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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 282
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:04 pm Post subject: Lumagen HDP or DVDO VP50 ? |
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Well...that's the question...
AND...is it possible to HTPC (BD/HDDVD/1080p) -> HDP/VP50 -> 9500LC (72Hz?)?
(all I want is perfect scaling....custom timings...AND above all...gamma adjust per RGB...
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 282
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Nashou66 wrote: |
The lumagen has the gamma control for 11 points and aslo CMS.
Athanasios |
And so does the VP50?
For the 1080p.....60Hz can be "inputted" to the HDP?
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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I know 1080p 24 can, my player does not output 1080p@60 . I am not sure how the gamma is done on the VP50 there is nto a real player adjustment for it i guess, ther eis thread here about some program run on a computer for it but no one has moved to far forward on this yet, Videograbber and Gary murell, are going to test it. The lumagens gamma works great, I use it to boost the low end and dont need the moomes gamma at all. With the lumagen you can shoose at what specific IRE you want to boost, i boost 7.5 IRE,15, and 20. you can make the IRE what ever you want by altering the existing 0,10,20,30 etc to any number , like 13.2 if you want for example.
Athanasios
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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 282
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Nashou66 wrote: | I know 1080p 24 can, my player does not output 1080p@60 . I am not sure how the gamma is done on the VP50 there is nto a real player adjustment for it i guess, ther eis thread here about some program run on a computer for it but no one has moved to far forward on this yet, Videograbber and Gary murell, are going to test it. The lumagens gamma works great, I use it to boost the low end and dont need the moomes gamma at all. With the lumagen you can shoose at what specific IRE you want to boost, i boost 7.5 IRE,15, and 20. you can make the IRE what ever you want by altering the existing 0,10,20,30 etc to any number , like 13.2 if you want for example.
Athanasios |
Sounds good....11 points so for every IRE a value for Luminancecorrection....11 points is enough?
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Arno P wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | I know 1080p 24 can, my player does not output 1080p@60 . I am not sure how the gamma is done on the VP50 there is nto a real player adjustment for it i guess, ther eis thread here about some program run on a computer for it but no one has moved to far forward on this yet, Videograbber and Gary murell, are going to test it. The lumagens gamma works great, I use it to boost the low end and dont need the moomes gamma at all. With the lumagen you can shoose at what specific IRE you want to boost, i boost 7.5 IRE,15, and 20. you can make the IRE what ever you want by altering the existing 0,10,20,30 etc to any number , like 13.2 if you want for example.
Athanasios |
Sounds good....11 points so for every IRE a value for Luminancecorrection....11 points is enough? |
yes because if you look at your gamma curve some points do not need correction at all, on mine i only needed 3 points to flatten the gamma two points were not standard so i reassigned the existing ones to the value i needed. very very handy units, and they have CMS for the same points, maybe 21 I havn't used it yet, but its a firmware they added after they made the radiance, it was simple to add it to the older hardware units, in this area , giving new support for older units, Lumagen excels above all other companies, Jim has a passion for Video.
Athanasios
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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 282
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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Another thought....why would anyone want to send a 1080p/24 signal to the scaler (to be upscaled to 1080/60) instead of having 1080p/60 send directly to the scaler input?
I think I am missing something here...
Google....  ....so 24..native BD...and scaling to 72 would per perfect...right? Bummer that some scalers are limited to 60Hz then...
In case of connecting a HTPC as BD player....set the HTPC to 24Hz in that case?
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Arno P wrote: | Another thought....why would anyone want to send a 1080p/24 signal to the scaler (to be upscaled to 1080/60) instead of having 1080p/60 send directly to the scaler input?
I think I am missing something here...
Google.... ....so 24..native BD...and scaling to 72 would per perfect...right? Bummer that some scalers are limited to 60Hz then...
In case of connecting a HTPC as BD player....set the HTPC to 24Hz in that case? |
Because the disc is encoded at 1080p24, and the scalers in players that do the 180p24 to 1080p60 are not as good as the dedicated VP has. Also 1080p@48 from a scaler is not that bad as some say, if you play around in the scaler with the porch and sync setting the flicker that some say they see can be eliminated. Also my LG BH100 only outputs 1080p24, a PJ will not sync to that.
Athanasios
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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 282
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Nashou66 wrote: | | Arno P wrote: | Another thought....why would anyone want to send a 1080p/24 signal to the scaler (to be upscaled to 1080/60) instead of having 1080p/60 send directly to the scaler input?
I think I am missing something here...
Google.... ....so 24..native BD...and scaling to 72 would per perfect...right? Bummer that some scalers are limited to 60Hz then...
In case of connecting a HTPC as BD player....set the HTPC to 24Hz in that case? |
Because the disc is encoded at 1080p24, and the scalers in players that do the 180p24 to 1080p60 are not as good as the dedicated VP has. Also 1080p@48 from a scaler is not that bad as some say, if you play around in the scaler with the porch and sync setting the flicker that some say they see can be eliminated. Also my LG BH100 only outputs 1080p24, a PJ will not sync to that.
