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K-L-O
Joined: 04 Jun 2007
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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Thank You guys for all the interest and suggestions.
I've been testing the set for most part of the day with poor results.
Answering Curt's question:
I've tried with my HTPC connected directly to the Max by a VGA-RBGHV cable.
Tested all possible standard resolutions from 800x600@60hz to 1920x1080@60hz - no picture.
The Cinemax reports every frequency change correctly and promptly but the tubes remains pitch black (no video). You would expect a text saying "source not available" but it never arrived too.
It seems my Barco believes video is running correctly. I'm hating this baby 
I have a questions to the experts: Is it an issue that can be confined to the video cards or the Controller may be part of the problem too? As I understand the controller is still quite expensive.
To RedFox[b]
I'm starting to belive mine is a brother of yours...
going deeply into the chassis I just discovered it has a female power cable (back left part of the chassis). I guess it has been used to power up a second device close to the projector. Redfox's and Case's Cinemax seem modded by the same person.
Now... who with a healthy mind would convert such a high-end machine into a power line splitter ?
Things like that makes me very angry, even more when can just a use a 10 Euros Ac power socket instead.
Some people should not be allowed to put their hands on good toys 
[/b]
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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Did you check the leds on the vertical board and on the switcher? If no vertical sync the led is red. The switcher should have a led according to the input used if I remember well. That way you can be sure that you have a sync.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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My guess is that something on the switcher is muting the video. I do not think it is the rgb driver because all three colours are off. So if you have a sync and no video not even a single colour the switcher might be bad.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Curt Palme wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | The only way I could get something to sync with my Max was to use a t connector on h and v sync but often rgbhv would just not sync. The hdfury 2 worked with a power supply only. Your rgbhv source needs to be set to positive sync if I remember well. On the fury the sync should be positive too did you play with that? You can put in a 808s input board if you have a spare. Think 1209 works too. The driver is not compatible. |
Ive never ever struck that with mine at all. It would take both positive and negative sync, combined sync, seperate sync, and whatever else i tried. It all worked. |
I agree. The set does look to be modded to some degree.. Barco doesn't use wire ties for the fan wiring, and the board isn't in a place that I've seen before, and I've had maybe 50 Barco 909 sets (and similar versions) though here, and have never seen that. Still, that doesn't affect the video signal and sync. Run a laptop VGA output into the set to see what happens. |
Well firstly, these are CineMAX, not 909s, and they are not exactly the same. There are quite a few differences between my CineMAX and my 909, and the wires are indeed tied up in some places.
But yep, they should sync to everything within range.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Hulio wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | Perhaps the fancontroll is part of the mainboard? |
Nope. Definitely not on the mainboard. The left rear fan should be connected to a similar speed regulator like the one in the convergence tray. And that regulator is connected with the mainboard.
Look at that metal plate behind the fans: the holes for the board and the mains filter are there.
Your machines were moded guys. Here the schematics of the new fan circuit from Cine 9.
Aside, like Curt said, this doesn't have anything to do with the problem of the topic starter. He should get a picture. |
Nope, they were not modded buddy, mine sure as sh*t wasnt, there is no holes there for anything extra, there is absolutely ZERO evidence of things being moved in my set, and there is ZERO evidence to suggest any fan controller was removed.
There is no second fan controller connection on my mainboard either. They cantve been so amazing they removed that and the copper tracks leading to it.
These are CineMAX, not Cine 9. Electrically the same in terms of basic function, however CLEARLY not physically the same.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:43 pm Post subject: |
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| redfox001 wrote: | Thanks for the schematic. First thing I notice is that the board is made around the AD7416 (digital temp sensor) that can be bought for 3 euro on ebay.
Second thing is that reading the schematic I see indeed that this board is used on the rear but the connection to the controller is not there. In the tray there is a connection to the controller. So I am wondering what the board does on the rear without being read by the controller? The fan sense pin is read by the controller in both cases with or without the extra board.
Do you have a detailed schematic of the board itself?
It seems that in the tray the board is giving temp vallues to the controller. In the rear it is not read but it still regulates the fans I guess. That makes me think that the regulation is not done by the controller and that the read vallues are just to alarm the user.
If so than this board can operate without the controller and the only difference is that the user will not know the temp or get a warning. In the case of a fail the controller will know and shut down.
I think I will look at the board tomorrow to know for sure if it can regulate the fans without the controller. If so we can build it into a 909 regardless of the software and still have less fan noise.
(by the way in the rear it only regulates one fan close to the RGB driver) |
The fan speed of the front fans in my set was regulated with or without the fan board in the tray, only the correct software was required on the controller.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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| K-L-O wrote: | Thank You guys for all the interest and suggestions.
I've been testing the set for most part of the day with poor results.
Answering Curt's question:
I've tried with my HTPC connected directly to the Max by a VGA-RBGHV cable.
Tested all possible standard resolutions from 800x600@60hz to 1920x1080@60hz - no picture.
The Cinemax reports every frequency change correctly and promptly but the tubes remains pitch black (no video). You would expect a text saying "source not available" but it never arrived too.
It seems my Barco believes video is running correctly. I'm hating this baby
I have a questions to the experts: Is it an issue that can be confined to the video cards or the Controller may be part of the problem too? As I understand the controller is still quite expensive.
To RedFox[b]
I'm starting to belive mine is a brother of yours...
going deeply into the chassis I just discovered it has a female power cable (back left part of the chassis). I guess it has been used to power up a second device close to the projector. Redfox's and Case's Cinemax seem modded by the same person.
