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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | When sitting almost 4m from a 110" picture the levels look the same and I can see the lines in the top part of the center group perfectly! So why it lokk dark on the iPhone picture is clearly a camea weakness. |
This is correct Andreas.
He will never understand, and never admit. He knows best. 
That's why only him answers with bull and do not see that a digital shows everything better.
Maybe not from iPhone pics but for shore in real side by side tests.
We have seen and hearted this before.
Can anyone else than stridsvognen post some pictures.
And show nec pattern, and that pattern 1:1. That is important.
That shows how the pattern should be shown with black and white lines horizontal and vertical.
Not just blurry lines. |
You still need to understand that i dont want to beat your sony.. we are trying to understand what we see here..
the only one here that will be able to explain this right are Mike..
There are many different parameters you can evaluate in that pattern.. can you name some.?
From here i dont doubt what the sony do better, and what the CRT do better.. Again i dont understand why you take this so personal..
The sony will look the same no matter what we talk about in here, and it will still be the one you prefer.. you just need to put down your fists. its not a fight.. its a evaluation of different strong and weak points in different projector types.
So tell me what different parameters you can evaluate from that pattern.. |
This is starting to get silly silly silly.
I do not say that I beat your machine I say that I only prove that Greg statement is total bull****. You do your pattern thing.
I pay to get it right. So I do not need to adjust after my calibrator is finished.
Evaluate what you like. And the vw1000 is not perfect but dam close.
And to even say that a CRT will beat or win is just so funny and untrue.
This not to you, but someone that just want to sell and use the best home cinema projector to day in my eyes.
Read the first post from Greg you see what I talk about.
The modded one talked about is not better than your marque maybe some places and the other way around.
A vw1000 is better in every way. That's the fact. And so far that it's in another league that I have said before.
And if you take a look at the pictures that I sent and evaluate the quality of black, white, sharpness, ansicontrast, resolution 1080p and so on. And take the same pictures, on your crts do not need to say more. It speaks for them selves.
Your projector is far from a vw1000, but you like what you like.
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Diddern wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | When sitting almost 4m from a 110" picture the levels look the same and I can see the lines in the top part of the center group perfectly! So why it lokk dark on the iPhone picture is clearly a camea weakness. |
This is correct Andreas.
He will never understand, and never admit. He knows best.
That's why only him answers with bull and do not see that a digital shows everything better.
Maybe not from iPhone pics but for shore in real side by side tests.
We have seen and hearted this before.
Can anyone else than stridsvognen post some pictures.
And show nec pattern, and that pattern 1:1. That is important.
That shows how the pattern should be shown with black and white lines horizontal and vertical.
Not just blurry lines. |
You still need to understand that i dont want to beat your sony.. we are trying to understand what we see here..
the only one here that will be able to explain this right are Mike..
There are many different parameters you can evaluate in that pattern.. can you name some.?
From here i dont doubt what the sony do better, and what the CRT do better.. Again i dont understand why you take this so personal..
The sony will look the same no matter what we talk about in here, and it will still be the one you prefer.. you just need to put down your fists. its not a fight.. its a evaluation of different strong and weak points in different projector types.
So tell me what different parameters you can evaluate from that pattern.. |
This is starting to get silly silly silly.
I do not say that I beat your machine I say that I only prove that Greg statement is total bull****. You do your pattern thing.
I pay to get it right. So I do not need to adjust after my calibrator is finished.
Evaluate what you like. And the vw1000 is not perfect but dam close.
And to even say that a CRT will beat or win is just so funny and untrue.
This not to you, but someone that just want to sell and use the best home cinema projector to day in my eyes.
Read the first post from Greg you see what I talk about.
The modded one talked about is not better than your marque maybe some places and the other way around.
A vw1000 is better in every way. That's the fact. And so far that it's in another league that I have said before.
And if you take a look at the pictures that I sent and evaluate the quality of black, white, sharpness, ansicontrast, resolution 1080p and so on. And take the same pictures, on your crts do not need to say more. It speaks for them selves.
Your projector is far from a vw1000, but you like what you like. |
ONE MORE TIME...
forget about beating ot whats best..
Evaluate the pattern and tell what it can be used for.. this is still not a pissing contest Digital VS CRT..
We are talking about what we see on the pattern..
What can you see out of that pattern.?and what do it show on a poor image and what will it be able to show with a good camera fully capture the stuff on screen.
