|
As this forum is rarely used anymore, we've locked it. Feel free to browse and read. Questions? Please reach out to us directly. Cheers! |
|
 |
|
|
| Author |
Message |
ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:45 am Post subject: |
|
|
| redfox001 wrote: | | I will really be convinced when I see the same uhd in 2060p and downscaled to 1080p and then sharpened to 2060p. Especially that last step is important for the question if uhd holds more sharpness or detail that we can not get otherwise. |
There is no doubt in my mind that native UHD will look noticeably superior to the same signal scaled to 1080p and sharpened, whether it's scaled back up to 2160p or not. Once the resolution is gone, it's gone. UHD will no doubt look superior to 1080p even on a 1080p display.
SC
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| redfox001 wrote: | | The first UHD Blu-rays will probable use rec709 This is because they have to pay license costs for using rec2020 and there are practical no displays supporting it yet. The UHD Blu-ray spec allows for rec709. Likely it is not going to be rec2020 at all but p3 in the future. |
This doesn't seem plausible. I could be wrong I suppose, but I'm not aware of any licensing specifically for Rec.2020 that isn't already covered by UHD-BD licensing. If a studio doesn't use Rec.2020, I think it'll just be because their productiom pipeline won't handle it (most likely at acquisition or in post) - not because of licensing.
Cheers,
SC
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
| redfox001 wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | The difference between 1080p and UHD is clearly visible on large screens. |
But how did you see it with what material? I tested with Netflix and not in this case. |
I can clearly see the difference on a 28", but it could be a better set than your TV if youre not seeing it.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ecrabb wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | I will really be convinced when I see the same uhd in 2060p and downscaled to 1080p and then sharpened to 2060p. Especially that last step is important for the question if uhd holds more sharpness or detail that we can not get otherwise. |
There is no doubt in my mind that native UHD will look noticeably superior to the same signal scaled to 1080p and sharpened, whether it's scaled back up to 2160p or not. Once the resolution is gone, it's gone. UHD will no doubt look superior to 1080p even on a 1080p display.
SC |
Exactly
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ecrabb wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | The first UHD Blu-rays will probable use rec709 This is because they have to pay license costs for using rec2020 and there are practical no displays supporting it yet. The UHD Blu-ray spec allows for rec709. Likely it is not going to be rec2020 at all but p3 in the future. |
This doesn't seem plausible. I could be wrong I suppose, but I'm not aware of any licensing specifically for Rec.2020 that isn't already covered by UHD-BD licensing. If a studio doesn't use Rec.2020, I think it'll just be because their productiom pipeline won't handle it (most likely at acquisition or in post) - not because of licensing.
Cheers,
SC |
Possible I just read that they have to pay for rec709 and again for rec 2020 option but I do not know either. We wait and see. I asked the person that told this to explain.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
Last edited by redfox001 on Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:58 am; edited 2 times in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | The difference between 1080p and UHD is clearly visible on large screens. |
But how did you see it with what material? I tested with Netflix and not in this case. |
I can clearly see the difference on a 28", but it could be a better set than your TV if youre not seeing it. |
Sure I do not have the superior equipment you have like that cine max that does 200 MHz 
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ecrabb wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | I will really be convinced when I see the same uhd in 2060p and downscaled to 1080p and then sharpened to 2060p. Especially that last step is important for the question if uhd holds more sharpness or detail that we can not get otherwise. |
There is no doubt in my mind that native UHD will look noticeably superior to the same signal scaled to 1080p and sharpened, whether it's scaled back up to 2160p or not. Once the resolution is gone, it's gone. UHD will no doubt look superior to 1080p even on a 1080p display.
SC |
There is no doubt in your mind that it allways looks sharper even at 10 meter distance? I think they call that religion
I clearly demonstrated that that was not the case while I believed that too. It seems reasonable.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| redfox001 wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | The difference between 1080p and UHD is clearly visible on large screens. |
But how did you see it with what material? I tested with Netflix and not in this case. |
I can clearly see the difference on a 28", but it could be a better set than your TV if youre not seeing it. |
Sure I do not have the superior equipment you have like that cine max that does 200 MHz |
I dont have a Cine 9 that does that, but i have a UHD monitor with display port, i doubt your TV has that, or does 3840x2160 at 60Hz
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | The difference between 1080p and UHD is clearly visible on large screens. |
But how did you see it with what material? I tested with Netflix and not in this case. |
I can clearly see the difference on a 28", but it could be a better set than your TV if youre not seeing it. |
Sure I do not have the superior equipment you have like that cine max that does 200 MHz |
I dont have a Cine 9 that does that, but i have a UHD monitor with display port, i doubt your TV has that, or does 3840x2160 at 60Hz |
Well make some screenshots or are you depressed again?
