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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="mp20748"] | Andreas21 wrote: |
How do you know this with you uncalibrated CRT?? Your picture clearly has way to much color in it |
My setup is a direct Blu Ray player into my projector, bwo, and Moome HDMI to RGB converter. The oversaturation you think you're seeing is the result of a higher bandwidth video chain. And if you saw any of these movies in the theaters, the colors would also be more pungent. That is one off the things the studio does to the film or video for Theater. And during the transfer process it will be more colorful if the video chain has the speed to reveal it. There is nothing in my setup that would allow me to ADD colors.
| Quote: | | His hair and eyebrows are black in Didderns shot and you see detail, in yours there is a lot of blackcrush |
How many times do you have be be told that the camera are not really capable of capturing the full IRE window. The digital does better here, because it has a bright low end. And that's also why Chris's eyebrows and hair are not BLACK in Didderns shot
| Quote: | Didderns JVC is calibrated, but his camera is not and your PC screen is not. If you calibrate your CRT, camera and screen to bt709 you will se what the director inteded Chris Tucker to look like in this movie and I say this movie.  |
Dude why don't you just go away and stop coming here with your ridiculous theories on CRT technology. You keep expecting more out of these cameras than they are capable......again, it's perfect on my screen, but the cameras are not good at capturing that. can you please kot this down somewhere, but we're getting really tiered of keep telling you the same thing over and over.
And I thught yesterday was the for camera day..
I deleted the ugly words Curt do not like this and I respect that , you should to.
But what can you expect form a guy like you. And I understand that CRT technology you know nothing about. At least how a picture HD should look. I do not want to make your CFT look bad just to prove that everything I have said is right and hundred % correct. And I can't wait for a side-by-side with someone like you. That would be the most fun I ever do.
So keep on moding maybe even 5 to 7 years you'll be there or """not"""
And you talk so much crap that I don't have words for it, i've made my point here and nothing is going to take that joy away from me. The topic of this thred is full of bull****, and should be removed or deleted.
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Diddern wrote: | WOW
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Didderns
mine
 [/quote][/quote]
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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Not touched by you:
 [/quote]
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:01 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Diddern, are you able to see beyond sharpness?
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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JVC X500 do not look good, not real, and there is some light that have color in this picture.
Look the guy with the microphone is in shock
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | Hey Diddern, are you able to see beyond sharpness? |
Far beyond, are you?
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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Is that JVC calibrated?
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.?
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| CSX wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | CSX wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | Hey Diddern, shouldn't his hair and eyebrows be BLACK. As well, the subject for those shots were "Flesh tones"
Do you know what Flesh tones are, and that Chris Tucker's flesh tones, eyebrows and hair color is not accurate in your shot.
He is an entirely different complexion in your shot from his natural skin skin color. |
How can you know. was you in the sett when filming, my projector is calibrated with Delta E about 0.3-0,5 do not remember and I think that Chris would prefer looking normal and not a fried lobster. If you like Chris to look that way no one is stopping you, When Prossest down to Blu-ray it is Rec 709 and D 65 HDTV standard.
And my camera is not calibrated so I can't get how it looks on screen. And I don't hope that yours do not look like that. |
You can stop any day now. It's not like you are going to prove anything, nor win any arguments here.
If that's not obvious by now, you must be denser than diamond.
Accept your projector for what it is. We do ours. |
I accept what I see and I have no problem saying it. Tell me what you see when looking at those pictures. |
I hate to follow the bait, but here you go.
You want it, you get it.
What do I see when looking at those pictures?
Digital: Cold, sterile, sharp, unnatural.
CRT: Ridiculous color depth, good black representation, not so sharp, warm, more realistic image conveyance.
It's harder to really grasp the sharpness on CRT however over photos, so it's loosely interpreted.
I know for the fact that what I see on screen, I can really never take a picture that looks as good as what I get to see...
There is seems to be a "loss" of non critical detail, but critical detail exists enough in a capacity for one to see it and enjoy it at higher resolutions on CRT. I have been absolutely dazzled by what I get to witness on CRT projection, and my configuration isn't even remotely fine tuned or dialed in like Mike's or probably most setups around here.
Side note:
I'm also interested in seeing how well the JVC image panels hold up over time.
My Samsung UHD tv used to look pretty good when it was first new. The blacks are now nearly purples. |
What you guys say about color depth/resolution of a CRT is so far into fantasy land it is possible to go...
And comparing your Samsung UHD TV with a JVC is just ridiculous. I know people with JVC projectors with over 10000 hours on them and still "perfect". But to me it is not important as I have never used a projector more than 1000 hours before I sold it.
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | Is that JVC calibrated? |
The projector is, but not my camera 
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="stridsvognen"][quote="Andreas21"] | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? | Quote: |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
Not cool to throw sh*t.
When are you going to stop all this stupid writing. Strange other people don't tell you to stop.
Last edited by Diddern on Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:25 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? |
Do you really think the JVC will have problems with the color resolution on a BD. If it was 4:4:4 the JVC would show it as it is meant.
And concerning rec709, what do you have to do with your CRT to make it able to show it?
