CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

CRT_Ben · Joined: 28 Aug 2006 Posts: 1684 Location: Northern Virginia

Here's the deal - I'm sitting on a cherry 8500 chassis and minty set of 9" factory Panny tubes, as well as my current 9500 "beater" that's in use along with a bevy of spare parts. I've been sitting on this setup for 2-3 years, construction on my dedicated room would be lucky to start in a few months, and I'm starting to think I should liquidate while this stuff still has ANY value and go digital when the room is finished.

I'd imagine that I could sell the parts and tubes for 1 - 1.5k and the wife doesn't mind putting a little money on top for the digi purchase - say the budget is around 2k. The installation flexibility, small package, image brightness, and CIH are all calling my name. Contrasted with the thought of cleanly installing and trying to hush my CRT to get a reasonable noise floor, digi sounds awfully good.

I guess my question is - I have a feeling I could get a CIH setup for 2k that would pretty much murder my 9500, couldn't I? Fast forward the better part of a year and it will only get cheaper, too. Does anyone have specific recommendations for PJs/anamorphic lenses that would fit the budget (or are slightly above now but will drift down in 9-12 months)?

Guess I'd have to change my screenname...

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

If you can live without the low black level and some of the high CR then go for it. For me, it was a hard pill to swallow in losing the black level. Conversely, I didn't have to spend 500 hours learning to calibrate a CRT nor $1-1.5K paying someone to come over to my house to do it.

If I had $10K sitting around doing nothing I might 'consider' looking for a 1080P capable CRT, but when I switched I couldn't find one readily available under the budget I had.

CRT_Ben · Joined: 28 Aug 2006 Posts: 1684 Location: Northern Virginia

mc86 · Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 3:05 am Post subject:

Sounds like you need to decide between being a hobbiest with a nice picture or satisfied with building a nice room and living with the performance aspects of digital. Given how long an 8500 (LC?) with minty tubes should last, I find it hard to think you should get away from that...

Alternatively, I am pretty certain a nice G90 can be had for $2500...and have seen very nice 9500s go for $2K on fleabay recently. Maybe when you get serious and sell I'll finally be ready to graduate from my ECP4500! Rolling Eyes

Of course, by then maybe the 9" machines will be like my ECP is now...almost free!

Matt in pittsburgh

Jeremy112 · Joined: 28 Sep 2006 Posts: 2649 Location: Fond du Lac, WI

With a few mods can't an 8500 be a 9500? I really don't know Marquees at all but I beleive its possible...

Let me tell you something ben, I have a digital PJ currently setup in my HT in place of my XG (awaiting the new tubes for it [THANK GOD Very Happy

]), and I MISS my XG VERY much...

The smooth seamless image, the colors, god I miss the colors, the shadow detail, black levels.. They SMOKE my VPL-VW50 Sony Digital...

Granted the VW50 is about a $500-$1000 projector still on the used market, but honestly I don't really care for it. The CRT just gives you the image that no digital can (at least that I've seen)

Is CRT more work? Sure, are they harder to place and move? You bet, but good image quality will always come at the expense of some shortcoming...

I dont know what the color depth of the JVC RS-20/RS-40 are but as far as I know there is NO digital projector that can do 32-bit color depth. All the digitals I've encountered are only 24-bit. It may not be noticable to some, but to me it is and that was one thing I never had to worry about with the CRT...

If you have a minty 8500 that can do 720p or even 1080i, stick with it.. 1080p on a digital looks worse than 720p on the CRT from my experiences...

Digitals are excellent for computer use though! Portability is all they have going for them Razz

Jeremy112 · Joined: 28 Sep 2006 Posts: 2649 Location: Fond du Lac, WI

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central

I think I remember that Wan. I think you were looking for total cost including CRT pj. I think a cal by CIR is probably around $1k, scaler, and HDMI input $300. The scaler price can vary depending on what you can get. So, you are probably correct. I would sell you my G90 for around $2k delivered, but that you are still going to put in another $1500 or more.

Jeremy112 · Joined: 28 Sep 2006 Posts: 2649 Location: Fond du Lac, WI

I will admit that a CRT is a more expensive way to go, since I have purchased my XG1100 I have spent $700 on it in upgrades, new tubes etc... Its been a year since I bought it and slowly it is coming together, I do still need a scaler and at the moment I only use any of my CRT PJs on the xbox 360 since it can do 720p without a scaler/video processor, and the 360 has media center and other streaming options.