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
This is the UHD version Sony with HDMI 2.0 using USB 2.0
 Untitled by Radio Head, on Flickr
This is the Marquee without any sharpening. I will try some sharpening on this shot soon. Yes there is a difference, look at the dress but it is small.
 Untitled by Radio Head, on Flickr
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Till 2018 the only thing we are going to get is higher resolution and 10 bit video. I really hope Moome can handle this 10 bit video as pure video.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Ok last contribution and I have seen it. On a dutch forum they demoed the new 4k projectors with 4k material and someone said this
| Quote: |
We then we watched with 4k material.
What was immediately noticed that the difference is not as great as you might expect if you compare a native 4k panel and e-shift paper.
Apparently, the resolution already so high for this screen (100 ") that it does not stand out. I find it shocking that the difference is so small, but I see the aforementioned differences that Sony something filmic and the JVC is a bit harder.
|
Than they demoed rec2020 and he said
| Quote: |
Finally some HDR scenes seen on the X7000.
This is used so the larger color space, and the X7000 has an even larger color space than the X5000.
What is striking here is that I immediately thought what a supersaturated generated fake colors (ala MediaMarkt TV demos) but that's just getting used to because you've never had this color space (except in real life then).
Well here we really still have to go some to hear in the future if there is going to come from many films. A new world opens, it will get used for some film purists.
|
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
|
| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| redfox001 wrote: | | Good chance UHD blu ray is a dead duck. The masses will never go that way. They might have an UHD tv but probable will not buy the UHD blu ray player untill it is very very cheap. |
The market's all going to streaming. Convenience is winning out (unfortunately) which means lower bandwidth to get things like 4K Netflix.
I'm not saying that they couldn't do less compression via streaming with today's technology, they just choose not to.
| Quote: | | I had netflix for two months but found the quality unacceptable compared to downloads. Same show in vlc player downloaded looked much better. |
It's fine for most things even on my large screen but I agree it's not quite as good. Anyone with a smaller TV and/or isn't as fussy, they won't care or notice the difference. Hence the reason why streaming is winning. It's just so much more convenient.
Sony PS5 rumours mention the possibility of no optical disc capabilities at all. I would hate that but wouldn't be at all surprised.
Kal
_________________
Support our site by using our affiliate links. We thank you!
My basement/HT/bar/brewery build 2.0
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
| redfox001 wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | The difference between 1080p and UHD is clearly visible on large screens. |
But how did you see it with what material? I tested with Netflix and not in this case. |
I can clearly see the difference on a 28", but it could be a better set than your TV if youre not seeing it. |
Sure I do not have the superior equipment you have like that cine max that does 200 MHz |
I dont have a Cine 9 that does that, but i have a UHD monitor with display port, i doubt your TV has that, or does 3840x2160 at 60Hz |
Well make some screenshots or are you depressed again? |
Honestly, why the f*** would i bother? I have an iphone 5 camera, and it doesnt even go close to showing what is seen on screen. Whats the point? No one cares about screen shots from a computer monitor or small screen television taken with an iphone. I may as well dig out my old 15" 1024x768 LCD and take some shots of that, itll look about the same as anything else.
As for depressed... That is about the dumbest f***en thing ive ever heard from you Tjeerd, and i think youd do really good to give some serious thought to what you say in future. Saying such things to the wrong person just may push them over the edge.
Not sure exactly who you think you are, but coming from someone like you that backflips all over the place blaming others because you chose to purchase items you were told not to buy, speaking on behalf of others trying to claim they also wasted money on my word only to have them also state youre incorrect, to claiming my pics were fake because you didnt have the ability or skills to reproduce simular results, only to back up on that and then claim theyre clearly not fake because yes, that sharpness is infact easy to get....
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
On that note, i will now leave this forum.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
Oh man you are backstabbing me all the time Curt read what you wrote on the repair forum as we happened to be talking at that moment, all slandering lies to make him think bad about me. In private in my face it is Good morning and friendliness but than i read an old thread where you are burning me again and again. I helped you with lots of stuff and send you pictures but a simple thank you? No way. Have a nice life.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | On that note, i will now leave this forum. |
Oh no!!! Please don't 
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 1640
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
That means our CRT are good till 2018 
_________________
Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 2:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ElTopo wrote: | | That means our CRT are good till 2018 |
Yes and that is if UHD blu-ray will survive at all. I spoke surprisingly many people that do like Kal not think the optical disk will make it. But it will lead to better streaming solutions possible.
@Casey time to burry the hatched? I looked on my retina laptop (almost UHD) and when you are very close to the screen UHD looks better. That is what you said too.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
Forum powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
|
|