Ill delete the CRT shots so you dont get confused, and i tell you that your projector is the best, so dont worry about that..
Explain what the pattern is all about..
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| ecrabb wrote: | 
For the love of everything that is good about home theater, would you all stop taking photos with the iPhone?
I'm an iPhone fan... For a cell phone, the iPhone has a very good camera; among the best... But, compared to a good DSLR, the sensitivity, dynamic range, resolution, and noise are horrible. If we're going to be comparing screen shots of high-end projectors, and trying to understand anything meaningful from looking at them, DO NOT take photos with handheld cell phones!
If you do insist on taking photos with the iPhone, only closeups are useful... The wide shots of the entire screen are beyond worthless.
SC |
+1 
If one wants to compare screenshots they should be taken i a similar room with the same screen and high end camera with the same settings and a tripod stand. This is why I never take and compare screenshots, and to come with a conclution by looking at these shots is the same as asking Stevie Wonder what projector he prefers. The only pictures that is close to say something is the real closeups.
_________________
http://www.minhembio.com/21Andreas
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | When sitting almost 4m from a 110" picture the levels look the same and I can see the lines in the top part of the center group perfectly! So why it lokk dark on the iPhone picture is clearly a camea weakness. |
This is correct Andreas.
He will never understand, and never admit. He knows best.
That's why only him answers with bull and do not see that a digital shows everything better.
Maybe not from iPhone pics but for shore in real side by side tests.
We have seen and hearted this before.
Can anyone else than stridsvognen post some pictures.
And show nec pattern, and that pattern 1:1. That is important.
That shows how the pattern should be shown with black and white lines horizontal and vertical.
Not just blurry lines. |
You still need to understand that i dont want to beat your sony.. we are trying to understand what we see here..
the only one here that will be able to explain this right are Mike..
There are many different parameters you can evaluate in that pattern.. can you name some.?
From here i dont doubt what the sony do better, and what the CRT do better.. Again i dont understand why you take this so personal..
The sony will look the same no matter what we talk about in here, and it will still be the one you prefer.. you just need to put down your fists. its not a fight.. its a evaluation of different strong and weak points in different projector types.
So tell me what different parameters you can evaluate from that pattern.. |
This is starting to get silly silly silly.
I do not say that I beat your machine I say that I only prove that Greg statement is total bull****. You do your pattern thing.
I pay to get it right. So I do not need to adjust after my calibrator is finished.
Evaluate what you like. And the vw1000 is not perfect but dam close.
And to even say that a CRT will beat or win is just so funny and untrue.
This not to you, but someone that just want to sell and use the best home cinema projector to day in my eyes.
Read the first post from Greg you see what I talk about.
The modded one talked about is not better than your marque maybe some places and the other way around.
A vw1000 is better in every way. That's the fact. And so far that it's in another league that I have said before.
And if you take a look at the pictures that I sent and evaluate the quality of black, white, sharpness, ansicontrast, resolution 1080p and so on. And take the same pictures, on your crts do not need to say more. It speaks for them selves.
Your projector is far from a vw1000, but you like what you like. |
ONE MORE TIME...
forget about beating ot whats best..
Evaluate the pattern and tell what it can be used for.. this is still not a pissing contest Digital VS CRT..
We are talking about what we see on the pattern..
What can you see out of that pattern.?and what do it show on a poor image and what will it be able to show with a good camera fully capture the stuff on screen.
Ill delete the CRT shots so you dont get confused, and i tell you that your projector is the best, so dont worry about that..
Explain what the pattern is all about.. |
To really evaluate the pattern you need to see it in real life not a screenshot taken by a phone or even a good DSLR camera! 
_________________
http://www.minhembio.com/21Andreas
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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ok, so what can you evaluate when looking the screen.. forget about screenshots..?
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overclkr
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 4227
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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Yawn. The Sony will have it's advantages over the stack and vice versa. 4K CONTENT though is a whole different story.
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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| overclkr wrote: | | Yawn. The Sony will have it's advantages over the stack and vice versa. 4K CONTENT though is a whole different story. |
A was asked to put screenshots of the vw1000, and I did. Maybe some thought they could find something.
This pictures are not the projector and how it looks hehe. It's from a iPhone
But show even from a iPhone that it has no up scaling artifacts on that pattern. When you take picture close to screen.
A screenshot war does not prove much, but with extreme different quality in the picture like shown here.
Is why no one else but stridsvognen post pictures. And if mine looked like what shown I let it be, an not send it out.
