assuming, but I have not heard, that the Harmony and Pronto both work with the Electrohome ECP4100. Has anyone tried either of these with my projector? And has anyone tried either of these with the Comcast digital/DVR box?
Lastly, if I am reading your comments right, the Pronto versus Harmony seams to be a hard-to-set-up/easy-to-use versus easy-to-set-up/less-user-friendly-use. I can understand that trade off, but if both work, and we are talking about long term use by all the family, I am willing to invest the setup time.
Thank you all so much for your feedback!
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:18 am Post subject: |
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| rabies_70 wrote: | | Oh yeah, and I forgot to add. Some folks HATE the Prontos. Can't say that I blame them. The Pronto is a real bear to get your head wrapped around and program a real Pain In The @$$. Photo shop, learning codes testing etc. Not really for those who want to have a remote up and running in 20 minutes after putting the batteries in But the result was that my 80 yo mother in law can sit in the theater and turn on everything in the theater and watch a movie by answering questions on the screen. |
My problem with the Pronto has nothing to do with difficulty in programming.
I hate touch screens because:
1) They are large and unweildy, almost always requiring two handed operation (I like 1 handed operation).
2) You cannot use them by touch, you must look at them to use them.
3) They have too few functions per "page". My universal remote has 45 hard buttons on 1 "page" all of which are used in cable/DVR watching. IIRC a tsu7000 has 17 hard buttons. That means, to do what my remote does, you'd have to squeeze 28 functions on to that touch screen. Not going to happen in a usable way. So you need more paging. Most likely, you'd have a "page" of number keys, a "page" of transport controls, a "page" of menu/guide controls, and a "page" to hold all the other stuff.
My remotes have all the 1 touch functions to make it all happen that the pronto does, they just are easier to use and require less touches to make something happen. 
| rabies_70 wrote: | | Person 99 is right though, controlling RF devices is definitely not in the Prontos' bag of tricks,URC's are nice, and that URC mx3000 is one slick remote. |
No, I mean none, zip, zilch, nada. No universal remote can control an RF device. This is NOT a Pronto weakness.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:27 am Post subject: |
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| IWantMyHD wrote: | | So if I get this right, what I am hearing is that there is no way I can be unchained from the Bose LS 50 remote from my home theatre. This just boggles my mind - even Microsoft provides APIs. I'm not going to let this rest - to have my audio forever disconnected from my video remote will not make me the KING of my home theatre. |
At the risk of being an *******, calling the Bose Lifestyle 50 a "home theater" system is really stretching it. You would get far better sound from a Denon or Onkyo home theater in a box. Plus, those give you the option to at some point upgrade the speakers for a very nice sounding system. If possible, you should consider the swap. Bose buyers are not really setting up home theaters, so the lack of IR control is usually not an issue.
| IWantMyHD wrote: | | I am also assuming, but I have not heard, that the Harmony and Pronto both work with the Electrohome ECP4100. Has anyone tried either of these with my projector? And has anyone tried either of these with the Comcast digital/DVR box? |
The ECP and motorola comcast boxes use IR in the "normal" frequency range. Any, and I mean ANY learning remote will do them--even the $20 ones at Wally World.
| IWantMyHD wrote: | | Lastly, if I am reading your comments right, the Pronto versus Harmony seams to be a hard-to-set-up/easy-to-use versus easy-to-set-up/less-user-friendly-use. |
This is not at all how I would characterize it. I consider the pronto more difficult to use for the reasons of the above post.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:29 am Post subject: |
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I agree that the Harmony remotes are great. Easy to use and programmed via a web applet whilst plugged into the PC.
I orginally got one because it had ALL the codes for every device which my Sony didn't have and I was going to program the Sony using the learning feature via the Harmony
After using a Harmony for 2 days, I discarded the Sony one.
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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| oliverg wrote: | | I agree that the Harmony remotes are great. |
I wouldn't go that far--I have serious problems with Harmony remotes. I just think that as a reasonably priced solution, they are adequate for many uses. I spent 9 hours trying to program one including 5 calls to technical support, getting escalated to higher levels of support and such, only to find out there is really no way to accomplish some things that URC remotes can do.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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Some of the other remotes (eg Pronto) have a very very steep learning curve ... my non-technical sister ... who can barely read emails taught my technically illiterate mother how to use the Harmony 890 and how to program hers - over a lunchbreak. I've bought several of my technically illiterate friends the Harmony 880 and not one has required me to help them out. (They make great gifts! for friends who have 93123983 remotes)
Perhaps what you're trying to do is a little more complex than what the average HT person would need? What were you trying to do that required you to ring tech support?
One a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being the hardest, I would rate the Harmony 890 and 1000 as 1 or 2. The mid level Prontos would rate around 8-9. The Sony multi remotes are a nightmare (10).
