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Spotmatic
Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 531
Location: Gelderland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:43 pm Post subject: Anyone ever used the Gefen HD Mate Scaler? |
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I have seen a few references to the cheap Gefen HD Mate Scaler on this forum. There are also the equally cheap Home Theater Scaler and Home Theater Plus Scaler. Is there anyone who has used one of these on his CRT?
Spec-wise, it looks good:
Features:
Both digital and analog inputs are format converted and pixel re-scaled through the HD Mate Scaler. It outputs a large range of formats and resolutions that will easily match the native resolution/ format of your display to ensure highest picture quality.
DVI/HDCP compliant input: Operates up to 165Mhz (Up to UXGA @60Hz)
Supports digital HD output up to 1080p.
Integrated 8-bit triple-ADC/PLL.
Integrated DVI/HDCP compliant receiver.
Dual high quality scaling engines.
Dual 3-D motion video adaptive de-interlacers with smooth low-angle edge.
Automatic 3:2 pull-down & 2:2 pull-down detection and recovery.
High performance frame rate conversion engine.
The Proprietary Advanced Color Engine technology gives: Brilliant and fresh color, Intensified contrast and details, Vivid skin tone, Sharp edge, Accurate and independent color control
3D noise reduction on analog inputs only.
Operates through on-screen OSD menu control and remote control.
DVI-I input and output accepts both analog and digital video
Aspect Ratio Control
Digital Audio Delay to match audio/video timing
Less then one frame delay allowing for gaming
Specifications:
Digital Video Amplifier Bandwidth: 1.65 Gbps
Component Video Bandwidth: 350 Mhz
Input DDC Signal: 5 volts p-p (TTL)
Input Video Signal: 1.2 volts p-p
Single Link Range: 1080p/1920 x 1200
Input/Output DVI Connector: DVI-I (29 pin) female
Component Video Connector: 3 RCA
Digital Audio Connector: optical TOSlink and coax SPDIF
Analog Audio Connector: mini-phone stereo 3.5mm
Power Supply: 5V DC
Power Consumption: 12 watts (max)
Dimensions: 6.875"W x 2.125"H x 6.875"D
Shipping Weight: 6 lbs.
http://www.gefen.com/kvm/product.jsp?prod_id=4173
What I would like to know if this is going to work with my PS3, connected to my BarcoReality 909. The 1080p output of the PS3 is great, but all other sources that are not 1080p are shown native. What I want is to upscale SD and 720p to 1080p, with timings that my 909 likes.
Anyone?
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paw
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: Arvada, CO
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| Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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Curt was looking into selling them at one point.
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Aubrey
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WanMan
Joined: 19 Mar 2006
Posts: 10270
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| Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:52 am Post subject: |
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What is it in your life that needs scaling outside of the source?
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Trust no one. Absolutely no one. Advice of the board.
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Spotmatic
Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 531
Location: Gelderland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:56 am Post subject: |
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| WanMan wrote: | | What is it in your life that needs scaling outside of the source? |
I don't understand your question?
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WanMan
Joined: 19 Mar 2006
Posts: 10270
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:26 am Post subject: |
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What sources will you be using--if you used this product--to scale? I guess I am putting myself in the shoes of a potential buyer for this product, but I fail to see how it would benefit me in the scaling department. I get HD natively from OTA (ATSC) and HD DVD and BD, pseudo-HD from DirecTV, etc.
For SD materials like regular DVD I playback from the A2/PS3, but outside of that I do not know what else there is. Oh yeah, I won't watch DirecTV half-SD.  So, that is how much of a value I am guessing it would apply to me, but what about you? You using a VCR, NTSC OTA tuner, watch a lot of analog SDTV?
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Trust no one. Absolutely no one. Advice of the board.
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Spotmatic
Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 531
Location: Gelderland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:45 am Post subject: |
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I only need a scaler to "fix" things that my PS3 does wrong.
- 1080p/60 works perfectly, no complaints here.
- 1080i/60: looks nice but I want this upscaled to 1080p/60.
- 720p (when gaming) looks bad: I cannot get the picture to fill the whole screen due to the BAD 720p timings.
- DVD upscaling: I'm in a PAL region so upscaling only goes to 1080p/50 with again BAD timings.
It seems a little ridiculous to me to buy a $2500 scaler to fix things that the PS3 should do better in the first place (it lacks a hardware upscaler, something the Xbox 360 does have). So that's why I asked about the cheaper Gefen scalers: will these be able to do what I want?
I'm not looking at other sources at this point: the scaler will only be used for the PS3.
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:20 am Post subject: |
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Hey Spot - these machines have been looked at on AVS but they didn't get a very good write up.
If you can extend your budget to around $1200 US, I've seen a Vantage HD with HQV go for that. If you can manage it, that's a brilliant VP that will really bring out the best in your system. Do you have a friendly dealer that you could approach to audition one? (If I had a spare one hear i would send it to you to try out)
They used to sell for around 3k but there have some really cheap ones going on Videogon
I'll keep an eye out for you if you want.
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yonexsp
Joined: 25 Apr 2006
Posts: 311
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| Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 4:45 am Post subject: |
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Does the Vantage have Gamma control?
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 10:10 am Post subject: |
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Extensive gamma correction available
If you want REALLY good gamma control, try out the Crystalio 2. You can correct low ire, high ire, "standard", s-shape or custom.
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 2:54 am Post subject: |
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First off, since you have a Barco Reality projector, would you be interested in adopting a 31 year old child? I'm house trained, well mannered, and get along with pets and children.
I needed to go HDMI to my projector and felt, for the price of an HDFury or Moomee card, I may as well spend a little more and get the scaler. I figured, even if it wasn't great, it was better then nothing. I wait forever to find someone who reviewed it, and as soon as I saw one, it was a good review so I pulled the trigger. Reviews still seem slim, which is big reason I am writing this.
