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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 11:23 pm Post subject: Electrohome Marquee 8500 convergence drift |
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Hello my english is not so good 😂 But i have a Problem with my 8500 when i Change the contrast or tint the convergenc drift away and the tiny line go to big Lines ( Looks like the Focus poti on a Barco was not Right adjustment :/ Can anybudy help me ?
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Tim in Phoenix
Joined: 21 Oct 2006
Posts: 4409
Location: Phoenix
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| Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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Hello
Sounds more like a focus or stig correction problem than a convergence issue, can you put up some before/after pics?
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 12:38 am Post subject: |
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It could also be that your HVPS is bad, and the HV is changing as you change the contrast.
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 2:18 am Post subject: |
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depending on DOM, Stig Snap tech bulletin ?
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:29 am Post subject: |
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.... Its not only by changing contrast its drift's by contrast tint Volume brightness  i Hope the picture is good enough to See my Problem
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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Can a Low Buffer battery make this fail?
I have buy it Last week ... The seller Talk to me ist from his work an he Can not Say how its work or not . My First idea was put the tubes out an make Money 😱 So my wife Say sell the Barco Graphics 801s an install the flagshipp Marquee 👌
Marquee 8500 R10 / G10 / B10 < convergenc fail
Marquee 9000 R10 / G10 / B10 < Hv fail the tubes Flashs 3 Times and the hv Turns off ( and the bellows leaking )  but the Phosphor Looks new and have no Mask or Spot
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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is it consistent or does it "snap" back to normal occasionally?
This could be a number of issues, Focus board problem, Control Module/deflection processor issue, etc.
With power off , I would pop the cover off the Focus board (between Red and green tubes) and unplug the 3 white molex connectors (mark them for proper location). The machine will run no problem without focus board. Start machine
Then Ramp contrast up/down and see if problem is still there.
You can do the same for Convergence = back panel, center board (orange/brown wires)
and
Stigmator board behind red tube = (blue/purple wires).
The machine only needs Horizontal vertical boards plugged in to power up.
Just be 100% sure you plug boards back in correctly ( 4 pins to 4 pins, not 1 off to the side) , or you will blow that channel.
| Martin86 wrote: | | Can a Low Buffer battery make this fail? |
I have never seen this is 10 years of working on these machines.
| Martin86 wrote: | I have buy it Last week ... The seller Talk to me ist from his work an he Can not Say how its work or not . My First idea was put the tubes out an make Money 😱 So my wife Say sell the Barco Graphics 801s an install the flagshipp Marquee 👌
Marquee 8500 R10 / G10 / B10 < convergenc fail
Marquee 9000 R10 / G10 / B10 < Hv fail the tubes Flashs 3 Times and the hv Turns off ( and the bellows leaking ) but the Phosphor Looks new and have no Mask or Spot |
You can certainly combine the 2 and make a 9500.
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Dragan, I cool did not know that you can build a 9500 from a 8500 and 9000!
I will go to Layout view me exactly not that I'm making a mistake and causing a spot burn or harm others
which parts of the 9000 I need to get out of a 8500 to make 9500 (The 3 p19 ... with holder and the optic, there are no thomson tubes on the HV is 34, * Kv is that a problem?)
I'll go straight to the bench and see if I can narrow down the error!
Thanks for your help
I hof the google translated is to better understand how my bad english
Last edited by Martin86 on Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 8:45 pm Post subject: |
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As you wrote both machines have problems now. I'd suggest to nail down what's the problem with the 8500, then even out the 9000 to not spark, and once both machine working alone you can think about upgrading.
Basically you can swap every board between a 9000 and a 8500 and you should do this when upgrading it is quite straight forward. You can leave the chassis and the motherboards of 9000 (of course the 9" tubes and lenses too) alone.
Actually you can even use boards for troubleshooting back and forth, to narrow down the problem.
BTW, what is your mother language?
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Dragan, I've found the fault of, the idiot has connect the green confergenc on astig an the green astig on confergenc  that can not run ^^ the problem is fixed! and the image stable , note this is not a perfekt kalibratet confergenc  i think the green crt is not from this set ... the molex connector was wrong connectet an the ground wirer from the neckboard is not connectet to the chassi and hanging down to the bottom board ...
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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| gjaky wrote: | As you wrote both machines have problems now. I'd suggest to nail down what's the problem with the 8500, then even out the 9000 to not spark, and once both machine working alone you can think about upgrading.
