CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

Sonynut · Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 367 Location: Bradford,PA

Hello everyone! Just thought I'd share this with you all... not that it will surprise most of you I am sure... i've seen a few threads on here lately about how Ebay and Paypal suck, so heres my current story.

A little over a month ago, I sold a Sony 1251 on Ebay. I was as accurate as I could be in my description, showed screenshots, the displayed hour counter, a picture of the front of the machine lit up while projecting, everything(I also made sure to include that it has raster wear on the blue at 2462 hours). The buyer paid through Paypal, $183.49 for the projector, $120 for shipping. We mutually agreed that it would be better not to ship it, and use the $120 for ME to hand deliver it to his house..

So a few days later, I fire the projector up and make sure everything is running well, then load it late at night into the trunk of my car. The next day I drove to his house, and my fiance and i carried it into his livingroom and set it down, along with a CD of ALL the manuals, and references to here, AVS and everywhere I knew for him to turn to for info on the PJ.He wasn't home but his wife was.

He gets back home 5 days later and tries to power it up.. no go. Now I have NO idea what has happened to the projector in those 5 days, but he shares an interesting fact with me.. He wanted to get into the service menu, misread the manual, and instead held the ON button down as the machine continually clicked trying to shut itself down from the error. He tells me it is reading error 10(HV over)..

Now I have read about error 10 sometimes being caused by moisture, and thought it may have been hit by fog in my trunk overnight, although unlikely since the machine had 5 days to recover and "dry out" if so... So, being my first sale on Ebay, and not wanting trouble I offer to send him, at no extra cost, the front and rear HV Splitters(tested good), which in my experience have been the cause of error 10, plus a detailed(pics with fancy arrows and all) instruction CD with an outline and steps to replace these splitters properly. He agreed.

Now the last part of the outlined instructions said that if he has installed both splitters properly and it is still a no-go, he further damaged the projector by holding the power button while it was trying to protect itself. The outline only directed him there if he finished the process of installing BOTH, AND it still wouldn't run.

Well.... He tried the first splitter, it didn't power on, so he decided to read the whole thing, inluding the last part.. He got pissed, decided NOT to try the second splitter(most likely the faulty one) and file a dispute through Paypal..shirking on his own agreement to try both, and contact me if there was any further problems.. Evil or Very Mad

I even have offered if he pays me gas to take another 1251(I have 3 running projectors left, a 1251,1252, and 1272) to his house, and kill it by using it as a parts donor to make his run.. I have gone WAY out of my way to help this guy.....

Instead he gets nasty on paypal, swears in the resolution console, uses derogatory language towards me in there, demands his money back, and escalates the claim.. now it is in paypal's hands. Fortunately I had the chance to tell my detailed story(more detail than here) before he escalated. He even threatened me with negative feedback on Ebay in there(Reported to Ebay), and refuses to ship the projector back if he wins, saying I can come get it(Against Paypal policy).

..So now I am crossing my fingers and hoping for the best, and probably will NOT sell projectors on Ebay or using Paypal anymore.. just bad luck for me..

Sorry for the lengthy story, just trying to share it so any of you can see what can happen on Ebay/Paypal and use good judgment before selling on there. I am all ears if anyone had advice though Smile

papalek · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 1536 Location: Longs SC

I know how you feel.

That is why I have an Ampro 4200 setting in the corner of the room with perfect tubes. Sad

I am afraid to sell it on ebay. The buyer will either complain to PayPal about something and demand his money back or will try to stiff me with the shipping charges like the last one did. Shocked

He might even only want some money back or make me pay to ship it back to me which would not be cost effective and I would give in,just to keep my 100% feed back. Confused

betel · Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:13 pm Post subject:

What a lot trouble for $183.49. I occasional sell items on eBay and luckily I've never had a major issue. Not sure if it would matter in a dispute but I always put a disclaimer that the item is described accurate but sold as is. There's just to much chance someone will break the item after they receive it. There are people who will buy an item just to remove a part they need. Claim it arrived DOA and want a refund. Ebay is a crapshoot for both seller and buyer. As a buyer about the best you can do is study the feedback carefully. If you don't want to take a chance you should buy whatever you want new from a reputable dealer.

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Hey Papalek. How much do you want for that 4200? Thanks

oliverg · Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 11:00 pm Post subject:

I've only had 1 problem like that in 7 years. although I am seeing this trend increasing.

My way of handling it is to use the army's way of teaching.

Tell them what you are going to tell them: eg BUYER pays for shipping. Limited DOA warranty. Paypal = extra 3%. If warranty is invoked, buyer pays for shipping back

Tell them all the above again just reworded
Tell them what you told them - again!

You may still get people 'trying it on for size' but when PayPal eventually check your ad out, you will win the dispute.

In the OPs case, you certainly have gone way above and beyond - (and i salute you!!) - but did you cover all your bases in the ad?