I have the same model HD STB on my 60" CRT projection TV as I have on my RPS Marquee 8500 on a 110" screen, and the picture is night and day using component in on both. The smaller screen was not as sharp and showed more artifact, which is not what I expected. I was watching a standard def baseball game and there was a close up on 2nd base that I could clearly see insanely small clumps of dirt that up close were visible but fuzzy and full of artifact on my TV. I'm not saying you'll get more detail, but the detail that is there will be more visible thanks to the improved clarity.
I’ve never seen any of the more expensive ones, so I won't say it is as good as them, but, if you want an av switcher that improves your picture for a cheap price, you won't be disappointed. I'd be curious to hear how it compares to some of the IScans and Faroudja's if anyone has seen/used multiple.
One question I have is, does anyone know if the DVI out is encoded with HDCP? I haven't seen anything indicating it is, but I have half a mind to pick up a Blackmagic HDMI capture card so I can build a DVR with decent storage, and don't know if I'd be wasting my money if it is.
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 2:58 am Post subject: |
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On thing I forgot to mention that is kind of annoying, one button to switch inputs, so you have to toggle through each input, rather then 1 button to get you to DVD, STB, etc. If it is only for your PS3, may not be a big deal.
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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You don't want one of these. They are not very good and they don't do frame rate conversion. You definitely want to do frame rate conversion if you have a CRT--multiples of 24 is one of the perks of CRTs!!!
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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Welcome back Dave
You were sorely missed!
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:23 am Post subject: Huh |
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Dave,
This is straight off of Gefen's HD Scaler page:
"High performance frame rate conversion engine. "
Now, I can't say how high performance it would be for the money, but it does a darn good job for me.
-Angus
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:31 am Post subject: |
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Of course, I haven't joined the 9 inch lens club.
While I can't say anything bad about it(short of 1 dvi/hdcp capable input), hooking it up to a Reality 909 kind of seems like having a a surf and turf dinner with Jello for desert. However, it's perfect for my Marquee 8500. If anyone wants to "lend" me a 9" projector, I'd be more then happy to test it out. 
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 2:51 pm Post subject: Re: Huh |
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| Angus_rg wrote: | Dave,
This is straight off of Gefen's HD Scaler page:
"High performance frame rate conversion engine. "
Now, I can't say how high performance it would be for the money, but it does a darn good job for me.
-Angus |
Check the specs or ask them. It won't do 48, 72 or 96.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Huh |
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| Person99 wrote: |
Check the specs or ask them. It won't do 48, 72 or 96. |
Well, mine is set to 50, and my Marquee has no problem syncing. I'm sure you've got a nice expensive one which will blow it out of the water, however, for those who don't have the money, it will work, and it will look great in comparison to an unscaled.
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 3:26 pm Post subject: Re: Huh |
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| Angus_rg wrote: | | Person99 wrote: |
Check the specs or ask them. It won't do 48, 72 or 96. |
Well, mine is set to 50, and my Marquee has no problem syncing. |
50 is not 48 or 72. Unless you are in PAL land looking at SD, the movie has not been sped up to make 50 smooth.
| Angus_rg wrote: | | I'm sure you've got a nice expensive one which will blow it out of the water |
I've spent less on my theater than many have in their living room system, so don't be too sure.
| Angus_rg wrote: | | however, for those who don't have the money, it will work, and it will look great in comparison to an unscaled. |
Actually, I would advocate that most people don't need the scaler. For most people, there are only two sources that need to be scaled: DVDs, SD TV. SD TV looks so crappy on a PJ that many don't watch it. That only leaves DVDs. For that, a $200 HD DVD player will scale at least as good as the Gefen, so why waste money on the Gefen?
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: Huh |
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| Person99 wrote: |
50 is not 48 or 72. Unless you are in PAL land looking at SD, the movie has not been sped up to make 50 smooth. |
Maybe, but mine looks damn smooth and all I've gotten are raging compliments. Convergence could be better, but I can't fault the equipment for that.
| Person99 wrote: |
I've spent less on my theater than many have in their living room system, so don't be too sure.
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You're in a CRT forum. Cheapest projectors that blow away the best technology out there. I can buy that. Especially considering some of the living room setups I know, and the lack of DIY abilities most checkbook writing peoplpe have.
| Person99 wrote: |
Actually, I would advocate that most people don't need the scaler. For most people, there are only two sources that need to be scaled: DVDs, SD TV. SD TV looks so crappy on a PJ that many don't watch it. That only leaves DVDs. For that, a $200 HD DVD player will scale at least as good as the Gefen, so why waste money on the Gefen? |
I would agree with that. Most of what I watch is HD material. The only SD stuff I watch that isn't is baseball, and like I said, standing the same distance(not equivelant) from my 60" 1080i CRT TV with no scaler, the picture blows it out of the water. I've been meaning to put the scaler to the test against my xbox scaler with a movie with crapy video like Braveheart, I just never get around to it. My guess, they'd both be about the same, or close enough that you'd only tell side by side.
For me, it was a choice between an HD Mate or a HDFury, and I figured, eh, we'll try the fury. If I get to where I don't need it, I'll throw it on my TV upstairs. I'm happy with the decision.
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bobange
Joined: 10 Jan 2008
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 11:58 am Post subject: |
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Is there any settings for porch on the GEFEN ?
I use an HD-DVD player and, if with HD-DVD discs, it works just fine, it is not the case with DVD upscaled (the picture has not a good size). So, I'm looking for a cheap scaler that could correct the porch (this is a known problem for HD Pal and Sony PJ).
Boris
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