They are by far the easiest to use out there for ‘the average’ person but have the flexibility to do some fairly complex tasks. Not to mention the fact that they have virtually every single IR code in existence.
Each to their own I guess
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| oliverg wrote: |
Perhaps what you're trying to do is a little more complex than what the average HT person would need? What were you trying to do that required you to ring tech support? |
To sum up my complaints:
1) Programming interface is horrible (not just the hand-holding part of it, but downright poorly designed).
2) Remotes/buttons feel cheap. Many cases of them breaking. I had an 880 break 30 days after I bought it and another one intermittently malfunctions and is less than 1 year old.
3) There are many things the Harmony can do, but logitech won't let it do. And then there are the things they will let it do, but you can't do--you have to call tech support and be on hold for 45 minutes to get second level support person to do it for you (who's brain dead idea was this?)
4) Activity entry and exit scripts are not enough macro capabilities for the sophisticated control many theaters need and since they think they are smarter than you, they won't let you program these macros even though the remote has the ability.
5) No control of activity entry/exit script execution ordering for "managed" devices (frequently needed for HDMI or firewire handshakes)
6) Many of the Harmony remotes are ergonomic nightmares. You cannot operate this thing by touch like the URC or other remotes.
7) Tech support useless for anything but the most trivial things you should be able to figure out yourself.
Here were my main issues:
A) Power on sequence.
Firewire is a buggy buggy thing in the A/V world, but I know the magic to make my set up work consistently. 1 key ingredient of this is order of device power on and delay between them. (After I figured all this out, it took me literally 2 minutes to program a URC macro for this. This issue alone has been the topic of 3 support calls and about 4 hours of effort).
What I need to do:
1) Power on Source A.
2) Pause 2.5 seconds
3) Power on Source B
(Note: Source B is the one "used" for this activity, Source A must just be on and on 2.5+ seconds before Source B).
This macro which is simple for any other remote seems to be impossible for the Harmony as no matter what I do, the Harmony powers on source B first.
What I've tried that didn't work:
1) Changing inter-device delay times (B bigger than A, A bigger than B, etc). (This solution was recommended by Harmony support and does not work.)
2) Changing power on delay times (same as above). (This solution was recommended in forums and by Harmony support and does not work.)
3) The four possible combinations of the above.
4) Creating a Generic Activity and adding the devices used in every possible sequence.
Harmony Support's last stupid solution:
Add to the Activity entry script the following (which runs after it has power things on in the incorrect order):
- delay
- power off source A
- power off source B
- delay
- power on source A
- delay
- delay
- power on source B
This is hacky and results in a very long running macro.
The hack I have working (but never recommended by Harmony Support) but want to fix:
1) I have change the power options for both Source A and B to "always leave powered on" which as any harmony power users knows, actually does not mean "always leave powered on" at all, it means "do not automatically turn on or off these devices or manage their state." (More of the Harmony user friendliness in action!).
2) Modified the Activity entry and exit scripts that use these sources to power them on correctly on entry and power them off on exit.
The deficiency of this approach is that the Harmony is not managing their state. So, if I switch from an activity that uses both devices to one that only uses one of them, that device will unnecessarily power off than back on. Not huge, but clunky, but surely there must be a way to solve this incredibly simple problem.
B) Multiple codes from single key press.
What I need to do:
On all activities that use the transport keys do the following:
1) On "Play" start the device playing and send lights "AllLightsOff".
2) On "Stop" stop the device playing and send lights "AllLightsOn".
3) On "Pause" pause the device playing, mute the PJ (turn off the picture), and send lights "Scene1".
4) Have a button labeled "scope" and "normal" on all activities which puts the processor into 2.35:1 or 1.78:1 mode and the PJ to the correct memory block (i.e. sends a macro of 3 button push to the processor and 2 to the PJ).
Possible solutions
The possible solutions I've been able to gather (neither are that attractive and I don't even know if possible):
1) Use a URC remote to program the macro, then have the Harmony learn it in RAW mode.
2) Have Harmony 2nd level support mod my config to do what I want (they won't expose this functionality to you the end user).
Nuumber 2 sucks as I don't want to be on hold with harmony support for 30 minutes plus any time I want to tweak this just to have them do something a remote in the price range should be able to do.
C) Backlights
My theater is pitch black. On a fade to black, you cannot see your hand 3" in front of your face. I want no unnecessary light in there on a fade to black or any other time. So,
1) I only want the remote to do the backlight when I press glow. I've disabled the tilt sensor, but when I push a button, say volume up, the backlight comes on with its blindingly bright LCD lighting up the seating area. Harmony support says that it can't do it, but surely this is incorrect and it is incredibly stupid to light the remote up on every key press, in other words, if I found the volume up button without the backlight, why in the f*** would I need the backlight to find it once I've pressed it?!?!?!? So, there must be some hack or something that can be done.
