CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

deronmoped · Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1154 Location: San Diego

So after using a high gain silver DIY screen for a few years and doing a lot of research I have now ended up with a High Power screen.

When I first started to build my HT one thing big on my list was a super large screen. Now most people recommend much smaller screens then what I wanted. For most people this would be smart, it easier, less money, works better for most viewing environments.

To make a overly large screen work for me the way I decided to go was to build my theater around the screen, not build the theater then make a screen work in that environment. With the silver screen, I of course ceiling mounted the PJ, had to cut a hole in the rear wall as I could not get the PJ far enough back, blacked out the theater with black velvet, speaker position was not ideal, seating had to be as far back as I could get it. Now I was never completely happy with my 161" 16X9 curved silver 4+ gain DIY screen, do not get me wrong, it was awesome, it was just that I could never get the silver paint perfect. I got it real close to perfect, but when you want the screen to be invisible at all times in all images, you know how that goes. Not even manufactured screens are perfect, let alone the DIY screens.

So with my last attempt to paint a perfect screen, it came close, but with different problems. This is where I decided I was wasting a lot of time on my screen and started to look at other screen materials again. I liked the reviews on the HP, bright, disappears, hides flaws and you can clean it. The reason I did not go with it the first time around was, it was not as bright as the silver with the PJ ceiling mounted, could not get it seamless and $$$.

Well I made the decision to go with the HP and started to look into getting the material to build my own screen. I figured I could make a killer fixed screen cheap, wrong, Dalite wanted more for the material then what it would cost me for a electric screen, about twice as much. So I bought a 159" Cosmopolitan, it arrived without too much damage from shipping it. This thing was huge, I totally forgot to check to see if I could even get it in my theater, duh. Well it made it. I had to cut up my old fixed DIY curved drywall screen to get that out. Was pretty easy to install the electric screen, a couple of adjustable brackets, level and position the screen and hook up the electrical.

Now I have a 10PG CRT PJ and you will hear that a CRT will not take full advantage of what the HP has to offer, this can be true if you are locked into your PJ or seating locations. The HP is sold as having a viewing cone of 25 degrees which is pretty narrow. What I'm doing so I can work with this is, I've moved my PJ down off the ceiling to just over head banger height and now I working on moving the seats up. Right now the seats are still on the floor, my eyes are within 42" of the center of the tubes and the image is plenty bright. I could leave the seats where they are at and I would be totally happy, but it does get noticeably brighter as I get closer. It looks like you will see maximum brightness within two feet. Moving the seats up onto a platform actually works real good for me. What I'm going to do is build a platform that will act as a sub woofer/shaker, added backrest for floor seating for kids and get me into the the hot spot for brightness.

I really like this HP a lot, it's quite a bit brighter then my old silver screen, it's advertised as 2.8 gain in a 25 degree viewing cone, I thinking that this 2.8 gain must be measured at the edges of the 25 degree cone and it just goes up from there. The HP's brightness out past the viewing cone is not so bad, my old silver screen would drop off real quick, 3 seats wide is ideal seating, but adding more would be OK. The screen is absolutely invisible, I love this, this is what I could never get my old screen to do. The screen I got from Dalite has all kinds of waves in it, but you can not see them, other screens have to be perfect. I like the fact that I can clean the screen, as I know it will collect dust over the years. Having a roll up screen is another plus, protects the screen from those chocolate/oil covered fingers.

Deron.

drice1234 · Joined: 07 Oct 2006 Posts: 1309 Location: Allen, Texas

How about some pics and cost?
Thanks
Dan

Rdean · Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 258

Any pics yet?

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:14 am Post subject:

If I wanted to make an 70-80" 4:3 curved high power how would I go about it?

garyfritz · Joined: 08 Apr 2006 Posts: 12088 Location: Fort Collins, CO

You wouldn't. It doesn't make sense to curve a retro-reflective screen. Curving a screen works when you're using the screen as a reflective "lens," and that requires an angular-reflective surface.

Deron said he can't see the waves. That's because the angle of the screen doesn't affect the brightness. It just reflects the light back to the light source, like the surface on a stop sign. That's why you want your eyes to be as close as possible to the projector.

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:02 am Post subject:

Ahhh ok I think I got it now. I was thinking this material was like the old Sony 72" silver screens but it's more like a retro-reflective stop sign? I guess the optimal projector placement would be just slightly over your head or, can you just tilt the screen to get the angle you need?
Wouldn't that be easier then rasing the seats?

garyfritz · Joined: 08 Apr 2006 Posts: 12088 Location: Fort Collins, CO

Tilting the screen won't affect anything, any more than curving it would. The ONLY thing that affects brightness is the distance between your eyes and the light source.

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 2:02 am Post subject:

Hey Deron, I was reading an old post of yours at the other site where you said you were going to buy some 13.2 gain screen material. Did you ever buy it and if so what are your impressions?

We were playing with a Sony 1272 bounced off a mirror last night producing a 12 foot wide 4:2 picture. It looked pretty good considering the wall we were projection onto was dark toape (sp ) in color. I wonder if the highgain (13.2) would work at that size or would a retro reflective paint job help?

Just experimenting.

Fujifrontier · Joined: 20 Oct 2007 Posts: 354 Location: San Antonio, Texas

what if you could make a screen out of that 3M "super-duper-reflects-light-from-a-firefly's-ass" highpowered stuff they use on traffic signs :rofl:

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 2:59 am Post subject:

Read the above stuff carefully. That's essentially what the paint is used for originally.