Basically you can swap every board between a 9000 and a 8500 and you should do this when upgrading it is quite straight forward. You can leave the chassis and the motherboards of 9000 (of course the 9" tubes and lenses too) alone.
Actually you can even use boards for troubleshooting back and forth, to narrow down the problem.
BTW, what is your mother language? |
Ok my mother language is German ... The 8500 is Fixed i have found a molex connector from the green astig on the confergenc board and a green confergenc on the astig board ! im so happy ^^
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Martin86 wrote: | | Hi Dragan, I've found the fault of, the idiot has connect the green confergenc on astig an the green astig on confergenc that can not run ^^ the problem is fixed! and the image stable , note this is not a perfekt kalibratet confergenc . |
NICE 
Check your G2 settings, looks like there is a little too much Blue (or not enough Red drive). Push the # key until the all white screen comes up. If it's bluish, turn up red drive. If it's too Red, turn it down. Typical red drive for an unfiltered 8500 is around 27-29 .
( Utilities menu, service , pass-code 0901, color temperature, D6500K. )
| Martin86 wrote: | Hi Dragan, I cool did not know that you can build a 9500 from a 8500 and 9000!
I will go to Layout view me exactly not that I'm making a mistake and causing a spot burn or harm others
which parts of the 9000 I need to get out of a 8500 to make 9500 (The 3 p19 ... with holder and the optic, there are no thomson tubes on the HV is 34, * Kv is that a problem?) |
You want the 9000 to have Panasonic tubes, if they are Thompson tubes then a swap is probably not possible. I'm not sure, the Thompson tubed 9000's are really old and rare, not many made. They used the 34Kv power supply but there is a jumper inside the old power supply to make it crank out 40Kv which is what the Thompson tubes require.
All modern 8500/9500 used Panasonic tubes and 34.9Kv high voltage.
| Martin86 wrote: | | I hof the google translated is to better understand how my bad english |
it's ok, googLe Translate works pretty well
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 9:58 pm Post subject: |
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I have a sticker on the green tube found there is 03/29/95 ... So one of the later right? According curtpalme the Maruqee 9000 was 1995 replaced by the 9500 Lc, Yes G2 would be set up correctly, but the buffer battery is empty and start whenever the settings are lost. So first look for the battery and replace ...
currently it has 1673 with Crt´s on an 6 in Standby ... hmmm smells like a new car
which parts of the 9000 I need for the conversion?
Tube
Optics
Tube holder
Neckboards
New Bellows 
.....
.....
.....
.....
and what kind of marquee I get if I have the old tube from the 8500 to the 9000 chassi stick? a Maruquee 8000 or does that not then
_________________
Electrohome Marquee 8500 ( work's Fine )
Electrohome Marquee 9000 ( work's but bellows are leaking )
Barco 801s Graphics ( searching a blue tube without mask )
Barco 808s Graphics
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Martin86 wrote: | I have a sticker on the green tube found there is 03/29/95 ... So one of the later right? According curtpalme the Maruqee 9000 was 1995 replaced by the 9500 Lc, Yes G2 would be set up correctly, but the buffer battery is empty and start whenever the settings are lost. So first look for the battery and replace ...
currently it has 1673 with Crt´s on an 6 in Standby ... hmmm smells like a new car |
I don't know when Electrohome stopped supplying the old Thompson tubes. You can take off the plastic cover from any tube and look underneath for the label on the bell housing.
new batteries are still available, I believe it's a 3 volt renata
The other problem with the Thompson tubes other than the 40Kv high voltage is the video neck-boards on the back of the tube. They are not interchangeable as far as I can remember.
| Martin86 wrote: | which parts of the 9000 I need for the conversion?
Tube
Optics
Tube holder
Neckboards
New Bellows |
easiest thing would be to move the tubes, lenses, and upper - lower aluminum mounting plates to the 8500 chassis. Seems a waste to take the 8500 apart though since it's such low hours
| Martin86 wrote: | | and what kind of marquee I get if I have the old tube from the 8500 to the 9000 chassi stick? a Maruquee 8000 or does that not then |
yeah kind of a waste really. The 8000/9000 had no blue gamma tracking, the video chain is much, much lower electronic bandwidth , and it was 200 lumens lower light output due to 34KV vs. 34.9Kv high voltage. Reliability was not as good either due to the metal can transistors on the video neck-boards. Even the high voltage splitter was re-designed in 1995 for lower noise.
