CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[Curt Palme]

So I'm throwing this one out here for discussion, I have not responded to my customer's email at the very bottom. I do have a response formulated, but won't send it until I hear some opinions here.

A guy from North Carolina sent me an NEC XG 85 system board with an EF error code. That’s the code that needs the EEPROM reset. I got the board, quoted him $250 incl return shipping, a pretty standard price to repair or replace a board like this. . I repaired the board, and tried to save his programming within the board, but since the EEPROM was corrupt, I couldn’t load in his corrupted data back into his working board without getting the same EF error. Ditto for loading his data into another system board.

So, I told him that he’d have to start from scratch, and he was fine with that, including instructions that I’d walk him through re white balance, and the G2 instructions on the site if he needed assistance.

So I send the board back. Everything so far is routine. About 10 days later, he emails saying that he didn’t get the box. USPS shows it as being delivered, I emailed him the USPS delivery confirmation. He checks with neighbours and the post office, no one has seen it. Now, I had a couple of system boards here, but they both are bad. The non XG85/LC boards are different, so right now I don’t have a working system board to replace the lost one.

Now, here’s where it gets weird: About a week later I get a call from a guy with the same name in Arizona. He claims that he has a box that I sent to my customer in NC, and asks me if I want it sent back or sent to the right guy. I tell him to send me an email, as I was on the road, and a couple of days later I get an email from him, asking me for the right address. I cut and paste it from my customer's Paypal payment, which is also how I make my mailing labels, There's no handwritten addresses, it's all printed via computer, directly from their Paypal payment . I hear nothing back. Another 10 days goes by, my customer says he still doesn’t have his board back. IN the meantime, I call USPS and they say that even if I had insured the box (which I didn’t), they consider it delivered as that’s what the tracking system says. According to the lady I talked to at USPS, they did their job, the box has been delivered. Any amount of insurance would have been null and void since the box wasn't damaged or lost according to their system.

So I email the guy in Az. again. No answer. A second time, no answer. I forward his email to my customer, who also tries to contact him. Nada. So my customer emails me on Monday, it’s about 6 weeks now, saying I have until Friday to resolve this. I tell him the best that I can do is that as soon as I locate another system board, I’ll send it to him. Thus the post yesterday here on the forum. I'm pretty sure I'll locate one in the next 6-8 weeks, the minor complication being is that I'm out of town for most of October.

Well, today I get the below:

Attached is my resolution letter. I indicated on September 9 that I needed a resolution this week, and since there is no resolution I must proceed with this step. In case you can't open the attached document, the letter is shown below.\

September 13, 2013

Mr. Curt Palme
Sound Solutions
344-19567 Fraser Hwy
Surrey, BC V3S 9A4 Canada

Dear Mr. Palme:
On July 24, 2013 I agreed to your terms of “fix or replace” at a cost of $250 including shipping for a NEC model number PWC-4270 72142702 System PWB with serial number xx2-389EA4 where the xx numbers were ink smudged and unreadable. I shipped the board to you via UPS ground with insurance on July 25, 2013. On August 4, 2013 you emailed me to indicate that the board was fixed so a replacement was not needed. There was no physical damage, and the flash EEPROM just needed to be re-programmed. You requested $250 via PayPal, and I fulfilled the PayPal payment on August 4, 2013 which was paid thru PayPal via my credit card. I received your email on August 5, 2013 that the package was shipped via USPS.
Unfortunately, your shipment was never delivered to my address. USPS delivery confirmation, based on the tracking number you emailed me, shows it was delivered on August 10, however I never received it. After exhaustive calls with USPS, and emails with you, you replied to me via email that you received a call from a XXX located in Arizona that claims he has the package. You provided me an email showing your correspondence with him on August 27, 2013 with regards to instructions on getting the shipment sent to me via air, and it appeared he agreed and would send you the receipt for reimbursement of shipping cost. I have not received the package as of September 13, 2013. I have sent emails to rXXX@gmail.com that you indicated was the person that has the package in Arizona with no responses back. I also found his cell phone number on his Facebook page, and called it with no answer. I left a voicemail, and he has not called me back or made contact via email.
On September 9, 2013 I sent an email to you requesting that this issue be resolved by the end of the week. Your response so far has been that USPS shows it was delivered, and you can’t control USPS. Unfortunately, since you didn’t insure the package, the cost burden for damage or lost packages falls on the shipper and not USPS. The person in Arizona that received the package is not obligated to do anything. Your response also states that you don’t have any more boards of this type, and one might show up sometime soon. I find that option unacceptable, and the claim that you don’t have anything to replace it with doesn’t meet the original terms I agreed to where you were prepared to fix or replace. This could potentially fall under the Federal Trade Commission Act Section 5: Unfair or Deceptive Acts or Practices. Yes, they do go after businesses operating from Canada that do business with US citizens.
To resolve the problem, I would appreciate a refund of $250 via PayPal plus an additional $250 via PayPal to replace my board that was lost and uninsured by you. I no longer have my board, that I could send to someone else to repair or replace, and since the only thing wrong with it was it needed to be re-programmed, the value of the board is considered to be higher than one with physical damage, and apparently per your terms the value for a replacement is $250.
I look forward to your reply and a resolution to my problem. I will wait until 5PM your time on Monday, September 16, 2013 before seeking third-party assistance with possible complaint filed with the FTC. Please contact me via email (XXXX@gmail.com) or phone (XXX home, XXXXmobile) with your response.
Sincerely,


