CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

Hey, i played a bit with one of my 2 Marquees and realized that it does not do vertical convergence (except middle position)
on any of the tubes.
I measured the +-24 rails, they are a bit off (-24,9 and +23,9) but as the horizontal convergence works, i think that this isn't the reason of the fail.
As i have two projectors, i swapped the backside heatsinks and no, it's not the convergence board.
I currently only have one CLM, but that one does work fine in the other projector.
So as a conclusion, i can exclude the CLM and convergence amp itself.

What seems kind of weird to me is that the backside heatsink gets really hot. I did a complete initialization before,
so there is no convergence or astig used. All settings on 50 except H and V size.
The projector is running on internal patterns, nothing external connected.

Is there any other board (except the 2 mainboards and the LVPS) involved here?
What could cause my problems?

I'm running this 9500 (everything stock) with a 8500 CLM, software 4.4.

Regards, Julian

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 9:40 pm Post subject:

Is it an Ultra chassis? you may not be able to use the 4.4 software, which is Ultra, with a non Ultra chassis. I've had that before.

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

Oh, yeah i believe the original CLM is stamped with a 1999 date. But i believe it is an Ultra, i'm not sure.
It has the new style FGM with the additional black box and so on.
Are there differences in the motherboards? I have a spare set of motherboards but i'm not gagging for the conversion.
I even tried crosstesting the LVPS - no change.

Regards, Julian

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 11:21 pm Post subject:

I've had this problem before. Top and bottom pin and keystone don't work either, right? With mine, it was the wrong firmware used with the wrong chassis.

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

As i cannot change the software or CLM, would it make sense to change both motherboards?
I have them here, backplane MB 50-2015-02P / 03-260315-04P and upper MB 50-000358-02P / 03-260358-02P.
I believe they are relatively new because the guy i got them from had mostly new projectors from 2003 and newer.

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2015 1:42 am Post subject:

No, it`s the firmware in the CLM. try a different version. I need to set up a late model Ultra and play with the CLM boards to see if there`s a pattern. I too thought it was the focus board, motherboard, backplane or convergence board, but it was the CLM each time.

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

Let me take it to a different point of view.
I should have mentioned that i had two 8500 Ultra from 2001 and a 1999 9500(Ultra?).
Ok, i've mentioned this many times, but not yesterday.
I gave a complete set of boards away (all from the 9500), kept the aluminium frame and motherboards of the 9500.
So what i have now is a 9500 Ultra which was an 8500 Ultra before, i changed the tubes to 9" and kept only the aluminum frame and motherboards
of the 9500.

Both projectors use exactly the same motherboards, both use the same CLM (as i only have one).
The convergence boards are also the same. And there is nothing else involved in geometry and convergence than...

The focus board. I took the focus board of the other projector, and yes, that does work. H and V convergence, all geometry settings.
As they are exactly the same number (03-270354-02P), same issue number 2 and same board number 50-000354-02P
i think i end up with a problematic focus board.
As we don't discuss component level repair, i will try what i could do and then report.
I could imagine the board did run too hot in the past, but that's only a guess.
Regards, Julian

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2015 3:20 pm Post subject:

OK, well that was possible too, the convergence signal in an Ultra goes from the CLM to the focus board to the convergence board, so any fault in that chain will cause no V (or H, I'd think is possible) convergence. In my two cases,it was the CLM both times.

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

I do know that convergence worked well before. Could be that i killed something yesterday when i disconnected the focus and convergence
leads of the tubes to do a proper raster centering via the focus coil permanent magnets.
I do know now it is the focus board and i haven't found any defective part on it yet.

Regards, Julian

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2015 3:48 pm Post subject:

I've never had an issue with the geometry portion of the Ultra focus boards, sorry! I do have spares here for sale though if you can't figure it out.

cmjohnson · Joined: 03 Apr 2006 Posts: 5180 Location: Buried under G90s

Before you scratch your head too much, do yourself a favor and triple check every plug and cable relating to convergence, make sure they're plugged into the CORRECT sockets and in the correct orientation.

Attempt convergence while all tubes are lit up (white grid) and see what moves and what doesn't. If nothing moves in the white grid, you either have no connections to the convergence coils at all or it might be bad firmware or a bad convergence board. And remember, central convergence is handled by the H and V deflection boards. It is highly doubtful that you would have a raster but be missing the ability to move the grid around through central convergence. Unless the deflection plugs are connected to the wrong tubes.

I'm saying this because in the past I have once or twice found that I couldn't converge (or focus) after doing some work on the projector and the problem was simply that I had swapped around some plugs.

If it's just that, then you'll be glad you checked.

I've gotten into the habit of labelling every connector and every socket. It just makes it that much easier to work on the projector.

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 8990 Location: Colorado

Lack of top/bottom pin and key is an HDM issue . V Pin and key are generated on the HDM and sent as a waveform to the Vertical Deflection module, or something along those lines. I have an HDM here with no key and Pin that i looked into but never finished repairing.

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

Thanks to both of you.
But i've already figured out that it is the FGM failing.
I swapped the FGM with another one and everything worked again.
I'm not talking about master shift of the colors (center h and v convergence), this works with either FGM.
All i have to do now is repairing the FGM that fails. But i'm not so talented with this.
Regards, Julian

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

FGM repaired, yeah!
Another question: My 2-4-6- pole CPC magnets / astig rings are color coded.
Can anyone tell me which ring should be closest to the neckboard and what the colors mean? They are yellow-green-white at the moment
but i believe the white to be the 2 pole and also believe that it should be closest to the neckboard.
Regards, Julian

barclay66 · Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2015 12:47 pm Post subject:

Hi,

White - 4-pole
Green - 6-pole
Yellow - 2-pole
The ring assembly should be mounted just like shown in the picture (yellow sitting next to neck board).

Read more about adjustments here: http://www.curtpalme.com/Astig.shtm

Regards,
barclay66

tschaeikaei · Joined: 08 Apr 2013 Posts: 490 Location: Germany/Saarland

Ok, thank you.
Do you think clearance between VNB and CPC is ok as well?
Regards, Julian

barclay66 · Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2015 1:24 pm Post subject:

Hi,

The assembly should be pushed against the Focus Coils and make contact with them. This is how it is done on the factory mounted tubes...

Regards,
barclay66