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tschaeikaei
Joined: 08 Apr 2013
Posts: 490
Location: Germany/Saarland
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| Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, do you have other sources that don't use HDMI or this ...thing, your ipad uses?
I#m speaking of analogue outupts, e.g. VGA. Do you have a VGA cable?
Cut one connector off and solder the Dsub9 on.
Then you can tell if the problem is the projector or not.
With powerstrip, you can force your graphics card to produce negative or positive sync.
_________________
Marquee 9500U edgeblend P43 | NEC 9PG
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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Better off just buying the right cable, its not expensive.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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| the big E wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | Itll make little difference which port you use, both 3 and 5 are RGB HV. On my CineMAX there is no noticable difference between the two when using the MOOME V3 box.
You can try using port 5 and see if that works, but who knows.
What resolution are you trying to send to the projector? The timings from the iPad are likely more suited to digital displays, and that could be half the issue, unlikely as it is. |
Case your wroung on the timeings as the ipad also will work with VGA as apple has a VGA adaptor on the market for it |
Am i just? Do you see me speak of VGA output there or do you not? You wont because i didnt.
Have you tried an iPad/iPhone HDMI output on your Barco CRT projector? I have.... "SOURCE NOT AVAILABLE"...
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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| tschaeikaei wrote: | Ok, do you have other sources that don't use HDMI or this ...thing, your ipad uses?
I#m speaking of analogue outupts, e.g. VGA. Do you have a VGA cable?
Cut one connector off and solder the Dsub9 on.
Then you can tell if the problem is the projector or not.
With powerstrip, you can force your graphics card to produce negative or positive sync. |
I rechecked the cable and found some issues, then I connected again the iPad and still same result: "Source not available".
Then I connected my Mac Book Pro to the port 3, using the HD Fury and a VGA connector for the Mac Book. Finally, there is an image but only at very low resolutions (800x600) and 60 Hz refresh rate. As soon as I increase these values, the image get distorted, starts rolling and at even higher levels(1900x1200), I get the message "Source not available"...
- Can I conclude that both projector and cable are most likely ok but that the problem now is elsewhere?
- Could you give me some pointers where the "elsewhere" is now? Should I start tweaking the settings from the BARCO? Where should I start?
Thanks for any help in advance!
Regards,
-brt
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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1900 X 1200 is wayyyy too high a resolution for an 808s! What is the max resolution that works fine?
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 12:59 am Post subject: |
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Be too high for a HD Fury as well!!
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 6:22 am Post subject: |
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| Curt Palme wrote: | | 1900 X 1200 is wayyyy too high a resolution for an 808s! What is the max resolution that works fine? |
When I set it to 800x600 a get an image but it seems "dimmed" and dark as if there is not enough power/light...
What would be (in theory) the highest resolution for a BG 808? And for the HD Fury?
Thanks again!!!
-brt
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 10:11 am Post subject: |
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Hello,
A question about the Barco Port 3 pin-out to be sure:
http://www.curtpalme.com/Barco_Port3_Input.shtm
Right now, I have connected pin 10 (ground) of the VGA to pin 1 (ground) of D9. However, according the scheme above, it should not be connected, should it? Can this be critical or is it harmless?
Thanks!!!
-brt
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tschaeikaei
Joined: 08 Apr 2013
Posts: 490
Location: Germany/Saarland
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:32 am Post subject: |
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If you want to go with a progressive Signal, try 1280x720, otherwise (most people including me say that it's the best solution)
try 1080 interlaced at 60 or 72 Hz.
I checked my Dsub 9 cable that definitely works well on an Barco G801s. Numbers are pin numbers on the Dsub 9 connector.
red signal 3
green signal 4
blue signal 5
red ground 2
green ground 6
blue ground 7
horizontal signal 8
vertical signal 9
horizontal&vertical ground 1
The outer shielding (of your cable got one) is connected to the 15-pin and 9-pin connectors outer metal cage.
If not not. -.-
| Quote: | | Caveat: Some port 3 boards seem unable to support 1080p. We are trying to determine which projectors are affected or if there's any pattern to this. |
Another option is the following: If some resolutions (projecotr connected to graphics card) work and others don't:
I know about graphics cards that change their sync polarity when resolution is changed.
So, e.g. 1024X768 has negative horizontal sync and you change to 1600x1200, the horizontal sync goes positive.
Best to check with an oscilloscope. If you don't have one, connecting the horizontal signal to sync- ground via a cap, then checking with a digital voltmeter would be an option. The voltmeter says e.g. -0,8V or 0,8V and you can see how it changes.