As I said above, I have a response based on the tone of his letter, but I'll keep this neutral and am just stating the facts until I get some opinions here.

[Curt Palme]

So I'm throwing this one out here for discussion, I have not responded to my customer's email at the very bottom. I do have a response formulated, but won't send it until I hear some opinions here.

A guy from North Carolina sent me an NEC XG 85 system board with an EF error code. That’s the code that needs the EEPROM reset. I got the board, quoted him $250 incl return shipping, a pretty standard price to repair or replace a board like this. . I repaired the board, and tried to save his programming within the board, but since the EEPROM was corrupt, I couldn’t load in his corrupted data back into his working board without getting the same EF error. Ditto for loading his data into another system board.

So, I told him that he’d have to start from scratch, and he was fine with that, including instructions that I’d walk him through re white balance, and the G2 instructions on the site if he needed assistance.

So I send the board back. Everything so far is routine. About 10 days later, he emails saying that he didn’t get the box. USPS shows it as being delivered, I emailed him the USPS delivery confirmation. He checks with neighbours and the post office, no one has seen it. Now, I had a couple of system boards here, but they both are bad. The non XG85/LC boards are different, so right now I don’t have a working system board to replace the lost one.

Now, here’s where it gets weird: About a week later I get a call from a guy with the same name in Arizona. He claims that he has a box that I sent to my customer in NC, and asks me if I want it sent back or sent to the right guy. I tell him to send me an email, as I was on the road, and a couple of days later I get an email from him, asking me for the right address. I cut and paste it from my customer's Paypal payment, which is also how I make my mailing labels, There's no handwritten addresses, it's all printed via computer, directly from their Paypal payment . I hear nothing back. Another 10 days goes by, my customer says he still doesn’t have his board back. IN the meantime, I call USPS and they say that even if I had insured the box (which I didn’t), they consider it delivered as that’s what the tracking system says. According to the lady I talked to at USPS, they did their job, the box has been delivered. Any amount of insurance would have been null and void since the box wasn't damaged or lost according to their system.

So I email the guy in Az. again. No answer. A second time, no answer. I forward his email to my customer, who also tries to contact him. Nada. So my customer emails me on Monday, it’s about 6 weeks now, saying I have until Friday to resolve this. I tell him the best that I can do is that as soon as I locate another system board, I’ll send it to him. Thus the post yesterday here on the forum. I'm pretty sure I'll locate one in the next 6-8 weeks, the minor complication being is that I'm out of town for most of October.

Well, today I get the below:

Attached is my resolution letter. I indicated on September 9 that I needed a resolution this week, and since there is no resolution I must proceed with this step. In case you can't open the attached document, the letter is shown below.\