Kind regards

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 8990 Location: Colorado

Just one thing that comes to mind for reading your story, and it's that i've had the most trouble with the very cheapest items. The guys buying fully re-tubed and modded projectors for around $3K are absolutley no problem, they're smart, do their homework, know WHAT they're buying and HOW to use it when it arrives. These buyer always mail back to say how awesome the picture is and how impressed they were with the items condition.
It's the guys who barely scraped up a few hundred bucks to buy a PJ that are ALWAYS trouble. To begin with they're losers,they're stupid and poor and they're poor because they're stupid. It's EVERYONE elses fault, heck if the world wasn't out to get them they're wouldn't be poor right? You can't reason with them, you can't tell your side of the story because there's only one side, THEY'RE side . I mean after all lets not forget who the victim is right?
I don't know what to tell you, I would make him drive up and return the PJ to you, then give him his money back. I would really surprised if PP sides with him, but if they do then tell them to F-off too. Mad

Sonynut · Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 367 Location: Bradford,PA

100% Feedback.. thats a concept I hope I can hold onto through this, and the reason i tried kissing this guy's ass against my better judgement.

This guy is a complete newbie, and knows nothing about these projectors.. he actually after reading the manual tried holding the power button down from an oiff state to try to get into the service menu Thumbs Down

. He seems to have a ton of money, but is a cheapskate. He complained about a fellow forum members price on an IFB-11 and transcoder.. Myself, i though the price was more than fair for the two. I don't see the buyer here on the forums yet, but i am waiting for him to come on here and try to ruin my rep here, since I provided him with links to resources, including here as I mentioned in my original post.

Oh I covered all my bases in the ad.. I listed the EXACT condition, showed the hour counter displayed, described the tube wear, and showed screenshots and all, including ones where the wear showed up. At the end it said "Item is sold AS-IS, in described condition."

If Paypal decides in his favor, they have told me on the phone that he has to prove that he got the projector back to me, and that the shipping cost does not get refunded. I just hope in that case that he doesnt ship it UPS or something and I get back a busted projector... Confused

oliverg · Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 5:55 am Post subject:

Sonynut · Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 367 Location: Bradford,PA

If I lose and the projector gets back to me busted up, I definitely won't accept it Mr. Green

.

By the way, he has also threatened a charge-back from his credit card if he loses.. Can't he lose his Paypal account for that?

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 3:27 pm Post subject:

Link him to this thread.. and site.. Wink

gcom007 · Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 10:28 pm Post subject:

wipron · Joined: 09 May 2006 Posts: 50 Location: Minnesota

When you dropped off the CRT, did you know he wasn't going to be there?

When you dropped it off, why didn't you "fire it up" and show his wife that it worked.

You could have also had his wife call him and you could have talked to him while it was up and running.

I believe this would have eliminated your problem.

Hindsight 20/20, I know, but that is what I would have done.

Sonynut · Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 367 Location: Bradford,PA

Good point.. unfortunately 20/20 hindsight is sometimes one of my specialties also. Actually, when my Fiance, kids and I got there, his wife was more concerned about sending us on our way back home than the projector. I had thought of firing it up so she could see, but didn't really get a chance with her rushing us along. I think I have enough on him to nail his ass anyhow, and with what has been said here, and over at avs in my sister thread, I am starting to worry alot less.

gcom007 · Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 3:23 am Post subject:

"Hindsight: it's like foresight without a future."

-Life as a House

Dave Lister · Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:57 am Post subject:

The bloke not being home and his wife rushing you out the door should have sent alarm bells ringing, obviously planned that way right from the start.

But again it is the old hindsight thing.

Sonynut · Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 367 Location: Bradford,PA

I didn't really think much of it at the time, since he works all over the place all week(some wire installation company). She did show us their "kid" though, lol. An 8 yr old male german shephard... I have been thinking that the dog may have actually pissed on the projector(if so thats one thing I WON'T be looking forward to if I get it back). This is one of the main reasons I included in the Paypal dispute that it sat in his house for 5 days before he powered it up.

Curt- He has links to here, and I am surprised he hasn't been here yet. I bet if he does get on here, this thread will get quite interesting.

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 8990 Location: Colorado

Sonynut · Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 367 Location: Bradford,PA

Well it seems I managed to get my point through to PayPal.. They actually decided in my favor Very Happy

It's too bad that a good 1251 seems to have went to the dumpster though... Sad

that's what the guy said he was going to do with it.. Mad

mack1 · Joined: 21 Mar 2006 Posts: 494 Location: SARNIA

For sale---one slightly used Sony 1251 projector low hours,and excellent working condition. Rolling Eyes

Just freshened up by the famed Rex at our West Koreon fasility.Small odor---barely noticable really---unable to deturmine cause hence the low low price of $1269.00 Wink

plus shipping.But due to the nature of electronics it is sold as is Mr. Green

All joking aside congrats on the victory Thumbs Up

oliverg · Posted: Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:25 am Post subject:

Indeed - one for the good guys Smile