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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 1:47 am Post subject: |
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Dave runs 1080i 72hz, as far as I know. I used to run 1080i 72hz, but moved to 1080i 96hz with the XG LC.
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benareeno
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 1614
Location: ottawa, canada
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:05 am Post subject: |
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I thought the 10PG was capable of 1080p though...not that it matters much to me.
If it is, will that raise it's temps a lot?
Ben
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benareeno
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 1614
Location: ottawa, canada
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:06 am Post subject: |
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isn't 1080i 96Hz the exact same thing as 1080P 48Hz? At least in terms of scanrate...?
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benareeno
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 1614
Location: ottawa, canada
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:10 am Post subject: |
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Previous poster mentions that windows desktop looks poor at 1080i/60...I could really care less about this. We all should be evaluating our picture with video content and not test patterns and/or windows desktops.
I want the best possible pic and the least amount of stress for the projector...I really don't care about my windows desktop.
I also will use a 2.35 setup...which means I could run something like 1920x800 or whatever the 2.35 res would be...and then use 48Hz. I really love using 48Hz, total movie theater feel. Some minor flicker on the odd scene, but the motion is silky smooth.
Ben
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:15 am Post subject: |
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If you are going 2.25:1, I would run 1920x816p at 72hz. Smooth motion, no field lines, no flicker.
Add some more fans to control the heat, and pickup a PG for spares (or two Pluses and upgrade it).
Wish there were some 10PG's here...
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 5:14 am Post subject: |
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Hell this thread almost makes me want to buy a 10PG. Does anyone have one for sale?
Don't worry Mark, there aren't a lot in the states either. It is pretty slim pickings.
Tin,
I find your comments about 1080i interesting and funny. I am one who has no problem with scanlines. A friend has a large RPTV doing 480i and it doesn't bother me. What I find funny is that the 10 uses a 9" tube. I know a lot of people have complained that 1080i looks like crap, because of the pronounced scanlines on the bigger tube. I haven't seen 1080i on a 9" tube, so is it that big of a deal?
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deronmoped
Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 1154
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 6:19 am Post subject: |
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One of the fan mods I did to my 10PG was to add a couple of small fans to the defection board heat sink. It runs real hot with the image at full width, even hotter if you push the image width beyond what stock is. I run the fans real slow to keep them quite, cools the heat sink down nicely even at the slower speed.
At 960P the scan lines are easy to see on the face of the tube of my PJ. If I was to guess, looking at the face of the tube I could easily go over 1080P and still have plenty of room for more lines. I do have the image maxed out on the face of the tube though, well beyond maxed out really 
Deron.
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kschmit2
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1141
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 8:30 am Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | Scan rates and also poor setup. The projector needs to be set up mechanically as perfect as possible. This reduces the amount of electrical correction needed. Less correction = less energy = less heat. Poor setup is the biggest cause of failure, however.
Marc |
IMHO it's mostly poor setup. And that includes the way the PJ is physically mounted. If you only use the ceiling mount bolted directly to the ceiling, then temperatures will build up significantly, but if you lower that ceiling mount at least 8-10 inches, then there will be enough clearance to ensure proper airflow and cooling.
I have the ceiling mount lowered approx. 12 inches (using a shortened Sony PSS-10.
The exhaust temps of my 6PG Plus barely exceed ambient temps even after several hours of use and I'm running it at 1080i96 (approx. 56-57 kHz). Convergence is spot on right from the beginning until shutting it down.
Kai
Last edited by kschmit2 on Mon Jan 14, 2008 5:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kschmit2
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1141
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 8:36 am Post subject: |
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| benareeno wrote: | | isn't 1080i 96Hz the exact same thing as 1080P 48Hz? At least in terms of scanrate...? |
yes, it is.
Flicker is much less of a problem though.
Scanline visibility would be a problem if your screen is either too big or you sit too close (1x screen width or so) to it.
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Spanky Ham wrote: | Hell this thread almost makes me want to buy a 10PG. Does anyone have one for sale?
Don't worry Mark, there aren't a lot in the states either. It is pretty slim pickings.