No one else than stridsvognen is trying to comment stuff that I posted and with totally no meaning. Even with photo that everyone clearly can see That the vw1000' is in another league. What I try kindly to make you CRT folks wake up and admit that I know what I talk about.
I showed you guys a side by side test with a modded barco, and it looks the same. Looses big to a sony hw50. Does it matter NO the guy loves he's CRT anyway but know that it's not better like he sayed.
Modding makes the CRT better correct. And I will show later in the mod or not mod that I started.
You see great improvements visible. Photos before and after will be posted. I have to take pictures with the same camera an shutter.
We are finished....
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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You forgot to tell everyone what different parameters you can evaluate looking the SMPTE pattern..
Looking at your screen.
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreas21 wrote: | | To really evaluate the pattern you need to see it in real life not a screenshot taken by a phone or even a good DSLR camera! |
To be fair, there is plenty to be learned from screen shots, but the screen shots have to be shot properly, on a good camera with good spatial resolution and dynamic range, and from a tripod. With the proper technique and test patterns, we can make meaningful comparisons and understand things like pixel structure, edge-enhancement, ringing, HF-rolloff, etc. But, the presence of some of artifacts can be masked unless the screen shots are of sufficient quality. This is why cell phone pictures are dubious at best.
I'll see if I can take half an hour tonight and capture and post some really high-fidelity, useful screen shots from my RS45 - just for reference.
Cheers,
SC
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Diddern wrote: | | overclkr wrote: | | Yawn. The Sony will have it's advantages over the stack and vice versa. 4K CONTENT though is a whole different story. |
A was asked to put screenshots of the vw1000, and I did. Maybe some thought they could find something.
This pictures are not the projector and how it looks hehe. It's from a iPhone
But show even from a iPhone that it has no up scaling artifacts on that pattern. When you take picture close to screen.
A screenshot war does not prove much, but with extreme different quality in the picture like shown here.
Is why no one else but stridsvognen post pictures. And if mine looked like what shown I let it be, an not send it out.
No one else than stridsvognen is trying to comment stuff that I posted and with totally no meaning. Even with photo that everyone clearly can see That the vw1000' is in another league. What I try kindly to make you CRT folks wake up and admit that I know what I talk about.
I showed you guys a side by side test with a modded barco, and it looks the same. Looses big to a sony hw50. Does it matter NO the guy loves he's CRT anyway but know that it's not better like he sayed.
Modding makes the CRT better correct. And I will show later in the mod or not mod that I started.
You see great improvements visible. Photos before and after will be posted. I have to take pictures with the same camera an shutter.
We are finished.... |
Hold your horses. I had to walk away for awhile, but still will be right back and we pick up where we left off.
cell phone or anything else is fine. just post those two different shots of the center pattern group, and I'll get back to you later
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | overclkr wrote: | | Yawn. The Sony will have it's advantages over the stack and vice versa. 4K CONTENT though is a whole different story. |
A was asked to put screenshots of the vw1000, and I did. Maybe some thought they could find something.
This pictures are not the projector and how it looks hehe. It's from a iPhone
But show even from a iPhone that it has no up scaling artifacts on that pattern. When you take picture close to screen.
A screenshot war does not prove much, but with extreme different quality in the picture like shown here.
Is why no one else but stridsvognen post pictures. And if mine looked like what shown I let it be, an not send it out.
No one else than stridsvognen is trying to comment stuff that I posted and with totally no meaning. Even with photo that everyone clearly can see That the vw1000' is in another league. What I try kindly to make you CRT folks wake up and admit that I know what I talk about.
I showed you guys a side by side test with a modded barco, and it looks the same. Looses big to a sony hw50. Does it matter NO the guy loves he's CRT anyway but know that it's not better like he sayed.
Modding makes the CRT better correct. And I will show later in the mod or not mod that I started.
You see great improvements visible. Photos before and after will be posted. I have to take pictures with the same camera an shutter.
We are finished.... |
Hold your horses. I had to walk away for awhile, but still will be right back and we pick up where we left off.
cell phone or anything else is fine. just post those two different shots of the center pattern group, and I'll get back to you later |
There is nothing to pick upp. You have the pics do what you want.
I know the fact. And it's clear, but hard to admit
I am finished in kindergarden and unserious stamens.
I do not say that your CRTs are sh*t, I like CRT very much, but a Vw1000 will be better in every way compared.