Now... who with a healthy mind would convert such a high-end machine into a power line splitter ?
Things like that makes me very angry, even more when can just a use a 10 Euros Ac power socket instead.
Some people should not be allowed to put their hands on good toys
[/b] |
Mine has no evidence of any changes being made, apart from me fitting a non standard quad. Im in Australia.
So what youre using RGB-HV, have you tried pressing 5 again on the remote controller?
Is the cable connected between the switcher and the RGB board??
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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| redfox001 wrote: | | Did you check the leds on the vertical board and on the switcher? If no vertical sync the led is red. The switcher should have a led according to the input used if I remember well. That way you can be sure that you have a sync. |
Yep, it should have all that.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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| redfox001 wrote: | | My guess is that something on the switcher is muting the video. I do not think it is the rgb driver because all three colours are off. So if you have a sync and no video not even a single colour the switcher might be bad. |
Im wondering if the LIMO-PRO bypass wire is installed... Let me get a couple pics of how it should look with no LIMO-PRO in there.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:04 am Post subject: |
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Ok, have a look at these pics, anywhere you see a link connected, you should have one as well. Without it, you wont get an image.
A couple here:
This one is critical:
And this one here is critical in the event youre not using the LIMO-PRO, and yours is missing:
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:08 am Post subject: |
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See if you can get a pic of this screen too:
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:13 am Post subject: |
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Then get a pic of this sticker on the back of your set:
I believe Redfox is also in possesion of a very early model CineMAX.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:16 am Post subject: |
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Also make sure you press the TEXT button on the remote, if it says on screen 'text off', press it again.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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K-L-O
Joined: 04 Jun 2007
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:31 am Post subject: |
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Oh....
maybe We have something here, I have the sensation We are getting closer.
I had exactly the same feeling: video been muted.
At the beginning I looked for some kind of "mute" or "pause" function on the remote.
No red lights on the splitter Just green lights switching fine.
Most of the time I have the RGB green led on, changing to YPbPr (on the fly from the Ps3 menu) the splitter changes accordingly.
I'm not at home right now so I can't answer for sure, but I'm quite confident I have the jumpers in first picture. I have the RGB cable connection (your second picture). But... I think the third is missing, if I remember correctly I have just the connector to the controller board.
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K-L-O
Joined: 04 Jun 2007
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:38 am Post subject: |
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Just checked the pictures I uploaded, You can say from my 5th picture: the third jumper is definitely missing in my set.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 1:53 am Post subject: |
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Yeah mate, pull those two boards out and compare with mine. If that is missing, that will likely be your issue.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:00 am Post subject: |
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He I was checking my switcher and I am sad to say that I do not have those wires on my switcher.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:11 am Post subject: |
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| K-L-O wrote: |
[b]To RedFox[b]
I'm starting to belive mine is a brother of yours...
going deeply into the chassis I just discovered it has a female power cable (back left part of the chassis). I guess it has been used to power up a second device close to the projector. Redfox's and Case's Cinemax seem modded by the same person.
|
Hi K-L-O I also have a female power cable. I think it is used for the scaler that the seller used. I must say he splitted the mains cable on the right place before the filter and in my case it was done neatly and if I ever buy a scaler I might use it so I leave it there. In my case there is also a hdmi fitted to the rear and it is done very nice.
I know that when i just had my Cine max I had strange problems but that was because I used a hdmi input that was not perfect but worked in the end. It was a modified external moome. But once I knew I had to be patient and boot my source after the Max had booted it all turned out fine.
I am certain we will find your problem but do you have spares? A switcher from a 1209s could be fine just check the numbers and post.
This is how the scaler was fitted.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2257
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:48 am Post subject: |
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| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | Thanks for the schematic. First thing I notice is that the board is made around the AD7416 (digital temp sensor) that can be bought for 3 euro on ebay.
Second thing is that reading the schematic I see indeed that this board is used on the rear but the connection to the controller is not there. In the tray there is a connection to the controller. So I am wondering what the board does on the rear without being read by the controller? The fan sense pin is read by the controller in both cases with or without the extra board.
Do you have a detailed schematic of the board itself?
It seems that in the tray the board is giving temp vallues to the controller. In the rear it is not read but it still regulates the fans I guess. That makes me think that the regulation is not done by the controller and that the read vallues are just to alarm the user.
If so than this board can operate without the controller and the only difference is that the user will not know the temp or get a warning. In the case of a fail the controller will know and shut down.
I think I will look at the board tomorrow to know for sure if it can regulate the fans without the controller. If so we can build it into a 909 regardless of the software and still have less fan noise.
(by the way in the rear it only regulates one fan close to the RGB driver) |
The fan speed of the front fans in my set was regulated with or without the fan board in the tray, only the correct software was required on the controller. |
Yes and my rear fans are regulated too I have witnessed that many times guess I have the correct software. The only thing the board seems to do is to make a digital read of the temperature and give that to the controller but on the rear not even that is done. So I have no clue what the board is doing on the rear. Perhaps Hulio knows. I also can find no detailed schematics.
_________________
701s->runco933->8500ultra->cinemax->9500mp->919 splitpack + cinemax
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2015 11:20 am Post subject: |
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The little fan board in the front gives the temp readout, if i unplug it, or use my other tray without that board i dont have that in the options.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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