I did not try this with cap and voltmeter because i have a scope. So someone else has to tell you if the cap would maybe hurt your graphics card.
Regards, Julian
_________________
Marquee 9500U edgeblend P43 | NEC 9PG
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tschaeikaei
Joined: 08 Apr 2013
Posts: 490
Location: Germany/Saarland
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:34 am Post subject: |
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This thing about sync polarity changing by changing resolutions: I dont remember if this was on horizontal, on vertical or both.
But it IS.
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Marquee 9500U edgeblend P43 | NEC 9PG
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:49 am Post subject: |
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The 808 should go to 1280x1024p at 60 Hz no problem at all, it should also do 1600x1200.
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:51 am Post subject: |
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My 9PG did 1600x1200 no problems, and for some strange reason the Barco is higher up the list... I very much doubt it would be as good as an NEC...
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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tschaeikaei
Joined: 08 Apr 2013
Posts: 490
Location: Germany/Saarland
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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The problem with the 808 may not be the horizontal scanning, but the resolving of the picture (electronic bandwidth).
If you go 1920x1080px72 Hzx1.3, you have 77.8kHz horizontal, but 194MHz bandwidth is needed.
You will maybe get a picture, but it will look like projected on a sponge.
I would recommend to go 1920x1080 interlaced at 72 or 96Hz, try both and use what looks best.
Better way is if somebody who has /had an 808 answers. I did never set up one but pjs with similar specs.
@Case with the fancy car:
My plain 9PG is set up at 1920*1080p at 72Hz, it works, but you know... and i added two fans to the deflection board 
I know that this is too much, just wanted to try how high it goes.
Regards, Julian
_________________
Marquee 9500U edgeblend P43 | NEC 9PG
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| tschaeikaei wrote: | If you want to go with a progressive Signal, try 1280x720, otherwise (most people including me say that it's the best solution)
try 1080 interlaced at 60 or 72 Hz.
I checked my Dsub 9 cable that definitely works well on an Barco G801s. Numbers are pin numbers on the Dsub 9 connector.
red signal 3
green signal 4
blue signal 5
red ground 2
green ground 6
blue ground 7
horizontal signal 8
vertical signal 9
horizontal&vertical ground 1
Regards, Julian |
Hello Jullan,
Thanks for your answer...just to be sure: so the PIN 10 of your VGA is connected to PIN 1 of the Dsub 9???
Or isnt't that critial?
I can't get a reasable image out of port 3 using my Mac book Pro and playing with all the settings you mention so I still doubt wether either cable or the Port3 board might be faulty (or both)...
Thanks again!
-brt
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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| tschaeikaei wrote: | Or you build a sync inverter yourself.
http://www.twobits.com/RGB/sync.html
Oh, isaw that this "how to build a snc inverter" thread is also written by you.
Adviced you twice to do the same
What type of output connector does the ipad have?
So, your DVD-Player (that surely is a BluRay-Player) does work.
I recommend you using a normal DVD-Player with Scart output.
Connect it directly (not via the fury!) to port3 of the projector.
Here is the scart layout. http://www.leadsdirect.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/scartdiag.gif
and this is port 3. http://www.curtpalme.com/images/barcoport3.jpg
If this works normally, you can exclude the projector from causing problems and other people
can explain you how to check your ipad and your fury.
I own no fury or ipad, so this is not my part to help with.
Regards, Julian |
[/quote]
Hello Julian,
I want to solder a Scart->D9 cable to check of port 3 on my Barco G 808 is ok.
However, looking at:
http://www.leadsdirect.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/scartdiag.gif
...where do the Hsync and V sync go on the scart? And to which pin should be connected pin1 of the Dsub 9?
Thanks and regards,
-brt
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun May 11, 2014 11:33 am Post subject: |
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| tschaeikaei wrote: | The problem with the 808 may not be the horizontal scanning, but the resolving of the picture (electronic bandwidth).
If you go 1920x1080px72 Hzx1.3, you have 77.8kHz horizontal, but 194MHz bandwidth is needed.
You will maybe get a picture, but it will look like projected on a sponge.
I would recommend to go 1920x1080 interlaced at 72 or 96Hz, try both and use what looks best.
Better way is if somebody who has /had an 808 answers. I did never set up one but pjs with similar specs.
@Case with the fancy car:
My plain 9PG is set up at 1920*1080p at 72Hz, it works, but you know... and i added two fans to the deflection board
I know that this is too much, just wanted to try how high it goes.
Regards, Julian |
Should change that since i havent been the Corvette man in over 5 years!! 