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 7:08 am Post subject:

Finaly I had an epfaney efipany epipany...I under stand. For some reason the last time I read this thread I still wasn't getting it. I couldn't understand why you couldn't just tilt the screen. After all out CRT projectors have a built in projection angle.

I get it now. I was doing a little reading about retro reflective screens and I see what you guys were saying about the light traveling back to the source. I remember reading a post about a year ago on Google where the guy was slaming a high power because he had to stand up with his head just under the projector to see the picture. lol

I guess he didn't get it at first either. I've started a new thread. I need to make a small screen in my office to game on. 4:3, maybe 60-72" diagonal ??( Not sure how small a set of HD-6's can go. Both my D50 and my Runco 900 have the HD-6 lenses. ) I can rearange the room anyway I need it to accomidate this. I like gaming on the 4000G from the comfey chair in the theater but I game better at a desk.

deronmoped · Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1154 Location: San Diego

AnalogRocks

All I could ever get was a sample of the 13 gain stuff from Vutec, they would not sell the material. I would have gone with their screen, but it was super expensive (something like $2,500.00) and too small (I wanted 12' wide, their screen was a few feet short). The material was like a dull aluminum, super high gain, comparing to other samples of screens I had it was like 6 gain. The people that I have heard from love it and my experience with a silver screen had me thinking it would be really good for my application (ideal viewing angle limited to a couple of seats wide).

Dan

The 159" HP electric screen cost me $850.00 plus shipping. I though it was a good deal compared to other screens.

After using the screen for all this time my opinion of this screen has not changed. Still love it.

1) Even though it's a super large screen, I can run the PJ at a lower then stock contrast and the image looks of the correct brightness.

2) The screen just disappears, something that is real hard to get with both DIY and factory high gain screens using other materials.

3) The colors just pop, my silver screen was like that, I'm thinking high gain screens tend to pop the colors more, it might just have to do with having a bright enough image though.

4) I like the roll up feature, electric is a plus. Protects your investment, wows the audience.

5) The cost was a deal. I had so much time and money in materials into my DIY silver curved screen that I could have bought five of these.

6) With the screen being a done deal, I can focus on other things. The DIY screen was a fun challenge, kept me off the streets for a while and I learned a hell of a lot about painting.

There are a couple of downsides.

1) The screen color shifts. It's noticeable on a all white screen outside a three seat wide viewing angle. I do not notice it when I'm playing a movie, it's one of those things that you would have to pause the movie and walk back and forth to see.

2) For best viewing, the closer you are to being in line with the PJ the better. Some people are putting out the word that a HP does not work with a CRT. This is not true of course. Every screen has it's characteristics, you just need to know them and your application to see what is best for you.

Deron.

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Sat Jan 26, 2008 12:09 am Post subject:

Thanks Deron.

Wow $2500 for some silver material eh? Was it MADE of silver? Laughing

How big was the sample they had and what was thier maximum screen size ( width? ) I know it's a lot of cash but I can only go a maximum of 10 .5 feet wide with the throw distance in my room and 9.5 feet get's the projector out of the way of the balconey door.

Do you still have that sample laying around?

By the way is your screen 159" wide or diagonal? That sounds like a good size Thumbs Up

deronmoped · Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1154 Location: San Diego

I think the maximum width was about 100", (120" diagonal in 16X9). That is about eight feet wide, so it's not really all that big. With the small size and high gain, I can see why people like it, it was probably way too bright.

I still have the sample. If you would like to see what the material looks like, go grab the aluminum foil and look at the dull side. What they did was attach foil to a hard thick paper and then it's put onto a curved foam shape. One big problem with this stuff is one tiny dent, nick... and you will see it in the image, it has to be perfect.

My screen is real close to 12' wide, 159" diagonal. Pretty much the biggest thing I could fit into my theater and still leave a little room for the speakers.

Deron.

Tom.W · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 6635

deronmoped · Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1154 Location: San Diego

Tom

The way Gary worded is right. The screen is retro-reflective, meaning that most of the light is redirected back to the PJ. This applies no mater how the screen is tilted, curved, has waves in the surface... This is a huge advantage with this screen material, it's super good at hiding defects and will keep any hot spotting from occurring. With high gain screens that are angular reflective, they have to be perfect or defects show up, they also hot spot, that is why people curve them, to spread the hot spot out over the whole surface.

Deron.

armstrr · Joined: 26 Mar 2006 Posts: 160

so where did you purchase your screen from...for that size, that's not a bad price at all.

Chad B · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 11 Location: ISF calibrator

Deron,

How far away do you sit from the screen? I'm thinking of using an 80" wide (92 diag) HP in a very small theater room. My eyes will probably be around 88-90" from the screen. I'm wondering if the color shift will be objectionable even on the sofa (the seating area is 75" wide). I want to compare your relative field of view to my tentative plans. I'm considering having the PJ sit on a shelf right behind the couch firing a foot or so over my head.

deronmoped · Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 1154 Location: San Diego

I got the screen from B&H Photo, was the best price I could find, much cheaper then other places.

I sit about 1.4 screen widths for the screen, sometimes I lay down in front of the screen and watch movies, that distance is a lot closer, like .9 screen widths away. Even at the closer viewing distance the image still looks very good, one nice thing about CRT, no visible pixels.

Deron.

crt projectors · Joined: 03 Oct 2007 Posts: 39

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