CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

**kal** · Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 3:04 pm Post subject:

Hi Erich,

Oops - cut and paste error on my part. Yes, the 120x25 ones are IXP-74-14. I fixed my two posts earlier in this thread.

I have pics for everything and want to put together the procedure sometime in the next few days. I 'developed' the photos last night (I shoot everything in RAW mode with my camera) and they're ready to go.

Here are some teasers that will give anyone enough info to go ahead if they want to start this now themselves:

When my 3 year old saw me taking pictures of my convergance tray, he ran to get his camera and took a bunch of shots too: Some of them turned out pretty well! Smile

Kal

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

No offense call, but that convergence tray set up looks dubious at best. Have you actually measured the airflow or the temp on the heatsinks?

Dave

**kal** · Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 4:32 pm Post subject:

Yep! I ran the projector for a few hours and yanked out the tray and did the old 'finger test' on all of the heat sinks. Everything other than the large STK on the left was cool (no apparent heat). The one on the left was warm.

Remember that I'm using a 120mm 72CFM fan here on an angle instead of the usual 80mm 38CFM one.

I'd feel better if I could find a quiet 80mm fan to fit in the front that wasn't noisy. Problem is that SilenX only makes 24CFM and 32CFM 80mm fans... and knowing them, they're probably pretty optimistic at that.

Anyone have any recommendations for quiet 80mm fans that are at least 40CFM? I'm not adverse to changing out my front fan as I do agree: Looking at the pics, it does seem a bit trailor-trashy. Not sure I want to put such instructions on the site...

Walter's idea. I blame him. Smile

Kal

UPDATE: SilenX makes a 42CFM fan that's 92mm (not 80mm). It *may* fit. I'll have to measure.

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

**kal** · Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 4:58 pm Post subject:

Another idea if you've got room: Put a lower 80mm CFM fan in the front of the projector and stick a reducer above the projector (assuming ceiling mounted) with a fan such that it sucks air out of the top holes. I may try that. An 80mm 32CFM fan in the front and put the 120mm on top. Push pull.

Kal

Alaric · Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:38 pm Post subject:

Hi There,

How much are the fans required if you do have a box with ducting and a 4" high power fan on it ????

eg http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technical/DataSheets/SolerPalou/TD.htm

TD160 @ 2-3M is 113m3/h

Ta,
Lee

**kal** · Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:57 pm Post subject:

You tell us Lee. Take a bunch of temp measurements and let us know.

Though if I do the math, 113 m3/h converts to only 66 CFM. That's not much considering that the 3 back fans on the Barco 808 are 80CFM max *each* plus the ~40 CFM fan in the convergence tray.

You'd also have to ensure that you *PULL* a lot of air over the problem spots that the 3 fans are addressing. For example, one of the 80CFM fans in the back is dedicated to only pulling air across the HORIZ SHIFT/FOCUS board!

You'd have to split out the air suction somehow and ensure you get similar airflow over that board, and then similar airflow over the HORIZ OUTPUT/VERTICAL boards and then another for the SMPS.

Kal

Alaric · Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 11:35 pm Post subject:

Hi There,

Hmmm i was expecting those big fans to shift some air, but so do those little ones. I'm looking at a fan like that to duct cool air in or suck it out....I'm not sure which is better as the box needs venting. I guess changing the small fans would also be good.

Not sure of a supply in the UK of those Slienx fans, they also don't seem particularly cheap for what i have found here.

BTW for calcs checkout convert....a simple free self contained exe which has most units built in :
http://joshmadison.net/software/convert/download.php

Cya,
Lee

**kal** · Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 8:21 pm Post subject:

I did some more temperature measurement tests last night.

Ambient room temp: 21C / 69.8F

Rear fans (3 x 120mm):

I've had a temp sensor installed permanently right behind the green CRT tube near the neckboard since I installed this projector. I use it to give me a general idea about how 'warm' the chassis gets inside.

As well, Barco's have little temp sensors in the SMPS that is used to vary the fan voltage from 7.5-15V as needed.

Both before and after replacing the rear 3 fans, the temp is pretty much stable at approximately 28C / 82F (give or take a degree depending on ambient temp).

Equally important is the fact that the voltage at turn on (7.54V) was the same at turn off after a few hours of use with both the old and new 3 rear fans.

Ok, so the rear fans are noticeable quieter and don't generate any more heat than the stock NMB fans. Good!