Maybe not in all test patterns as Andreas says, but I do not care. This because I do not see it in film at all.
And we use it for film and pictures.
Take care guys, enjoy what we all love sound and picture. Happy hunting for the perfect picture
Kindest regards Didrik
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Diddern wrote: |
There is nothing to pick upp. You have the pics do what you want.
I know the fact. And it's clear, but hard to admit
I am finished in kindergarden and unserious stamens.
I do not say that your CRTs are sh*t, I like CRT very much, but a Vw1000 will be better in every way compared.
Maybe not in all test patterns as Andreas says, but I do not care. This because I do not see it in film at all.
And we use it for film and pictures.
Take care guys, enjoy what we all love sound and picture. Happy hunting for the perfect picture
Kindest regards Didrik |
Hey, where you going?
I'm going to decode things for you, but at the same time, I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this..
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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Seems the children left kindergarden...
But im still interested in learn something today.. So ill put the pics together.
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | ...I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this.. |
I don't... This thread is a car accident, and I'm on the edge of my seat to see what you're going to tell us about those grainy, noisy, low-resolution screen shots.
SC
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km987654
Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 2874
Location: Australia
TV/Projector: Barco BG809s
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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| ecrabb wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | ...I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this.. |
I don't... This thread is a car accident, and I'm on the edge of my seat to see what you're going to tell us about those grainy, noisy, low-resolution screen shots.
SC |
More like a recurring train wreck 
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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| ecrabb wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | ...I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this.. |
I don't... This thread is a car accident, and I'm on the edge of my seat to see what you're going to tell us about those grainy, noisy, low-resolution screen shots.
SC |
I am also waiting for this expert to come with his veridict from these relative worthless pictures.
_________________
http://www.minhembio.com/21Andreas
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| ecrabb wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | ...I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this.. |
I don't... This thread is a car accident, and I'm on the edge of my seat to see what you're going to tell us about those grainy, noisy, low-resolution screen shots.
SC |
So what are you saying.. do you think the noise and graininess is coming from the camera?
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 12:54 am Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | ecrabb wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | ...I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this.. |
I don't... This thread is a car accident, and I'm on the edge of my seat to see what you're going to tell us about those grainy, noisy, low-resolution screen shots.
SC |
So what are you saying.. do you think the noise and graininess is coming from the camera? |
Absolutely, without question.
SC
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 6:11 am Post subject: |
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| ecrabb wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | ecrabb wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | ...I'm sure you got an idea where I'm going to go with this.. |
I don't... This thread is a car accident, and I'm on the edge of my seat to see what you're going to tell us about those grainy, noisy, low-resolution screen shots.
SC |
So what are you saying.. do you think the noise and graininess is coming from the camera? |
Absolutely, without question.
SC |
LOl... no that's not the camera. That looks like an extreme case of software enhancement (scaled down, re sized or maybe even sharpened).
Shot should be taking and uploaded to an image site (Imageshack, Tinypic, etc). Once there select the size image you want.
But the graininess has has little effect on what I'll be pointing out, but I would want him to post a better set of pictures.
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overclkr
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 4227
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| Posted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 6:34 am Post subject: |
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| Diddern wrote: | | overclkr wrote: | | Yawn. The Sony will have it's advantages over the stack and vice versa. 4K CONTENT though is a whole different story. |
A was asked to put screenshots of the vw1000, and I did. Maybe some thought they could find something.
This pictures are not the projector and how it looks hehe. It's from a iPhone
But show even from a iPhone that it has no up scaling artifacts on that pattern. When you take picture close to screen.
A screenshot war does not prove much, but with extreme different quality in the picture like shown here.
Is why no one else but stridsvognen post pictures. And if mine looked like what shown I let it be, an not send it out.
No one else than stridsvognen is trying to comment stuff that I posted and with totally no meaning. Even with photo that everyone clearly can see That the vw1000' is in another league. What I try kindly to make you CRT folks wake up and admit that I know what I talk about.
I showed you guys a side by side test with a modded barco, and it looks the same. Looses big to a sony hw50. Does it matter NO the guy loves he's CRT anyway but know that it's not better like he sayed.
Modding makes the CRT better correct. And I will show later in the mod or not mod that I started.
You see great improvements visible. Photos before and after will be posted. I have to take pictures with the same camera an shutter.
We are finished.... |
Dude, you have me completely confused right now. I really don't understand at all what it is you are trying to say. I think you should rethink and repost to me what it is you are really saying. I'm confused. 
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