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? |
Dou you really think the JVC will have problems with the color resolution on a BD. If it was 4:4:4 the JVC would show it as it is meant.
And concerning rec709, what do you have to do with your CRT to make it able to show it? |
Nothing.. its just there, as is the gamma response.
Now no digital have any gamma response that is not software based, so its kind of a processor mapping the gamma curve, and your able to re map it with the calibration features in the digital domain.
We just run the standard native digital signal into a dac, and then set our G" and drive, and then the analog response wil fit the format.
You need a processor to do the work.
Some even have a extra processor in the digital chain to mess the source material up a extra time, as the projector wont do a good job mapping the response right.
And in the end you have a analog panel, i know they call it digital, but how do you think they activate the output on each pixel in the panel.?
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreas21 wrote: |
Your CRT is not calibrated to the bt709 standard so it can not show a BD as it is meant to. If you like your colors it is up to you, but it is not correct. |
No it is not calibrated, but would they really need to be in a comparison to the JVC?
So the JVC is calibrated to BT709, yet it still looks washed out in the shots. Are you sure it's been calibrated?
Last edited by mp20748 on Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? |
Dou you really think the JVC will have problems with the color resolution on a BD. If it was 4:4:4 the JVC would show it as it is meant.
And concerning rec709, what do you have to do with your CRT to make it able to show it? |
Nothing.. its just there, as is the gamma response.
Now no digital have any gamma response that is not software based, so its kind of a processor mapping the gamma curve, and your able to re map it with the calibration features in the digital domain.
We just run the standard native digital signal into a dac, and then set our G" and drive, and then the analog response wil fit the format.
You need a processor to do the work.
Some even have a extra processor in the digital chain to mess the source material up a extra time, as the projector wont do a good job mapping the response right.
And in the end you have a analog panel, i know they call it digital, but how do you think they activate the output on each pixel in the panel.? |
Why do you use color filters and color lenses on green and red on your CRTs ?
Please someone with some CRT knowledge replay to stridsvognen.
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? |
Dou you really think the JVC will have problems with the color resolution on a BD. If it was 4:4:4 the JVC would show it as it is meant.
And concerning rec709, what do you have to do with your CRT to make it able to show it? |
Nothing.. its just there, as is the gamma response.
Now no digital have any gamma response that is not software based, so its kind of a processor mapping the gamma curve, and your able to re map it with the calibration features in the digital domain.
We just run the standard native digital signal into a dac, and then set our G" and drive, and then the analog response wil fit the format.
You need a processor to do the work.
Some even have a extra processor in the digital chain to mess the source material up a extra time, as the projector wont do a good job mapping the response right.
And in the end you have a analog panel, i know they call it digital, but how do you think they activate the output on each pixel in the panel.?
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Yeah right! 
If you ask a pro calibrator you will get a very different answer.
I know of the analogue paneldrivers of the JVC. But I have actually owned a projector with digital paneldrivers, but I know you donīt know what projector that is. And I wonder wht your point is with this??
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Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: |
Your CRT is not calibrated to the bt709 standard so it can not show a BD as it is meant to. If you like your colors it is up to you, but it is not correct. |
No it is not calibrated, but would they really need to be in a comparison to the JVC?
So the JVC is calibrated to BT709, yet it still looks washed out in the shots. Are you sure it's been calibrated? |
And I also think that a man that has done this for 10 years then trying to get correct colors on his CRT is still on the same day 10 years ago.
Tell me where is it washed out compared to your picture?
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? |
Dou you really think the JVC will have problems with the color resolution on a BD. If it was 4:4:4 the JVC would show it as it is meant.
And concerning rec709, what do you have to do with your CRT to make it able to show it? |
Nothing.. its just there, as is the gamma response.
Now no digital have any gamma response that is not software based, so its kind of a processor mapping the gamma curve, and your able to re map it with the calibration features in the digital domain.
We just run the standard native digital signal into a dac, and then set our G" and drive, and then the analog response wil fit the format.
You need a processor to do the work.
Some even have a extra processor in the digital chain to mess the source material up a extra time, as the projector wont do a good job mapping the response right.
And in the end you have a analog panel, i know they call it digital, but how do you think they activate the output on each pixel in the panel.?
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Yeah right!
If you ask a pro calibrator you will get a very different answer.
I know of the analogue paneldrivers of the JVC. But I have actually owned a projector with digital paneldrivers, but I know you donīt know what projector that is. And I wonder wht your point is with this?? |
My point is that there is no processor you can buy that will correct each pixel in real time.
You can correct a low resolution window, and measure it to be right.
What do you think happens when you then trow a complex image into that processor.? Will it come out perfect.?
Why did you not keep the DLP.?
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Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Andreas21 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | Nashou66 wrote: | Really? Whats wrong with that pic Kurt?
Athanasios |
If i stand next to a guy whos face look like that from the JVC, ill call a ambulance.
Is it sharp.. hell yeah.. is it natural.. hell no. The color resolution looks like something from a standard CRT machine.
I have a JVC, and i see new Digital projectors whenever possible, if i like one ill buy it.