2) The charging base has a blue spotlight on it that I don't want on for the same reasonse as above. Other than tape over it or voiding my warranty by opening it up and disconnecting it, is there anything that can be done?
Example of the horrible horrible programming interface:
How to add an action to the activity entry script:
Here is the stupid way it works on the web interface (client is similar):
1) Login
2) Select "More Options" (A sane person would pick "Adjust Setup" since that is what they want to do, but that is not correct).
3) Select "Customize" next to the activity you want to modify.
4) Select "Run the setup wizard again" (a sane person would not pick this because they have run the set up wizard already and it never presented them the option to do what they wanted, so they would pick "Change Options" but alas, that is incorrect and will bump you back to step 3).
5) Page through the set up wizard (2+ pages making no changes).
6) Get to summary page and select "Yes, but I want to add more control of options and devices for this Activity." (Note the use of the word "Option" which does not mean the same here as the use of the word "Option" we saw in step 4--a big software usability no-no as it confuses users.)
7) See a list of devices used, change nothing and click "Save" (a sane person might click "Cancel" because they have yet to change anything and because in every other software program ever written, "Save" or "Finish" is the end of a "Wizard" but not here, you must click "Save" to reach your ultimate goal grasshopper.)
6) You will now go through a similar set up page for the input and click "Next" (same page as you saw in step 5, so you probably think you did something wrong and this will not get to what you want, but you have not made a mistake, press on trooper.)
7) You finally come to that page that lets you do what you want.
Totally hidden and just 9+ clicks from the main page! If I were writing a book on software usability, this would be an ideal case study for what not to do--an example of poorly thought out and horribly designed software. I'm quite sure they could eliminate 50+% of their support calls if the software was better built.
Software Usability 101 - if you are going to "dumb down" your software for the novice or casual user, you must:
1) Make this dumbed down version sensible for that user type (which this is not, as indicated above), and
2) Make available a non-dumbed down version for the "power user" (which they have not).
Oh, by the way, in various points of the wizard above, The "Previous" and "Next" next buttons are not really "Previous" and "Next" as they are in every other wizard. Try it, you'll get surprising results as "Previous" and "Next" won't always be the previous or next page relative to the series of pages you just saw!
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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jask
Joined: 17 Mar 2006
Posts: 10187
Location: kamloops BC
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 8:31 pm Post subject: |
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Harmony does have its hiccups.... I just sorted out a 880 that had not been updated in so long it only had 2005/6/7 options for the year in the clock option (v 4.4.0)...when I went to update it it keep requesting a firmware update before it could do anything,but, the firmware update would hang....... finally logged in through the main page downloaded the software (v7.4.1) update,installed that...and then it would allow the firmware update via usb.
I really like the URC/HTM remotes.
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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IMHO, Pronto's are a bit like the integrated systems like Panja/Crestron. They're only as good and easy/friendly to use as the person who built the screens.
It's a lot of work though, but what I like about them is that you only to put buttons on that you need to. I have 3 panes on mine that I use:
(1) For turning things on/off
(2) For watching TV
(3) For watching movies
Think about the 8 remotes that you have. Do you really *NEED* to use all the buttons from each in the universal? Likely not. For example, the only ones you'll use from your projector after it's set up is likely the on/off.
Each pane is simple, with only the buttons that people use. Half the buttons from the original remotes aren't even used as frankly, they're not needed. For example, for movies, commands like setting a break point, frame advancing, and other advanced stuff isn't even there.
Yes, not having 'hard' buttons makes it harder to use as you need to look down at the screen but I think people put too much weight into this. This is a not a blackberry where you're pounding away at it for hours on end. It's a remote that you use for 10 seconds when you first turn on the HT and plop the movie in, and then for 10 seconds when the movie's over to turn things off. In between you may use it for a few seconds to pause the movie/turn the lights on.
I find the Pront has just enough hard buttons for these functions so it's not really an issue for me or my wife.
Kal
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 1:12 am Post subject: |
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Dave, I don't doubt the issues you've had. There's certainly a large list there.
It seems that the Harmony doesn't comply to doing things using your own logic. Web based applications can confound some people because of the terminology and wording used. Certainly Logitech have tried to remove most of the technical terminology and simplify things to do what 95% of people want to do.
The logic of 'dumbed down' people vs 'technical people' can lead to confusion - I find that happens with wizard basaed applications all the time.
I agree that a more direct method of accessing the functions of the Harmony should be made available for the more technical minded users. Despite this, Logitech have done a really good job of making what is traditionally quite hard, easy for most.