September 13, 2013

Mr. Curt Palme
Sound Solutions
344-19567 Fraser Hwy
Surrey, BC V3S 9A4 Canada

Dear Mr. Palme:
On July 24, 2013 I agreed to your terms of “fix or replace” at a cost of $250 including shipping for a NEC model number PWC-4270 72142702 System PWB with serial number xx2-389EA4 where the xx numbers were ink smudged and unreadable. I shipped the board to you via UPS ground with insurance on July 25, 2013. On August 4, 2013 you emailed me to indicate that the board was fixed so a replacement was not needed. There was no physical damage, and the flash EEPROM just needed to be re-programmed. You requested $250 via PayPal, and I fulfilled the PayPal payment on August 4, 2013 which was paid thru PayPal via my credit card. I received your email on August 5, 2013 that the package was shipped via USPS.
Unfortunately, your shipment was never delivered to my address. USPS delivery confirmation, based on the tracking number you emailed me, shows it was delivered on August 10, however I never received it. After exhaustive calls with USPS, and emails with you, you replied to me via email that you received a call from a XXX located in Arizona that claims he has the package. You provided me an email showing your correspondence with him on August 27, 2013 with regards to instructions on getting the shipment sent to me via air, and it appeared he agreed and would send you the receipt for reimbursement of shipping cost. I have not received the package as of September 13, 2013. I have sent emails to rXXX@gmail.com that you indicated was the person that has the package in Arizona with no responses back. I also found his cell phone number on his Facebook page, and called it with no answer. I left a voicemail, and he has not called me back or made contact via email.
On September 9, 2013 I sent an email to you requesting that this issue be resolved by the end of the week. Your response so far has been that USPS shows it was delivered, and you can’t control USPS. Unfortunately, since you didn’t insure the package, the cost burden for damage or lost packages falls on the shipper and not USPS. The person in Arizona that received the package is not obligated to do anything. Your response also states that you don’t have any more boards of this type, and one might show up sometime soon. I find that option unacceptable, and the claim that you don’t have anything to replace it with doesn’t meet the original terms I agreed to where you were prepared to fix or replace. This could potentially fall under the Federal Trade Commission Act Section 5: Unfair or Deceptive Acts or Practices. Yes, they do go after businesses operating from Canada that do business with US citizens.
To resolve the problem, I would appreciate a refund of $250 via PayPal plus an additional $250 via PayPal to replace my board that was lost and uninsured by you. I no longer have my board, that I could send to someone else to repair or replace, and since the only thing wrong with it was it needed to be re-programmed, the value of the board is considered to be higher than one with physical damage, and apparently per your terms the value for a replacement is $250.
I look forward to your reply and a resolution to my problem. I will wait until 5PM your time on Monday, September 16, 2013 before seeking third-party assistance with possible complaint filed with the FTC. Please contact me via email (XXXX@gmail.com) or phone (XXX home, XXXXmobile) with your response.
Sincerely,


As I said above, I have a response based on the tone of his letter, but I'll keep this neutral and am just stating the facts until I get some opinions here.

[hal]

I had a similar situation when shipping a product to my customer in New York. The customer didn't want to pay FedEx. And wanted it shipped USPS. The customer had his business on Madison Ave. The problem occurred when the flat rate package was delivered on a Saturday. The business was closed, but they had a lobby outside of the elevator. The USPS delivered it.. But it was not there on Monday morning.

My customer was pissed off, and wanted me to send out a replacement item. I said that it was insured but USPS denied the claim. PLEASE NOTE: Any items shipped with USPS MUST have a Signature Confirmation.. This protects the shipper. The courier has to get a signature at the address. The customer and I went round and round. We ended up splitting the loss 50/50.. Needless to say, I spend the $2.75 for the Signature Confirmation every USPS package.

[Zolzar]

I have had three instances where USPS has marked an item as delivered to my house but the items were never delivered. The post master at my local PO investigated these instances and found that one package sat in the back of my local carriers truck for a week that was marked as delivered and the other two were sitting at the post office marked as delivered. I refuse to use USPS for anything but have no choice in the matter when purchasing via online retailers or eBay.

[draganm]

wow, that's a tough one. To the best of my knowledge From the POV of paypal ,You are required to show proof of delivery, so you're in the clear there. You're also covered under any legal problems because there was no fraud committed or even attempted.
That does leave the "what's the ethical thing to do" question. the customers request for $500. is BS, no court of law would award that. at most, you would be liable for the value of the board presumably since it was your responsibility from the time it left your shop, but the value of the repair work is yours. There' s so many CHEAP solutions here though, which you guys could split between you.

First off there's a pair of G70's on Charlotte Craigslist , $225. for BOTH of them with moome cards. If he's running and XG with an RGB signal this would be a small upgrade to HDMI (same tubes and lenses, a little quieter).

If he wants to stay with NEC, there's a pair of 6PGX's in Charlotte for $125. for both, one is mint with 100 hours. These are on E-bay from a forum member.

There's a complete set of XG-135 boards on flea bay for $80. OBO each including the system board. If it was a running machine I would offer the guy 50 bucks and ship that board to the customer. If it wasn't, offer him 20 bucks and ship it to you for testing.

either way, I don't see this as a $500. problem, it's a $100. problem at most.

[draganm]

If it was me I would offer to buy him the PGX's , he's responsible for picking them up, and call it done. If he's adamant about keeping the XG, then I would buy the board off e-bay or find a complete XG, they're practically free now.

http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?projcrta&1370354666&&&/Runco-DTV-991

[Curt Palme]

Thanks Dragan, I'll chime in now.

