CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[brucek]

I have a basic question with regard to setting the color space in ColorHCFR.

I am using a Standard NTSC test disc in my DVD player that outputs 480p to a 1080p LCD television. I understand that I will then select the option in ColorHCFR to SDTV - REC 601 (NTSC).

My question is if this will still offer as good a result when setting the primaries and secondaries correctly with the CMS controls as opposed to using an HD disc player and setting the color space option to HDTV - REC 709.

In other words, if the displays primaries and secondaries measure close to the SD standards, is it assumed the HD standards will also be fine?

brucek

[HogPilot]

I'm not sure what you mean by "as good a result." HD and SD gamut standards are different, and technically speaking you should calibrate your display's gamut to match that of the material you're watching (REC 709 for HD, REC 601/SMPTE-C for SD). If you calibrate your display for SD and then view HD material, it will appear slightly understaturated. Similarly, if you calibrate your display for HD and then view SD material, the colors will be slightly oversaturated.

That being said, you may or may not be able to tell a difference between the two gamuts, however most people would likely be more sensitive to an undersaturation error as opposed to an oversaturation one.

[kal]

SD and HD primary and secondary points are indeed different, so if one is right it doesn't mean the other necessarily is too.

The points are:

SDTV - REC 601 (NTSC):
Red primary: x=0.630 / y=0.340
Green primary: x=0.310 / y=0.595
Blue primary: x=0.155 / y=0.070
Yellow secondary: x=0.421 / y=0.507
Cyan secondary: x=0.231 / y=0.326
Magenta secondary: x=0.314 / y=0.161

HDTV - REC 709:
Red primary: x=0.640 / y=0.330
Green primary: x=0.300 / y=0.600
Blue primary: x=0.150 / y=0.060
Yellow secondary: x=0.419 / y=0.505
Cyan secondary: x=0.225 / y=0.329
Magenta secondary: x=0.321 / y=0.154

For more info see my greyscale & colour calibration for dummies guide: https://www.curtpalme.com/forum_archived/viewtopic.php@t=10457.html

Kal

[kal]

SD and HD primary and secondary points are indeed different, so if one is right it doesn't mean the other necessarily is too.

The points are:

SDTV - REC 601 (NTSC):
Red primary: x=0.630 / y=0.340
Green primary: x=0.310 / y=0.595
Blue primary: x=0.155 / y=0.070
Yellow secondary: x=0.421 / y=0.507
Cyan secondary: x=0.231 / y=0.326
Magenta secondary: x=0.314 / y=0.161

HDTV - REC 709:
Red primary: x=0.640 / y=0.330
Green primary: x=0.300 / y=0.600
Blue primary: x=0.150 / y=0.060
Yellow secondary: x=0.419 / y=0.505
Cyan secondary: x=0.225 / y=0.329
Magenta secondary: x=0.321 / y=0.154

For more info see my greyscale & colour calibration for dummies guide: https://www.curtpalme.com/forum_archived/viewtopic.php@t=10457.html

Kal

[brucek]

Thanks for the responses guys.

I am indeed confused. My display has only one set of CMS controls (Saturation, tint, value of six colours each). There isn't a separate set of HD and SD CMS controls.

If I use a set of primary and secondary colors from a source disk that is SD, and adjust the CMS controls to that SD standard, would the CMS controls be any different if I had used an HD disk and adjusted the CMS controls to that HD standard?

brucek

[kal]

The controls would not be different. The targets would be.

If you're going to be watching HD content, why not use a free HD test disc based on the Rec709 standard like HD709? It's here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948496

Kal

[kal]

The controls would not be different. The targets would be.

If you're going to be watching HD content, why not use a free HD test disc based on the Rec709 standard like HD709? It's here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948496

Kal

[HogPilot]

[kal]

You know, I never really thought of it. It makes perfect sense (if that's how it works). I can't think of how else it would work than what you said however. It's likely the target gamut that's different, not the data.

Kal

[kal]

You know, I never really thought of it. It makes perfect sense (if that's how it works). I can't think of how else it would work than what you said however. It's likely the target gamut that's different, not the data.

Kal

[brucek]

So you feel I could use the SD test disk in my SD NTSC DVD player and set the "Colour Space - Standard" option to HDTV - REC 709 in Colour HCFR - and this would be correct?

The problem is that I don't have a BluRay player, just a standard DVD player. I get all my movies from Satellite at 720p or 1080p, so I never acquired a BluRay player. I have GetGray and DVE-1 DVD test disks.

I'm using my laptop to run Color HCFR, but I suppose I could use its 1080p HDMI output at the same time and run the HD MP4 files from AVS HD 709. Is the output of a computers graphic card consistent with the HDTV - REC 709 standard?

brucek

[HogPilot]

[HogPilot]

Here's a great post from Tom Huffman on this very subject over on AVS:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=21536074#post21536074

[brucek]

That's great information HogPilot - thanks.