That is one of the reasons I myself purchased the VPL-VW50. It was $500 for a 1080p machine with HDMI inputs... It makes things a lot easier, but after using it for a few months I still prefer my CRT which is why its going on the ceiling one way or another in the next few weeks.

CRT_Ben · Joined: 28 Aug 2006 Posts: 1684 Location: Northern Virginia

Thanks everyone for the responses so far.

To clarify, once I put the 9" tubes and hardware in that 8500 chassis it will be a 9500LC. I've already converted one 8500 to a 9500LC; that's the machine currently in use, but the chassis isn't so solid sometimes and the tubes are dim.

Therefore, the battle royale is between a minty 9500LC and a ~2k digital (including anamorphic lens). The digi has some things going for it like brightness, ANSI contrast, flexibility and ease of installation, and noise level; the CRT has some things going for it like black level, on/off CR, and motion resolution.

Wan; it sounds like if you could get a 9500LC and your RS-20 at the same price, it sounds like you'd stick with CRT?

garyfritz · Joined: 08 Apr 2006 Posts: 12088 Location: Fort Collins, CO

He's GOT a minty XG135LC and he's not using it. I doubt a 9500LC would convince him.

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 8990 Location: Colorado

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central

You could buy a RS40 for $3800 and ana lens for I think $2500. There is talk of a couple of anamorphic pjs coming out.

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 8990 Location: Colorado

so a quick search shows you can do 2.35 with "lens shift and zoom" which basically throws away a good chunk of your light output. The $2K Epson 8700UB can do this but I don't think you'd want to run it this way permanently? As from a few years ago a good anamoprhic lens, even if you skip the sled and go CIH, still costs more than the PJ itself. So your $2K CIH set-up looks to be a pipe dream at this point Ben. At least buying new, but even if you bought the lens used a good LCD still is 2K.

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 8990 Location: Colorado

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

Anamorphic lens? First, why? Did you look for them for the CRT? The idea behind using an anamorphic lens is to be able to use the entire 16:9 raster for content >1.78 aspect (e.g. 2.40). The idea wasn't to gain more resolution but more light. I should think even with 2.40 content in a 16:9 panel digital the light output would be sufficient--I could be wrong.

I do not use an anamorphic lens, and I resort to simple zooming to fill my 10' wide 0.95 gain acoustically transparent 2.40 screen when the content calls for it. And I'm using a two-generation old LCoS.

CRT_Ben · Joined: 28 Aug 2006 Posts: 1684 Location: Northern Virginia

I had simply assumed that an anamorphic lens was necessary for sufficient brightness, but if zooming works, I'm all for saving the money. Dragan - if it's bright enough, is there any hidden downside to running it this way (your post indicated there may be)? As Wan points out it's only brightness as you're already getting full resolution for 2.40 content even if you're using only part of the panel. Wan - you say you zoom to fill with your RS-20; are you happy with the brightness?

Spanky - in your opinion is that the price point (mid level JVC, ~4k) at which you get roughly equivalent IQ to a 9" CRT? Is stuff like the 8700UB just no comparison?

HogPilot · Posted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 8:21 pm Post subject:

An anamorphic lens offers multiple benefits, increased brightness and the use of full panel resolution for 'scope material being the two biggest. Given your seating distance (in screen widths) and visual acuity, an anamorphic lens may eliminate your ability to perceive pixel structure when you would otherwise notice it by just using zooming.

That being said, I would definitely recommend against the purchase of a cheap anamorphic lens (i.e. HTB, or DIY "trophy" lenses) as you will pay a significant cost in IQ due to chromatic aberration, light loss, and geometric distortion. In your case you'd be much better off using your entire budget for a projector and then zooming. Unless you're willing to spend a minimum of $1.5K-$2K on a used Panamorph, Prismasonic, or Schneider/Isco lens, you'd be wasting your money by diverting it away to a "cheap" lens. As always, YMMV and you may not notice the degradation to IQ caused by a less expensive lens. Even if that were the case I'd still recommend buying a better projector and taking advantage of the IQ benefits that come along with it (sharpness, better optics, better CR, etc).

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

Ben, thre amount of light is sufficient for my needs. Also, I am running the lamp in normal mode, and not in high mode. I figured if I see or otherwise a drop in perceptable brightness, I can then change that. Mind you I can see pretty damn well in the dark, which made digital ownership impossible until I lowered my expectations.

In either event, I would advise holding off spending money on an anamorphic lens until you have confirmed whatever digital projector you get is sufficient in terms of brightness when viewing scope content in a zoomed arrangement.