My issue isn't with the possible loss of package, it's the followup letter. As I posted, the whole repair was routine until he said that he never got the package. So, a few things:

-I ship about 1000 pieces of mail and packages with USPS every year. No exaggeration. I dropped UPS and FedEx years ago due to countless smashed packages and their utter refusal to honor insurance that was bought and paid for. Now, in all the years I've been dealing with USPS, they have yet to lose a package. Heck, they even shipped back a box that was undeliverable to Italy because the buyer never bothered updating his Paypal address. But,I've got no issue with a potential lost package. Stuff happens.

-As I posted above as well, the system board for the XG85 is custom to the XG85, it's called a PWC4270. the more common PWC 4063 in all other non LC XGs will not work, I've tried. The PWC 4188 found in the XGLC sets will work with a minor mod.

-right now, I do not have a working system board for the XG85. All my spares have sync issues or scrambled menus, etc. I do get them in regularly though, as I'm scrapping a lot of XGs, and as you say Dragan, one is sure to come up on Videogon or eBay. No issues buying/sending a customer a replacement board when I have one in.

Now, let's pick up the story to where the box gets 'lost'. First off, let's say that for some reason the address part of the ship to mailing label gets ripped off the box, but the name does not. I'll call my customer 'Mark'. Who the heck at USPS is going to come up with an address for Mark in Arizona, even if Mark's name is the only thing on the box? USPS' policy is to 'return to sender' if the ship-to address is incomplete. So that doesn't make sense. But, let's continue...from that mystery phone call that I get from 'Mark' in Arizona.

So let's say that you're Mark in Arizona and you get a box from a Sound Solutions in Surrey BC. As I said, I computer print out all my mailing labels with a large 'ship to' and a smaller 'shipped from' address, completely covered in clear packing tape. It's near impossible to rip said mailing label off the box. But, let's continue. So you, Mark, get a box in the mail, and you take the time to look up Sound Solutions in Surrey BC to get the phone number, and you make a long distance call and get a hold of me, and then you also send me an email wanting the address to send the package to. I send him that info, and then, you drop off the face of the planet. No return phone calls, no return emails, nada.

if you're a scammer, or simply someone that isn't going to forward a package as he said he would, why would the guy take the time to call and email me in the first place? Something isn't adding up here.

Now, to top it off, I get a nasty email from the original customer, who now wants damages in the amount of twice what he paid for the repair?

What this is reeking of is a customer who has found that replacement XG system boards are fairly hard to find, and now he wants to threaten/blackmail/extort a second free board out of me based on his letter. Playing devil's advocate here, my customer did indeed get his original board back, but now wants a backup board.

For now, I'm sticking with my offer. I will hunt for a replacement board, and I'm sure I'll get one by the end of October. I will assume, although at this point it seems doubtful, that the customer never did get his original board, so I'm willing to send out another one once I get one that works.

I concur Dragan with your assessment of the customer wanting damages. Worst case scenario, let's say that I couldn't fix the board, and it turned out I had no working spares. I would have charged him $50 to test and ship back his defective board, which to the best of my knowledge, no one else out there can fix these system boards. Will respond via email to the customer tomorrow, I'll read whatever other posts show up here in the next 24 hours.

[Curt Palme]

Thanks Dragan, I'll chime in now.

My issue isn't with the possible loss of package, it's the followup letter. As I posted, the whole repair was routine until he said that he never got the package. So, a few things:

-I ship about 1000 pieces of mail and packages with USPS every year. No exaggeration. I dropped UPS and FedEx years ago due to countless smashed packages and their utter refusal to honor insurance that was bought and paid for. Now, in all the years I've been dealing with USPS, they have yet to lose a package. Heck, they even shipped back a box that was undeliverable to Italy because the buyer never bothered updating his Paypal address. But,I've got no issue with a potential lost package. Stuff happens.

-As I posted above as well, the system board for the XG85 is custom to the XG85, it's called a PWC4270. the more common PWC 4063 in all other non LC XGs will not work, I've tried. The PWC 4188 found in the XGLC sets will work with a minor mod.

-right now, I do not have a working system board for the XG85. All my spares have sync issues or scrambled menus, etc. I do get them in regularly though, as I'm scrapping a lot of XGs, and as you say Dragan, one is sure to come up on Videogon or eBay. No issues buying/sending a customer a replacement board when I have one in.

Now, let's pick up the story to where the box gets 'lost'. First off, let's say that for some reason the address part of the ship to mailing label gets ripped off the box, but the name does not. I'll call my customer 'Mark'. Who the heck at USPS is going to come up with an address for Mark in Arizona, even if Mark's name is the only thing on the box? USPS' policy is to 'return to sender' if the ship-to address is incomplete. So that doesn't make sense. But, let's continue...from that mystery phone call that I get from 'Mark' in Arizona.