I would also not go back to a standard CRT projector, but as you say. Some of it is the pleasure of playing with the hardware, and endless options, and as your skills improve, so do the image.
Even a blend with a visible blend zone and all that noise a standard CRT video chain can have is still not as annoying as the overly sharp image with its digital noise. |
I donīt think you know what color resolution is. |
When you calibrate, do you use a low resolution pattern,?
Do you think any processor you can buy will be able to process the correction data pr pixel real time, or do you think they just say.. Hey these guys are so stupid they wont notice.? |
Dou you really think the JVC will have problems with the color resolution on a BD. If it was 4:4:4 the JVC would show it as it is meant.
And concerning rec709, what do you have to do with your CRT to make it able to show it? |
Nothing.. its just there, as is the gamma response.
Now no digital have any gamma response that is not software based, so its kind of a processor mapping the gamma curve, and your able to re map it with the calibration features in the digital domain.
We just run the standard native digital signal into a dac, and then set our G" and drive, and then the analog response wil fit the format.
You need a processor to do the work.
Some even have a extra processor in the digital chain to mess the source material up a extra time, as the projector wont do a good job mapping the response right.
And in the end you have a analog panel, i know they call it digital, but how do you think they activate the output on each pixel in the panel.?
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Yeah right!
If you ask a pro calibrator you will get a very different answer.
I know of the analogue paneldrivers of the JVC. But I have actually owned a projector with digital paneldrivers, but I know you donīt know what projector that is. And I wonder wht your point is with this?? |
My point is that there is no processor you can buy that will correct each pixel in real time.
You can correct a low resolution window, and measure it to be right.
What do you think happens when you then trow a complex image into that processor.? Will it come out perfect.?
Why did you not keep the DLP.? |
What are you talking about? I donīt use a prosessor. I used to own a Lumagen, but after I found out what it does to color resolution and colors near black I sold it for cheap.
I have not owned a DLP since 2006, and I donīt like DLPīs due to the very poor on/off contrast and black level performance. Other than that DLP technology have a lot of positives to it and when they come up with a HDR DLP I might give it a try again.
And your CRT is perfect in every way except from very poor MTF, very poor ansi/intrascene contrast, very poor sharpness, very poor clarity, very poor depth to the image, very poor detail in HD, very poor color reproduction, very poor brightness, very poor calibration capabilities (actually need external CMS to get good results), poor shadow detail+++
Shall I continue?? 
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CSX
Joined: 11 Feb 2015
Posts: 142
Location: Ohio
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| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2015 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Andreas21 wrote: | | CSX wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | CSX wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | Hey Diddern, shouldn't his hair and eyebrows be BLACK. As well, the subject for those shots were "Flesh tones"
Do you know what Flesh tones are, and that Chris Tucker's flesh tones, eyebrows and hair color is not accurate in your shot.
He is an entirely different complexion in your shot from his natural skin skin color. |
How can you know. was you in the sett when filming, my projector is calibrated with Delta E about 0.3-0,5 do not remember and I think that Chris would prefer looking normal and not a fried lobster. If you like Chris to look that way no one is stopping you, When Prossest down to Blu-ray it is Rec 709 and D 65 HDTV standard.
And my camera is not calibrated so I can't get how it looks on screen. And I don't hope that yours do not look like that. |
You can stop any day now. It's not like you are going to prove anything, nor win any arguments here.
If that's not obvious by now, you must be denser than diamond.
Accept your projector for what it is. We do ours. |
I accept what I see and I have no problem saying it. Tell me what you see when looking at those pictures. |
I hate to follow the bait, but here you go.
You want it, you get it.
What do I see when looking at those pictures?
Digital: Cold, sterile, sharp, unnatural.
CRT: Ridiculous color depth, good black representation, not so sharp, warm, more realistic image conveyance.
It's harder to really grasp the sharpness on CRT however over photos, so it's loosely interpreted.
I know for the fact that what I see on screen, I can really never take a picture that looks as good as what I get to see...
There is seems to be a "loss" of non critical detail, but critical detail exists enough in a capacity for one to see it and enjoy it at higher resolutions on CRT. I have been absolutely dazzled by what I get to witness on CRT projection, and my configuration isn't even remotely fine tuned or dialed in like Mike's or probably most setups around here.
Side note:
I'm also interested in seeing how well the JVC image panels hold up over time.
My Samsung UHD tv used to look pretty good when it was first new. The blacks are now nearly purples. |
What you guys say about color depth/resolution of a CRT is so far into fantasy land it is possible to go...
And comparing your Samsung UHD TV with a JVC is just ridiculous. I know people with JVC projectors with over 10000 hours on them and still "perfect". But to me it is not important as I have never used a projector more than 1000 hours before I sold it. |
I now know you are a 100% full of incorrect statements, and only choose to believe what you want to.
Commonly referred to as a Doubting Thomas amongst the people I know.
You are of this classification of person.
It's a shame you don't want to accept things for fact or face value. I'm spending no more time from this, and unsubscribing from this beyond ridiculous and useless discussion, as I am tired of seeing my email blow up, and realize how full of it you and your pet are.
Done.
So long and thanks for all the fish, jerk!
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