Convergence tray fan (1 x 80mm):

Referring to this picture:

The hottest spot in the tray when running a 'stock' machine is the STK chip farthest to the left so I focussed my measurements there. I stuck my probe between the chip and the clips that hold the chip down. (The heatsink directly to the left of the fan also gets fairly warm. Everything else is cool.)

After a few hours with the stock NMB 80mm fan: 35.7C / 97.26F
After a few hours with the SilenX 120mm fan on an angle with my shroud: 41.3C / 106.3F

So a rise in temp, which I don't want at all. Not a huge rise and some would consider it acceptable, but I don't want this so I'll keep working at it.(Interesting to note was that my 120mm/shroud design actually kept the heatsink directly to the left of the fan completely cool, unlike the stock fan where the heatsink got too hot to touch. Must be the way the air flows around differently).

I also did measurements with the front plate removed (effectively removing the fan 'grill' and introducing some new large holes for cooling). No noticeable difference in temperature at all. Less than 1/2 degree Celcius.

I'll look into a different way of arranging the 120mm fan or getting a smaller one that can stand upright and continue testing... Since I'm in a hushbox I may actually just run with the front plate removed and even cut away from the extra aluminum such that I can use the 120mm fan upright outside the tray. I should be able to punch through a couple of holes to use the rubber mounts too. As long as I stay away from the screwholes I'll be able to put back the plate if I ever want to sell the PJ and nobody will even know...

Stay tuned. If anyone has any idea let me know.

Kal

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

Thanks for the update Kal.

**kal** · Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2007 8:53 pm Post subject:

**kal** · Posted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:46 am Post subject:

**kal** · Posted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:51 am Post subject:

apple156 · Joined: 02 Oct 2006 Posts: 8 Location: The Netherlands

Hi Kal,

I have done the same fan changes as you are doing at the moment, my projector is a Barco Data 808s, At the rear i had put the 3- 90Cfm SilenX fans and after 20 minutes of watching a movie on 1440P the upper part of my image started to deform and this kept getting worser, now after that i measured the temp and found it to be also some 10degrees higher, so i tried an extra test with the stock NMB that i had lying around, and put one on the air inlet on the outside of the Barco,

I turned on the projector with the outside fan of and waited for the distortion in the picture started again, after that turned on the Nmb with an external ps, than after a minute or so the picture distortion went away.

for me this made clear that the SilenX are not doing what they promise, and i strongly dont recomend these units for the Barco 808

I have now put back the original Nmb in the rear and fouund that the reduction in noise was not that much for the Silenx

It seems that the Nmb give a more laminair (if thats how you cal this?) airflow whereas the Silenx produces a more turbulent and spreaded airflow, this might made the difference.

For the front-fan however i have used the German made Noiseblocker see link
http://www.pcsilent.nl/en/Fans.2/80mm_w_o_TC.36/Noiseblocker_UltraSilentFan_S3__bulk.649.html

and i cut out the frontplate raster and put a 80mm computer grill onto it (you know these ones they use in pc power supplies made from rond wire).

The front fan is near dead silense and the temp seems to be the same as with the 80mm nmb, so this was quite succesful, and this reduce the overal noise level also very much as the 80mm nmb made a lot of noise.

Now i have some 3 Silenx fans lying around som my next try wil be to mount 2 SilenX fans on the inlet on the inside on the side of the barco this to improve the inlet airflow, my only concern would be, doesn't this cools the tube necks to much?

Peter

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

**kal** · Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 6:29 pm Post subject:

Wow - that is not good at all Peter! Thanks for sharing.

**kal** · Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 6:31 pm Post subject:

apple156 · Joined: 02 Oct 2006 Posts: 8 Location: The Netherlands

Hi

The resolution was 1440X1152 this is double the pal resolution progressive (i made a mistake by writing 1440p)

I measured the temerature as i have a "industrial contact temperaturemeter"
on the metal frame in the cabinet where al the prints are near i think port3 board, just right behind the tube neck board.

Now does anybody think when putting one or two of those Silenx (running at a low speed)on the inside of the side-inlet to help the flow of air tru the projector wil not cool the tube necks to much, as they will then blo cool air directly on the tube necks?

The idea is that creating some overpressure in stead of underpressure as now with the nmb's in the back, this wil i think reduce the revs of the back side fans thus reduce the noise leveland make the projector run much cooler) .

Peter

apple156 · Joined: 02 Oct 2006 Posts: 8 Location: The Netherlands

Ile · Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 2:00 pm Post subject:

One option is to build laminar 120mm -> 80mm fan adapter (funnel shaped) outside of the convergence tray, but that ain't going to look very slick...