If the 9000 is set for 40Kv then do NOT put the 8500 tubes in there, you could make an X-ray machine. there's some info about halfway down this page
http://www.curtpalme.com/ElectrohomeMarquee_Downloads.shtm
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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:43 pm Post subject: |
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Only the very early Marquee 9000 had the Thomson tubes, at 1995 they used P19LCPs already, there is a very good chance that even the video boards equipped with HFA1100 opamps already so they are not that bad after all, although newer boards used in the 8500 indeed better.
Dragan, the blue gamma isn't big deal, I hear Mike Parker is eliminating it in his newer mods...
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:29 pm Post subject: |
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Hello
has the marquee 9000 same stigmator board as the marquee 8500?
I After a review found that have the marquee 8500 and 9000 the same stigmator boards
in the setup and layout for marquee standing only the 8500 has this board?
See > http://www.curtpalme.com/images/Marquee_image03.jpg
I am so confused
it is possible on the basis of the components to tell whether it is a 9000 or a converted 9500?
I've modifications found on the neckboards (extra resistors and capacitors)
which are tubes of Panasonic and have minimal Masks 8.5 thus still for many hours well
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_________________
Electrohome Marquee 8500 ( work's Fine )
Electrohome Marquee 9000 ( work's but bellows are leaking )
Barco 801s Graphics ( searching a blue tube without mask )
Barco 808s Graphics
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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It looks like your 8500 has 8000 parts. The Astig board and Convergence board with the large Connectors that mate them together are from an 8000/9000 Marquee. Those neck boards may be older 8000 as well with a bunch of the tech updates done to them.
We would need to have abetter picture of the boards. Especially the HDM between the Green and blue tube. If you can pull it out does it have a metal box on the HDM anywhere? If it does its from an older 8000/9000 and will over heat when you try to do 1080p.
And those bellows do need to be changed, I have the ones you need to do a proper repair .
Athanasios
_________________
Don't blame your underwear for your crooked ass~ unknown Greek philosopher
"Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the Democrats believe every day is April 15." --- President Reagan
One Smart Dog!!!
Marquee High Performance Bellows now shipping!!
Marquee Modifications and Performance Enhancement
Marquee C-element and Bellow removal
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Martin86
Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 31
Location: Germany / Nuremberg
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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Hello
The Maruqee 8500 can break when I run it with a HDFury II at 1080P?
good to know! Customised because I played 3 hours yesterday with the Xbox One an the Hdfury Luckily nothing happened
i go to my workbench an make some pictures ... so slowly I think it was not a good idea to buy the two marquee ...
_________________
Electrohome Marquee 8500 ( work's Fine )
Electrohome Marquee 9000 ( work's but bellows are leaking )
Barco 801s Graphics ( searching a blue tube without mask )
Barco 808s Graphics
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 11:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Martin86 wrote: | Hello
The Maruqee 8500 can break when I run it with a HDFury II at 1080P?
good to know! Customised because I played 3 hours yesterday with the Xbox One an the Hdfury Luckily nothing happened
i go to my workbench an make some pictures ... so slowly I think it was not a good idea to buy the two marquee ... |
It may over heat only if your HDM is the old style. Newer HDM's will do 1080p fine.
Nacho
_________________
Don't blame your underwear for your crooked ass~ unknown Greek philosopher
"Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the Democrats believe every day is April 15." --- President Reagan
One Smart Dog!!!
Marquee High Performance Bellows now shipping!!
Marquee Modifications and Performance Enhancement
Marquee C-element and Bellow removal
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:17 am Post subject: |
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| Nashou66 wrote: | | It looks like your 8500 has 8000 parts. Athanasios |
it's 2 machines Nash, 8500 and 9000
| Martin86 wrote: | Hello
has the marquee 9000 same stigmator board as the marquee 8500?
I After a review found that have the marquee 8500 and 9000 the same stigmator boards
in the setup and layout for marquee standing only the 8500 has this board? |
9000 had it, and 8500/9500 , did not come on 8000 or 8110
| Martin86 wrote: | it is possible on the basis of the components to tell whether it is a 9000 or a converted 9500?
I've modifications found on the neckboards (extra resistors and capacitors) |
those exrea blue capacitors are not modifications, they're factory fixes to design errors. All this stuff was fixed permanently on 8500/9500.
| Martin86 wrote: | | which are tubes of Panasonic and have minimal Masks 8.5 thus still for many hours well |
yes, P19LCP is a Panasonic tube, but I see a lot of Glycol leaking. I would not put those in the 8500 chassis in that condition.
The 8500 will do 1080P all day but is sharper at 720P or 1440 x 810P = exactly 75% of 1080P on the smaller 8 inch tubes.
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