So let's say that you're Mark in Arizona and you get a box from a Sound Solutions in Surrey BC. As I said, I computer print out all my mailing labels with a large 'ship to' and a smaller 'shipped from' address, completely covered in clear packing tape. It's near impossible to rip said mailing label off the box. But, let's continue. So you, Mark, get a box in the mail, and you take the time to look up Sound Solutions in Surrey BC to get the phone number, and you make a long distance call and get a hold of me, and then you also send me an email wanting the address to send the package to. I send him that info, and then, you drop off the face of the planet. No return phone calls, no return emails, nada.

if you're a scammer, or simply someone that isn't going to forward a package as he said he would, why would the guy take the time to call and email me in the first place? Something isn't adding up here.

Now, to top it off, I get a nasty email from the original customer, who now wants damages in the amount of twice what he paid for the repair?

What this is reeking of is a customer who has found that replacement XG system boards are fairly hard to find, and now he wants to threaten/blackmail/extort a second free board out of me based on his letter. Playing devil's advocate here, my customer did indeed get his original board back, but now wants a backup board.

For now, I'm sticking with my offer. I will hunt for a replacement board, and I'm sure I'll get one by the end of October. I will assume, although at this point it seems doubtful, that the customer never did get his original board, so I'm willing to send out another one once I get one that works.

I concur Dragan with your assessment of the customer wanting damages. Worst case scenario, let's say that I couldn't fix the board, and it turned out I had no working spares. I would have charged him $50 to test and ship back his defective board, which to the best of my knowledge, no one else out there can fix these system boards. Will respond via email to the customer tomorrow, I'll read whatever other posts show up here in the next 24 hours.

[Zebu Fellenz]

Sounds like a scammer to me.

When "Mark in Arizona" called you what was his area code? If it's a cell phone or worse a NC area code I'd write the guy off as a scammer. You can also look-up the IP address "Mark's" email was sent from and see if that matches his supposed location.

What does the USPS tracking show? You should be able to go online and see if the package ever veered off course towards Arizona. My gut feeling agrees with you, I'm betting he got the package, decided he didn't want to pay for it (for whatever reasons) and orchestrated the whole "Mark in Arizona" act and is now making big sounding "FTC" threats to try to extort money from you above and beyond a refund.

I might be completely wrong but it sounds like a scam to me.

In the future you should tell all customers up front that you're not responsible for anything lost in shipment and that they are responsible for buying insurance if they feel it's needed.

-Erik

[Curt Palme]

I have the rough day that the guy from Arizona called, but I get 30-40 calls a day, so it dropped off the end of my phone memory. I get the phone bill in on the 20th of the month, so it should be here next week and I'll check.

I get nothing in the email header when I click 'properties', so unless I'm doing it wrong, it would be nice to see if someone from Az did actually call and email me. Still, if this is a scam, then you never know how far the scammer will go.

Funny, I just got a call from a guy on the east coast scrapping a bunch of XGs. He's checking to see if he has an appropriate system board.

[Curt Palme]

I have the rough day that the guy from Arizona called, but I get 30-40 calls a day, so it dropped off the end of my phone memory. I get the phone bill in on the 20th of the month, so it should be here next week and I'll check.

I get nothing in the email header when I click 'properties', so unless I'm doing it wrong, it would be nice to see if someone from Az did actually call and email me. Still, if this is a scam, then you never know how far the scammer will go.

Funny, I just got a call from a guy on the east coast scrapping a bunch of XGs. He's checking to see if he has an appropriate system board.

[digitalayon]

Curt.....Someone with the same name? SCAM BRO!!! The other guy is either in cahoots and are trying to get more from you or the same guy has two addresses.

[draganm]

[zaphod]

[Curt Palme]

Sorry, I use Outlook. Here's what I found after some digging:

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Subject: Package
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Content preview: Hi this is Randall Vogt Let me know where you want me to mail
this package.... Hi this is Randall Vogt Let me know where you want me to
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[206.225.20.162 listed in bb.barracudacentral.org]
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X-CHA: v=1.1 cv=6jkfEoj2u7Yj9etNrzOg8LH7MfGxzbc6Xn0EJkmycus= c=1 sm=1
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a=zE7RolXeqPMA:10 a=CxQU8S3nryls5r8B3V4N1Q==:117
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X-WHL: SLR

[Curt Palme]

Sorry, I use Outlook. Here's what I found after some digging:

X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Envelope-From: rvogt4422@gmail.com
Return-Path: <rvogt4422@gmail.com>
Received: from s6.mail.rcig.net (s6.mail.rcig.net [216.87.38.206])
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Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2013 10:25:43 -0700
Message-ID: <CALJg8YE+vWLdveugSkvDbGhH-R8LvYH-mjLrF9OM=S5me2F_Pw@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Package
From: randall vogt <rvogt4422@gmail.com>
To: curt@curtpalme.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7b676fd09e4b3d04e4f129f9
X-Spam-Score: 1.6 (+)
X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "s6.mail.rcig.net", has
identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message
has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label
similar future email. If you have any questions, see
the administrator of that system for details.