Athanasios |
Thx for the education....fills the gaps 
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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jan 03, 2009 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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After I just missed a VP50 deal...I gave it another thought....the lumagen simply has better gamma adjust options (for a start)...and I can live with 1080p/60....so....I made a deal for a nice HDP Expect to receive it within the next 2 weeks...thanks for the support
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anqgiap
Joined: 25 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 7:22 pm Post subject: |
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I use VP50 to Moome's HDMI on the 9500LC and it works great. You can adjust gamma on the VP50 under Output Configuration menu -> Gamma Control, and here you can adjust each red, blue, and green individually.
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SYC
Joined: 16 May 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 5:51 am Post subject: |
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| anqgiap wrote: | | I use VP50 to Moome's HDMI on the 9500LC and it works great. You can adjust gamma on the VP50 under Output Configuration menu -> Gamma Control, and here you can adjust each red, blue, and green individually. |
How do you do the gamma boost near the low IRE side and correct the blue bump on the mid IRE range by a VP50? It is a important function for CRT calibration and adjustment. Lumagen can do this easily.
SYC
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anqgiap
Joined: 25 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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I use VP50 gamma control in conjunction with Kal's greyscale calibration guide (with meter of course) to get between 2.2 - 2.5 level
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SYC
Joined: 16 May 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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| anqgiap wrote: | | I use VP50 gamma control in conjunction with Kal's greyscale calibration guide (with meter of course) to get between 2.2 - 2.5 level |
IMO, the average gamma is not so important because it is a calculated value only. It is better to check the RGB curve itself to see if all three are smooth and balanced.
When you calibrate a CRT projector, you can find it is hard to solve the low IRE white balance and the blue hump in the middle IRE even B is defocused. These can not be solved by R, G, B gamma control only. It needs a seperate R, G, B brightness control also. These can make it perfect almost. A HTPC with ATI driver can do this well, but I don't like HTPC my self. Lumagen provides a more powerful tool, multi-point R, G, B white balance adjustment. It can meet every requirement to claibrate a CRT projector. I want the picture quality of my XG110 to be perfect, so I buy a Lumagen to solve these issues.
SYC
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anqgiap
Joined: 25 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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That sounds interesting...I do have an HTPC which I use and calibrate on a 32" CRT TV which serve as my reference. For the most part, I calibrate the 9500LC to my liking, the numbers could be off what recommended but as long as the picture quality not too far off my reference and I like the picture - that's good for me. The aspect control of the VP50 for CIH screen at 2:35:1 is a big plus for me; I'm sure other can do it as well but my CIH screen has tailored to the iScan HD+ at 1080i so it makes sense for me to go with the DVDO path with 1080P materials.
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Nashou66
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anqgiap
Joined: 25 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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Not so sure about that...JKP uses direct view CRT to create their reference disc. I'm not too crazy about getting the number exactly - back and forth with the setting a few times and what comes out with the best looking to me is all it matters.
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Arno P
Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 282
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| SYC wrote: | | anqgiap wrote: | | I use VP50 gamma control in conjunction with Kal's greyscale calibration guide (with meter of course) to get between 2.2 - 2.5 level |
IMO, the average gamma is not so important because it is a calculated value only. It is better to check the RGB curve itself to see if all three are smooth and balanced.
When you calibrate a CRT projector, you can find it is hard to solve the low IRE white balance and the blue hump in the middle IRE even B is defocused. These can not be solved by R, G, B gamma control only. It needs a seperate R, G, B brightness control also. These can make it perfect almost. A HTPC with ATI driver can do this well, but I don't like HTPC my self. Lumagen provides a more powerful tool, multi-point R, G, B white balance adjustment. It can meet every requirement to claibrate a CRT projector. I want the picture quality of my XG110 to be perfect, so I buy a Lumagen to solve these issues.
SYC |
HTPC with ATI can not do RGB Gamma in overlay/pdvd
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AnalogRocks
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Joined: 08 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Arno P wrote: | | SYC wrote: | | anqgiap wrote: | | I use VP50 gamma control in conjunction with Kal's greyscale calibration guide (with meter of course) to get between 2.2 - 2.5 level |
IMO, the average gamma is not so important because it is a calculated value only. It is better to check the RGB curve itself to see if all three are smooth and balanced.
When you calibrate a CRT projector, you can find it is hard to solve the low IRE white balance and the blue hump in the middle IRE even B is defocused. These can not be solved by R, G, B gamma control only. It needs a seperate R, G, B brightness control also. These can make it perfect almost. A HTPC with ATI driver can do this well, but I don't like HTPC my self. Lumagen provides a more powerful tool, multi-point R, G, B white balance adjustment. It can meet every requirement to claibrate a CRT projector. I want the picture quality of my XG110 to be perfect, so I buy a Lumagen to solve these issues.
SYC |
HTPC with ATI can not do RGB Gamma in overlay/pdvd |
I just use a Box1020 and call it a day
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SYC
Joined: 16 May 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:04 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Arno P]
HTPC with ATI can not do RGB Gamma in overlay/pdvd [/quote]
Thnaks for mentioning what I missed.
SYC
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