| Author |
Message |
Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
This one so we can compare the marquee and the cine9.
But you wil struggle as hell. The more light you try to push to get detail you lose picture quality and black level.
Last edited by Diddern on Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Diddern wrote: | And a small picture like this the crt looks good but you see that the JVC X500 is much better.
And also that you cant tell anything about black level, because after the new picture form MP the JVC black level is better and holds black better than the CRT. SO again you cant tell from pictures, but give a indication.
And the difference in a side by side test is like the spaceship background |
Oh, I forgot to mention that the bottom picture is NOT my CRT. Still at your tricks again..
By the way that last shop I posted has the gamma on the Moome card cranked up real high. I did that to get you guys excited when you saw it. And also knew you would be doing a comparison. But keep in mind also, the CRT shot I posted just the other ones had more red in the fresh. You're sidekick said it was over saturation, It's really just the opposite of the flat colors your projector displays.
So even before you tweaked the picture, I want you to know the image I posted has very high black level from the cards gamma control being turned up. When doing that it looks very similar to your digital, that also has elevated black levels.
Got you again;; 
So look at the other mud pictures in the group and notice how deep the black is compared to the one you were hoping to sell off as one of mine...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ElTopo wrote: | | I usually do not watch 'zoomed in' movie fragments. |
I take it you don't watch quarter-scale zoomed-out still images of movies either, but that doesn't stop people from posting THOSE kinds of screenshots.
SC
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mp20748 wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | And a small picture like this the crt looks good but you see that the JVC X500 is much better.
And also that you cant tell anything about black level, because after the new picture form MP the JVC black level is better and holds black better than the CRT. SO again you cant tell from pictures, but give a indication.
And the difference in a side by side test is like the spaceship background |
Oh, I forgot to mention that the bottom picture is NOT my CRT. Still at your tricks again..
By the way that last shop I posted has the gamma on the Moome card cranked up real high. I did that to get you guys excited when you saw it. And also knew you would be doing a comparison. But keep in mind also, the CRT shot I posted just the other ones had more red in the fresh. You're sidekick said it was over saturation, It's really just the opposite of the flat colors your projector displays.
So even before you tweaked the picture, I want you to know the image I posted has very high black level from the cards gamma control being turned up. When doing that it looks very similar to your digital, that also has elevated black levels.
Got you again;; |
Just copied it form the screenshot forum so not touched.
I was waiting for that hehe. But it's a much better look on it now. Looks like day picture like it is.
Why I saied that now the black level is better on the x500 was to prove that it's totaly bull to say that black level is better from a picture. Because you can't know. You can get a 100:1 projector look black.
And again all my pictures are untouched only downsized.
That's the fact. I do not need to fiks pictures you have to, but I hope you don't.
Last edited by Diddern on Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Diddern wrote: | This one so we can compare the marquee and the cine9.
But you wil struggle as hell. The more light you try to push to get detail you lose picture quality and black level. |
Why would anybody use that shot for comparison, when your projector is doing a terrible job capturing the content of the entire image.
It's really dumb to try and capture a section of a shot, when the shot itself does not contain any real black being displayed.
You guys have a lot to learn about these shots..
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ecrabb wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | I usually do not watch 'zoomed in' movie fragments. |
I take it you don't watch quarter-scale zoomed-out still images of movies either, but that doesn't stop people from posting THOSE kinds of screenshots.
SC |
That is so true, but this is only to point out that if you do a side by side test with the maxtuned CRT you still get enormous big difference and the crt do not look good when comparing. I was not the starter on zooming inn, but that was perfect because then you see it much more Clair and closer to how you see it when comparing. The difference will be shown like the spaceship part in the picture. Flat and boring compared and soft like VHS, but only if you compare.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mp20748 wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | And a small picture like this the crt looks good but you see that the JVC X500 is much better.
And also that you cant tell anything about black level, because after the new picture form MP the JVC black level is better and holds black better than the CRT. SO again you cant tell from pictures, but give a indication.
And the difference in a side by side test is like the spaceship background |
Oh, I forgot to mention that the bottom picture is NOT my CRT. Still at your tricks again..
By the way that last shop I posted has the gamma on the Moome card cranked up real high. I did that to get you guys excited when you saw it. And also knew you would be doing a comparison. But keep in mind also, the CRT shot I posted just the other ones had more red in the fresh. You're sidekick said it was over saturation, It's really just the opposite of the flat colors your projector displays.