Content preview: Hi this is Randall Vogt Let me know where you want me to mail
this package.... Hi this is Randall Vogt Let me know where you want me to
mail this package.... [...]

Content analysis details: (1.6 points, 8.0 required)

pts rule name description
---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
-0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no
trust
[206.225.20.162 listed in list.dnswl.org]
0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider
(rvogt4422[at]gmail.com)
0.2 FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT Envelope-from freemail username ends in
digit (rvogt4422[at]gmail.com)
0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message
-0.0 BAYES_20 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 5 to 20%
[score: 0.0856]
-0.1 DKIM_VALID_AU Message has a valid DKIM or DK signature from author's
domain
0.1 DKIM_SIGNED Message has a DKIM or DK signature, not necessarily valid
-0.1 DKIM_VALID Message has at least one valid DKIM or DK signature
1.4 RCVD_IN_BRBL_LASTEXT RBL: RCVD_IN_BRBL_LASTEXT
[206.225.20.162 listed in bb.barracudacentral.org]
X-CSC: 0
X-CHA: v=1.1 cv=6jkfEoj2u7Yj9etNrzOg8LH7MfGxzbc6Xn0EJkmycus= c=1 sm=1
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a=zE7RolXeqPMA:10 a=CxQU8S3nryls5r8B3V4N1Q==:117
X-CTCH-Spam: Unknown
X-CTCH-RefID: str=0001.0A020207.521CE122.0254,ss=1,re=0.000,recu=0.000,reip=0.000,cl=1,cld=1,fgs=0
X-WHL: SLR

[Elaine Benes]

Probably a scam.

Let him threaten you all he likes, there isn't any government agency that will do ANYTHING over a dispute of a paltry(relatively) $250. ....

Any "action" he may think he can take over it will undoubtedly cost a lot more than he could ever hope to recover.

Is the USPS like Canada Post where if you buy the "Signature Required" you are totally insured against exactly this type of situation ? I've had a similar experience, and the purchase of that "Signature Required" saved me over $500. on a set of GT17 lenses...

[Krazed]

If you guys want to decipher the header, check through this: Header Info

As for what it says, essentially, since he uses gmail it can't be tracked to his IP without Gmails help.

Outside of that, the email address seems random, like a lot of scammers do use. But that's not to say it is.

That's just an observation.

Good luck!

[km987654]

I cannot see how this is your problem rather its a USPS problem assuming the package was correctly addressed. There doesn't seem to be any dispute that you did post it and after that how is it your problem??

[HogPilot]

[CIR Engineering]

Wait, but did you put insurance on the return shipment Curt? I thought that you said that you did not.

USPS "delivers" my packages to my neighbors all the time... it's ridiculous. One of my clients sent me a G90 YA board a few months back with $1200 insurance on it with signature required. The package was "delivered" without signature and it was not delivered to my address. USPS was frantically looking for the package and they never found it. About a week later my neighbors from the next city block over brought me two packages from USPS that were delivered to their house and that included the YA board. Nobody had signed for it.

I never told USPS that the package was found and I felt like claiming the insurance on the shipment, but I didn't. As far as USPS knows the package was never delivered and they never cared.

Trouble with USPS is that in some places it is very good and reliable, but in others it's just not. In Chicago USPS is very poor.

craigr

[Curt Palme]

No, no insurance. As I said above though, USPS's stance is that according to them it's delivered, and no amount of insurance that I could put on it would change that.

I'm formulating a response letter that I'll post here shortly. I'm linking the anonymous customer to this thread, he can choose to participate if he wishes to.

[Curt Palme]

No, no insurance. As I said above though, USPS's stance is that according to them it's delivered, and no amount of insurance that I could put on it would change that.

I'm formulating a response letter that I'll post here shortly. I'm linking the anonymous customer to this thread, he can choose to participate if he wishes to.

[Curt Palme]

My response:

344-19567 Fraser Hwy
Surrey BC
V3S9A4

Sept 15, 2013

XXXX
XXXXXXX
XXXX, NC

Dear Mr XXXXX,

Thank you for your letter of Sept 13, 2013 regarding the repair to your NEC system board that our company completed for you and sent back to you on August 5, 2013, that you claim you never received, although USPS shows that the box was delivered to you. I wish to clarify a few things in response to said letter.