I got my 9PG to do 1920x1080p 60 Hz, but it wasnt even close to as nice as interlaced, 1600x1200 wasnt too bad, but alot better on the XG.
1080i on a PG looks pretty damn good really, its not as good as on an XG, but not far behind it really. Considering im comparing a Plain PG with no electronic astig and huge tubeface usage, that PG did pretty frigen good 1920x1080i 
_________________
Barco Cine 9, ,Sony VPL570ES 4K SXRD, 135" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, Denon X6700in preamp mode, 2x 7ch Tonewinner amps, 2x Tonewinner 15" subs, 2x 10" subs, 7.2.6...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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| hiddink wrote: | | tschaeikaei wrote: | Or you build a sync inverter yourself.
http://www.twobits.com/RGB/sync.html
Oh, isaw that this "how to build a snc inverter" thread is also written by you.
Adviced you twice to do the same
What type of output connector does the ipad have?
So, your DVD-Player (that surely is a BluRay-Player) does work.
I recommend you using a normal DVD-Player with Scart output.
Connect it directly (not via the fury!) to port3 of the projector.
Here is the scart layout. http://www.leadsdirect.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/scartdiag.gif
and this is port 3. http://www.curtpalme.com/images/barcoport3.jpg
If this works normally, you can exclude the projector from causing problems and other people
can explain you how to check your ipad and your fury.
I own no fury or ipad, so this is not my part to help with.
Regards, Julian |
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Hello Julian,
I want to solder a Scart->D9 cable to check of port 3 on my Barco G 808 is ok.
However, looking at:
http://www.leadsdirect.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/scartdiag.gif
...where do the Hsync and V sync go on the scart? And to which pin should be connected pin1 of the Dsub 9?
Thanks and regards,
-brt[/quote]
Hello,
Can someone help me with the pinout for connecting SCART to a D-sub9 (port 3 on Barco G 808) in order to check with an analog input if the projector/port3 board is fine?
Thanks!
-brt
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tschaeikaei
Joined: 08 Apr 2013
Posts: 490
Location: Germany/Saarland
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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There are no seperate horizontal and vertical syncs a scart connector. You have to use C-Sync (pin 19, ground on 17)
and the RGB and separate grounds for each.
Here are some useful pics.
I would use pin 1 on the dsub9 as sync ground. In case you have separate syncs (h and v) you connect horizontal and vertical ground to pin 1.
If you have a composite sync signal, certainly only the one sync gorund you have.
I'm not sure about it, but sync ground is the only signal not connected, so it wouldn't make sense to connect it elsewhere.
So again: scart pin 17--> dsub9 pin1, scart 19 -->dsub9 pin8.
Regards, Julian
_________________
Marquee 9500U edgeblend P43 | NEC 9PG
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tschaeikaei
Joined: 08 Apr 2013
Posts: 490
Location: Germany/Saarland
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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Case, do you use a PC for 1080i on the PG?
I tried 1080i72 yesterday, didn't work that well.
Sometimes i only got half the picture on the screen,
sometimes the whole pic but it was distorted as hell.
Horizontal lines through the whole picture that went over the edges.
I'm not an expert in setting porches, so maybe you can post me your powerstrip-settings?
Thanks, Julian
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Marquee 9500U edgeblend P43 | NEC 9PG
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hiddink
Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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Hello,
Today I made a sync inverter for barco G 808, based on this part:
http://nl.rs-online.com/web/p/hex-inverters/0307503P/
I got the +5V power from a cell phone, followed the scheme here:
http://www.twobits.com/sync.html
Look at the images for the result (proof of concept)...
Now, when I connect a normal DVD-player to port 5 WITHOUT the inverter, I get a good image from the projector.
However, when I use the DVD-player WITH the inverter, I get "Source not available"...
What could I have overlooked that it does not work? Any ideas?
Thanks in advance,
-brt
| gjaky wrote: | Port 5 accepts only negative sync, right?
So your DVD player have negative sync on output, since the projector works. Now your sync inverter inverts sync so the negative becomes to positive, which is not accepted on port 5 so to me it seems to be working. |
| tschaeikaei wrote: | An inverter inverts the signals polarity. Barcos run on negative Sync polarity. So if your DVD player puts out negative, the inverter will invert it to positive.
And the projector does not run with that. OK?
BTW: Do you have to create a new topic for everything? This is the third thread now, always the same questions. Barco 808 does not run as you want it to.
Why don't you put everything to the "Barco only runs on red tube" thread and ask kal to delete those other two?
Regards, Julian |
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