So even before you tweaked the picture, I want you to know the image I posted has very high black level from the cards gamma control being turned up. When doing that it looks very similar to your digital, that also has elevated black levels.
Got you again;;
So look at the other mud pictures in the group and notice how deep the black is compared to the one you were hoping to sell off as one of mine... |
The bottom picture of the spaceship is not you..
This is yours and marked 9" crt. in the together picture.
What is wrong with this??? its just downloaded form the screenshot page and put together.
Last edited by Diddern on Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Diddern
Joined: 02 Jun 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Norway
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 8:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
But now I am going to the alps to ski so I hope to see what I ask for if not the case is closed.
And I like to know what kind of pictures can you take on a CRT 1080P that we can see? And explanations why.
One thing for shore VHS do not look god on my X500 that will maybe look better on a CRT. So I think one win CRT there.
Eltopo CINE9 picture.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 1640
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
My cinema is in the building process right now.
My Cine9 has brand new tubes and 1800 total hours that's normally the time to change a bulb in a digital.
I would not keep the Cine 9 if the picture is bad. It all depends on the HD material you feed.
Have fun skiing and think about getting a CRT again
_________________
Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
stridsvognen
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Diddern wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | The listed shot was posted to be a gift to Dildo.
If you compare it to the other shots in my last group, you'll notice that it's black is different. It's different, because the gamma on the Moome card was cranked way up to get it to show the gray the way it is. But if you notice in my other mud shots, they are beep black even in open sunlight..
 |
I give a sh*t if you use a dildo I saied that this picture look more correct. |
really.?
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tanwn1
Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 60
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 12:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
Technically speaking, i am not surprised if a digital should resolve better details and MTF since the signal path is all digital right? It's something like why are we all going into 'Digital' via HDMI connection rather then using component? Aren't we all also on the side of digital if you see it from the HDMI connection point of view? I will try to post shots of the Prometheus using my Barco Cine 9 and jvc X700 in the next 2days time if possible early. I will be using hdmi direct to moome v3 on a cine9 Frankly I do not expect the barco cine9 going through all the analogue stage to perform better than a digital jvc in terms of MTF, it's simply not possible. I am a CRT and Digital guy.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 8:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
| mp20748 wrote: | | Diddern wrote: | And a small picture like this the crt looks good but you see that the JVC X500 is much better.
And also that you cant tell anything about black level, because after the new picture form MP the JVC black level is better and holds black better than the CRT. SO again you cant tell from pictures, but give a indication.
And the difference in a side by side test is like the spaceship background |
Oh, I forgot to mention that the bottom picture is NOT my CRT. Still at your tricks again..
By the way that last shop I posted has the gamma on the Moome card cranked up real high. I did that to get you guys excited when you saw it. And also knew you would be doing a comparison. But keep in mind also, the CRT shot I posted just the other ones had more red in the fresh. You're sidekick said it was over saturation, It's really just the opposite of the flat colors your projector displays.
So even before you tweaked the picture, I want you to know the image I posted has very high black level from the cards gamma control being turned up. When doing that it looks very similar to your digital, that also has elevated black levels.
Got you again;;
So look at the other mud pictures in the group and notice how deep the black is compared to the one you were hoping to sell off as one of mine... |
So you put out picures that you have not taken yourself?? The picture is just copied from the screenshot tread and is untouched, I know because I copied it and sent it to Diddern. So to try to say Diddn tampered with it is totally wrong!
What gamma do you use with your CRT?? BD Movies is mastered a 2.2, but if you have batcave and a good projector you can run 2.4. The upside with 2.4 is you get a very good and dark picture and more depth in brighter scenes, but you can get slight blackcrush.
Anyway your original mud picture (it is a dayligh scene) is way to dark and has so much black crush it is unbelivable. if you watch a picture like that you loose a hell of a lot of detail. But as long as it is black it is ok??
And where are the different colors in the mud in your picture, there is quite a bit of brownish mud in his face, but i your original mud picture there is only black.
And what you say about he colors is just the same as almost everything you say here complete and utter bull. And just shows you have no idea of what you are talking about. I could easily make my JVC look the same as your CRT in colors, but it would not be the way the director inteded me to see the movie, and that is why I always keep my projectors calibrated at rec 709, D65 and gamma 2.35 (because I have the room and the projector to deal with it) because that is the standard the BD is mastered after. If you like oversturated colors it is of corse ok, but then you will not see colors like the director intended.
Got you again!