- At the time that we first spoke, I did indeed have two spare system boards, but while I was testing/repairing your board, I also tested those spare boards. Both turned out to have issues. I don’t misrepresent how I do business.

-we don’t have any disagreement about the repair and the fact that it was sent back, but you claim that you never received the board back. To this end, I respond:

-I ship between 1000 and 1500 pieces of mail and packages through USPS every year for the last 10+ years. To date, USPS has not lost a single package. Any package not deliverable has always been returned to me. That’s not to say that a lost package isn’t possible of course, but to date it has not happened.

I will also add the following:

- My address labels are printed on a laser printer. I cut and paste the address right from your Paypal payment, so that there is no mistake with the ship-to address. The company return address is also clearly printed on the label. I then cover the entire address label with clear packing tape that securely adheres it to the shipping box. It is near impossible for the address label to be damaged in shipping.

-I did talk with USPS on Friday regarding their insurance and delivery policies. Let’s assume for a minute that somehow the address label got damaged, and only your name appeared on the ship-to label. It is USPS’ policy to then return the package to the sender. USPS will not, and has no reason to find a random person in a different state to send the package to. USPS considers the box to have been delivered, and no amount of insurance that I could have purchased on the package would reimburse you nor I at this point.

So based on what transpired with the telephone call that I got from a Mr XXXXX in Arizona, with a followup email via Gmail that cannot be traced without Gmail’s help, here’s what is to be believed at this point:

-your package was not delivered to you, instead, somehow, it ended up at a Mr XXXXX place in Arizona.
- The Arizona Mr XXXXX takes the time to google our company phone number which was not on the package, calls me, and offers to return the package, or to send it to you. He then sends me an email to get the correct address. I send him your address and offer to pay him not only for shipping, but also for his time to go to the post office.
-I then hear nothing from this gentleman. You claim you tracked down his phone number, and yet he doesn’t respond to either of our emails or your phone calls.
- I then get your letter from August 13 where you are not only demanding a full refund of your $250 repair, but also additional damages of $250.

I had offered to locate another system board for you, and to send it to you one as soon as I find one. These are not parts that are easily found, since the NEC projector has been discontinued since 2004, and there are none currently available for sale on eBay. I do however run across these boards on a regular basis, and would expect to see one before the end of October.

Regarding the tone of your letter however, I am a big proponent of the phrase ‘the customer is always right’. Based on your demands of restitution over and above the basic cost of the repair, I can only surmise that you have actually received the repaired board back, as indicated by the USPS delivery confirmation, and that for some reason you are looking for a free repair and/or a second spare board.

Let me make one thing perfectly clear: I will not be bullied, threatened or blackmailed into sending you a refund or damages, or a spare board. I believe the scenario of a Mr XXXXX receiving your board in Arizona is ludicrous and completely unbelievable. I now temporarily rescinding the offer of sending you a replacement board. I will allow you to pursue the legal avenues that you outlined in your letter, and I welcome any inquiries by any and all agencies that you wish to contact.

I will add, if you think I am engaging in any unfair or unscrupulous business practices, you may be interested that I have posted your letter and the issues surrounding it on my website forum for public viewing. I have left out your name and address to keep you anonymous. Feel free to sign up on the forum if you wish to add anything to the thread which I am linking to you here:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=389788#389788

I will continue to look for a spare working NEC XG 85 system board, as I need one for stock regardless. I may reconsider my offer to send you a replacement board should you change your stance.

Cordially,

Curt Palme

[Curt Palme]

My response:

344-19567 Fraser Hwy
Surrey BC
V3S9A4

Sept 15, 2013

XXXX
XXXXXXX
XXXX, NC

Dear Mr XXXXX,

Thank you for your letter of Sept 13, 2013 regarding the repair to your NEC system board that our company completed for you and sent back to you on August 5, 2013, that you claim you never received, although USPS shows that the box was delivered to you. I wish to clarify a few things in response to said letter.

- At the time that we first spoke, I did indeed have two spare system boards, but while I was testing/repairing your board, I also tested those spare boards. Both turned out to have issues. I don’t misrepresent how I do business.

-we don’t have any disagreement about the repair and the fact that it was sent back, but you claim that you never received the board back. To this end, I respond:

-I ship between 1000 and 1500 pieces of mail and packages through USPS every year for the last 10+ years. To date, USPS has not lost a single package. Any package not deliverable has always been returned to me. That’s not to say that a lost package isn’t possible of course, but to date it has not happened.