Tin,
I find your comments about 1080i interesting and funny. I am one who has no problem with scanlines. A friend has a large RPTV doing 480i and it doesn't bother me. What I find funny is that the 10 uses a 9" tube. I know a lot of people have complained that 1080i looks like crap, because of the pronounced scanlines on the bigger tube. I haven't seen 1080i on a 9" tube, so is it that big of a deal? |
The PG10 is an underrated projector. AND not that many were built. But it's quite capable, and the COLORS...maaaaan.....
The Colors are just spot-on.
Yeah, I can see the scan lines at 1080i. But much like a TV, you really only "see" them when you look at them instead of the movie playing. I always maintain that some people spend too much time over-analyzing their setup and not enough time just watching movies.
Personally I am waiting for HD content that exceeds reality. How many will rush out to have their eyes upgraded????
Anyhow..... Oh, yes... my convergence IS dead-on from start to finish. My original PG9 was pretty good, and it took me a while to get it that way, but THIS one is just there. I'm impressed.
Marc
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 3:33 am Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | | Spanky Ham wrote: | Hell this thread almost makes me want to buy a 10PG. Does anyone have one for sale?
Don't worry Mark, there aren't a lot in the states either. It is pretty slim pickings.
Tin,
I find your comments about 1080i interesting and funny. I am one who has no problem with scanlines. A friend has a large RPTV doing 480i and it doesn't bother me. What I find funny is that the 10 uses a 9" tube. I know a lot of people have complained that 1080i looks like crap, because of the pronounced scanlines on the bigger tube. I haven't seen 1080i on a 9" tube, so is it that big of a deal? |
The PG10 is an underrated projector. AND not that many were built. But it's quite capable, and the COLORS...maaaaan.....
The Colors are just spot-on.
Yeah, I can see the scan lines at 1080i. But much like a TV, you really only "see" them when you look at them instead of the movie playing. I always maintain that some people spend too much time over-analyzing their setup and not enough time just watching movies.
Marc |
LOL, don't tell anyone here that they need to just watch their pjs more. I hope Brian Feldman doesn't get mad at me. I was over at his place looking at his new G90 last year. It had been calibrated by Roger Galvin. He was saying that he didn't see the big improvement everyone was talking about as compared to his XG135LC. I didn't see a back to back so I can't comment. to much. The picture did look nice, but I am not sure it is the massive jump everyone says it is. Before anyone says anything it was HD content run through a Lumagen. I think I remember talking to Scott once about scaling and he just laughed. Being happy with 1080i and 720p is one of the reasons I never felt the burning need for a 9" pj.
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 3:57 am Post subject: |
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Umm, yeah. I'm quite familiar with a well set up G90 and it sure is brighter. It's a bit more detailed, and has more "pop" due, I guess, to better ANSI contrast, but an 8"LC is pretty close.
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deronmoped
Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 1154
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:22 am Post subject: |
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It would help if people included screen sizes and viewing distances when they are making judgment calls. On smaller screen sizes it's not going to be as big of a difference. I did see a G90 on a screen the same size as what my 10PG was projecting on. The desktop was sharper, video I would need to do a side by side to see the differance. Both PJ's were about the same brightness. The G90 was projecting onto a wall, my 10PG was projecting onto a High Power, I do have the contrast turned down though.
Mark
I would think all 9" PJ's would have the same ANSI contrast, is not the optics that make the difference?
Deron.
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:23 am Post subject: |
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| deronmoped wrote: |
Mark
I would think all 9" PJ's would have the same ANSI contrast, is not the optics that make the difference?
Deron. |
Yes, I would think so. The theory I heard was from Azzad. Spillover from light-to-dark would be roughly the same size for an 8" and 9" tube, so proportionally it is effect smaller for a 9" tube, increasing ANSI contrast.
If I had a fully functioning 10PG, with good tubes, fitted with PG plus internals, and a spare PG Plus for bits, I wouldn't be worried about a G90
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:11 am Post subject: |
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| Mark_A_W wrote: | | deronmoped wrote: |
Mark
I would think all 9" PJ's would have the same ANSI contrast, is not the optics that make the difference?
Deron. |
Yes, I would think so. The theory I heard was from Azzad. Spillover from light-to-dark would be roughly the same size for an 8" and 9" tube, so proportionally it is effect smaller for a 9" tube, increasing ANSI contrast.
If I had a fully functioning 10PG, with good tubes, fitted with PG plus internals, and a spare PG Plus for bits, I wouldn't be worried about a G90 |
Yep, that's me. Not worried at all. 
Marc
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