_________________
http://www.minhembio.com/21Andreas
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tanwn1
Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 60
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 12:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
ok, below are the pics of my barco cinemax (no mods using moome v3 gamma) and jvc x700 below pics. As you can see, I do not expect barco analogue stage to compete with a digital jvc in area of MTF and details, its simply not possible, but you can see my barco is not too bad without mods. I can't see the pic posted, can someone help to upload here?
baroc cinemax
[img]http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=1304[/img]
jvc x700
[img]http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=1305[/img]
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tanwn1
Joined: 08 Dec 2014
Posts: 60
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
Can someone help to post the pictures here instead of via a link? I am surprised my Barco cinemax without mods is not too bad against jvc x700. By the way I am using a Samsung note 4 to capture both image. Jvc x700 is without e shift. With e shift my Barco may get closer to jvc x700. But I salute jvc for its MTF and detail. It's amazing. I love my Barco cinemax and jvc x700. CRT and digital can coexist.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| tanwn1 wrote: | | Can someone help to post the pictures here instead of via a link? I am surprised my Barco cinemax without mods is not too bad against jvc x700. By the way I am using a Samsung note 4 to capture both image. Jvc x700 is without e shift. With e shift my Barco may get closer to jvc x700. But I salute jvc for its MTF and detail. It's amazing. I love my Barco cinemax and jvc x700. CRT and digital can coexist. |
When you are in the 'post a reply' page. scroll down and add the pictures as attachment, or put your the pictures up on a screen sharing service like photobucket or imageshack, then insert the direct links to the pictures as image (like you tried).
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
thewolfman
Joined: 28 Mar 2011
Posts: 1311
Location: Sweden
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
With warm hand I hand over the crown over to Barco! Congratulations are in order. 
I'm not sarcastic at all, on the contrary I'm interested to see how that landing close-up shot will live on with people trying to match it. It's a good shot they picked out. And as far as I'm concerned, and with the little that I know, that is the new benchmark to measure up against.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jbmeyer13
Joined: 03 Dec 2010
Posts: 1135
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ecrabb wrote: | | ElTopo wrote: | | I usually do not watch 'zoomed in' movie fragments. |
I take it you don't watch quarter-scale zoomed-out still images of movies either, but that doesn't stop people from posting THOSE kinds of screenshots.
SC |
LMAO- was waiting for someone to point that out. From a normal viewing distance on say a 100" diagonal screen I doubt most people would be able to differentiate ultra fine detail in a cross section of 3"; especially when the image is moving rather than static. Zooming out these ultra tiny areas is quite comical but carry on because if nothing this thread sure is hilarious.
_________________
Projector: Modded 9501LC ULtra- MP VIM, Vold VNB, ETECH LVPS, Silver VIM Cables, HD10F's & a V1 case!
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| tanwn1 wrote: | ok, below are the pics of my barco cinemax (no mods using moome v3 gamma) and jvc x700 below pics. As you can see, I do not expect barco analogue stage to compete with a digital jvc in area of MTF and details, its simply not possible, but you can see my barco is not too bad without mods. I can't see the pic posted, can someone help to upload here?
baroc cinemax
[img]http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=1304[/img]
jvc x700
[img]http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=1305[/img] |
These pictures are way to overexposed and if we use MPīs conclution your barco does not have any blacklevel at all. 
But you are the first to admit a CRT can not compete with a digital in the area of MTF and details. Stridvognen and MP still belives the 3 million mhz Marquee to be better these areas.
If this is how you see it on screen you have to adjust your gamma and brightness, other than that there is easy to see the difference in detail ans sharpness. The JVC eats the CRT for breakfast! If you took the shot with a better camera your X700 would have shown the pixels very clear, I know this as I have taken this photo with my X500 with and without e-shift on. The difference with e-shift on and off is a difference in noise and sharpness (it is softer with the e-shift on), detail is about the same with it on or off.
Here are your pictures:
| Description: |
|
| Filesize: |
73.15 KB |
| Viewed: |
2934 Time(s) |
|
| Description: |
|
| Filesize: |
75.86 KB |
| Viewed: |
2934 Time(s) |
|
_________________
http://www.minhembio.com/21Andreas
Last edited by Andreas21 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:58 pm; edited 4 times in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Andreas21
Joined: 02 Oct 2013
Posts: 582
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Here is what is looks like with e-shift off, and calibrated to the correct standards with a 2.35 power gamma. Mine is maby a tad dark compared to what is shown on screen.
| Description: |
|
| Filesize: |
196.54 KB |
| Viewed: |
2926 Time(s) |
|
_________________
http://www.minhembio.com/21Andreas
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