I will also add the following:

- My address labels are printed on a laser printer. I cut and paste the address right from your Paypal payment, so that there is no mistake with the ship-to address. The company return address is also clearly printed on the label. I then cover the entire address label with clear packing tape that securely adheres it to the shipping box. It is near impossible for the address label to be damaged in shipping.

-I did talk with USPS on Friday regarding their insurance and delivery policies. Let’s assume for a minute that somehow the address label got damaged, and only your name appeared on the ship-to label. It is USPS’ policy to then return the package to the sender. USPS will not, and has no reason to find a random person in a different state to send the package to. USPS considers the box to have been delivered, and no amount of insurance that I could have purchased on the package would reimburse you nor I at this point.

So based on what transpired with the telephone call that I got from a Mr XXXXX in Arizona, with a followup email via Gmail that cannot be traced without Gmail’s help, here’s what is to be believed at this point:

-your package was not delivered to you, instead, somehow, it ended up at a Mr XXXXX place in Arizona.
- The Arizona Mr XXXXX takes the time to google our company phone number which was not on the package, calls me, and offers to return the package, or to send it to you. He then sends me an email to get the correct address. I send him your address and offer to pay him not only for shipping, but also for his time to go to the post office.
-I then hear nothing from this gentleman. You claim you tracked down his phone number, and yet he doesn’t respond to either of our emails or your phone calls.
- I then get your letter from August 13 where you are not only demanding a full refund of your $250 repair, but also additional damages of $250.

I had offered to locate another system board for you, and to send it to you one as soon as I find one. These are not parts that are easily found, since the NEC projector has been discontinued since 2004, and there are none currently available for sale on eBay. I do however run across these boards on a regular basis, and would expect to see one before the end of October.

Regarding the tone of your letter however, I am a big proponent of the phrase ‘the customer is always right’. Based on your demands of restitution over and above the basic cost of the repair, I can only surmise that you have actually received the repaired board back, as indicated by the USPS delivery confirmation, and that for some reason you are looking for a free repair and/or a second spare board.

Let me make one thing perfectly clear: I will not be bullied, threatened or blackmailed into sending you a refund or damages, or a spare board. I believe the scenario of a Mr XXXXX receiving your board in Arizona is ludicrous and completely unbelievable. I now temporarily rescinding the offer of sending you a replacement board. I will allow you to pursue the legal avenues that you outlined in your letter, and I welcome any inquiries by any and all agencies that you wish to contact.

I will add, if you think I am engaging in any unfair or unscrupulous business practices, you may be interested that I have posted your letter and the issues surrounding it on my website forum for public viewing. I have left out your name and address to keep you anonymous. Feel free to sign up on the forum if you wish to add anything to the thread which I am linking to you here:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=389788#389788

I will continue to look for a spare working NEC XG 85 system board, as I need one for stock regardless. I may reconsider my offer to send you a replacement board should you change your stance.

Cordially,

Curt Palme

[zaphod]

three things - headers, my weird shipping story, response

1. what Krazed said - you just can't get location from those heasers as the first IP in the routing are 10.x.x.x number which are known as private IP numbers and meaningless outside of their private network. i use 10.x.x.x numbers at work, and they mean squat to anyone who looks at mail headers that might contain them. aggravating but that is what google gmail provides.

2. my weird story.

i had some video cable shipped to my delivery stop in WA state so i could walk it across the border and declare duty and taxes instead of paying a brokers rates and additional fees.

my shipping company is at "1234 first street" and a second different company set up shop at "1234 third street" - two blocks due south but exactly the same street number. both companies get mis-shipments all the time and while my company walks the two blocks, apparently the other company doesn't - they just hand it back to the next delivery truck from that shipper.

my cables went to the wrong place. sigh.

for about a week I chased it down and around and talked to the "other" shipping company to confirm that they'd given it back and then to endless FedEX agents/officers in Memphis only to finally have them admit that the pickup driver retired that day and FedEX has no idea where the package went or where it is.

it finally showed up after another week, but that was a bit annoying.

3 as for the response...

every time i get into a situation like this and I draft a long letter/response to the other party it ends up being a war of words. every sentence is potential for discussion/dispute on the facts, on who said what, on everything. so i now try really really hard to keep it short and to the point (i avoided saying "curt" )

so my response would be that USPS has confirmed that delivery happened on, and after that point it is out of your and USPS's hands. sorry.

And to be honest that is how i feel about the situation - i've been in exactly the same situation. When it happened to me, I didn't hold the shipper responsible, or even the other package place - i, as the receiver, took it up with FedEX.

I think that your recipient should follow up with USPS and understand that Curt's responsibility has ended with a confirmed USPS delivery.