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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| oliverg wrote: |
It seems that the Harmony doesn't comply to doing things using your own logic. Web based applications can confound some people because of the terminology and wording used. Certainly Logitech have tried to remove most of the technical terminology and simplify things to do what 95% of people want to do. |
I agree. A harmony is really a remote to control Joe Sixpack's simple living room system. They really can't do home theater systems. As such, you are correct, this meets the need of 95% of the people.
But bear in mind, although I pick on their horribly designed programming interface, my primary problem is its functionality--read through my post and you will see those are the significant issues.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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| kal wrote: | | IMHO, Pronto's are a bit like the integrated systems like Panja/Crestron. They're only as good and easy/friendly to use as the person who built the screens. |
To a point. But I think their natural "unfriendly" nature at use time makes them less desirable.
I sort of put everything to the "babysitter test". If it takes more than a couple minutes to explain to the babysitter, then it is too hard.
| kal wrote: | It's a lot of work though, but what I like about them is that you only to put buttons on that you need to. I have 3 panes on mine that I use:
(1) For turning things on/off
(2) For watching TV
(3) For watching movies
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No offense my friend , but this is exactly what I think is the wrong way to program a remote. This is effectively a "device" based layout. I was doing "activity" based layouts before harmonys existed (as were others) because those pass the baby sitter test. A layout with a page for turning things on and off keeps my wife from using the theater. Let's say that my wife and daughter want to go watch the Hi Def version of Madagascar we have on D-VHS after watching something on cable, this is what you have to do with that approach:
1) turn off cable box
2) turn on JVC 30K
3) wait for JVC power up and IEEE bus scan (about 2 seconds)
4) turn on Mitsu D-VHS machine
5) Set receiver input
(Note: failing to do steps 1-4 exactly as specified means you won't get a picture)
She won't do that. The babysitter can't do that! That requires notes for anyone but me to use. It has to be one button to put things in the correct state.
As an aside, my problem is step 1 above, the cable box is a TOAD device and MUST be off before the 30K is powered on. Thus, a URC remote without variables can't do it unfortunately.
| kal wrote: |
Think about the 8 remotes that you have. Do you really *NEED* to use all the buttons from each in the universal? Likely not. For example, the only ones you'll use from your projector after it's set up is likely the on/off.
Each pane is simple, with only the buttons that people use. Half the buttons from the original remotes aren't even used as frankly, they're not needed. For example, for movies, commands like setting a break point, frame advancing, and other advanced stuff isn't even there. |
For watching FiOS (especially in the family room--the primary TV watching location), these are the buttons I have on the remote that we use regularly use (all accessible without paging):
0-9 (10 buttons)
Menu
Exit
Guide
Info
FF
REW
Play
Skip forward 30 seconds
Skip backward 6 seconds
Record
channel +
channel -
prev
volume +
volume -
mute
page up
page down
day +
day -
DVR list
Jump to live
Video on Demand
Weather
Navigation up
Navigation down
Navigation right
Navigation left
OK
That's 39 buttons. Good luck making that user friendly on a Pronto. My wife has no problem with this on an appropriately labeled hard button remote with soft keys.
| kal wrote: | | Yes, not having 'hard' buttons makes it harder to use as you need to look down at the screen but I think people put too much weight into this. This is a not a blackberry where you're pounding away at it for hours on end. It's a remote that you use for 10 seconds when you first turn on the HT and plop the movie in, and then for 10 seconds when the movie's over to turn things off. In between you may use it for a few seconds to pause the movie/turn the lights on. |
To an extent, I think you oversimplify just a bit. This is more true in the theater than the family room for instance. the family room is where you are using it much more. I like to have the same remotes in the family room and theater for a consitent user experience. A pronto in the living room would be a nightmare.
Secondly, taking your argument that you really don't need that much functionality is an argument against the high priced pronto. A used URC MX-500 for $40 would do everything you do with your pronto--why spend the extra money on the pronto if not to impress people with your cool touchscreen remote?
_________________
Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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drice1234
Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 1309
Location: Allen, Texas
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| Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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I have had a Pronto 2000 for sometime and am happy with it. I would like to have more hard buttons as Dave refers to but for me the simplicity of programming is worth the trade off. You can download a lot of preset screens off of remotecentral.com and the setup of macros is great, basically drag and drop in the programming software. My 5 year old can get everything going to play with his Wii or watch a DVD with one button (even my wife can use it). I have hooked up a unit that converts the IR to X10 signals and control the lights as well. I have bought a MX500 to see if it is more user friendly with the hard buttons but am really fighting through the programming manual. Hopefully once I start programming it will be clearer. Another good feature of the Pronto is that I have bought numerous CRT projectors over the last year without remotes. I have been able to go to remotecentral and download the codes for all of them and load into the Pronto in order to test and setup the PJ's. Not optimium but it has worked.
Dan
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