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justin_f
Joined: 27 Nov 2010
Posts: 52
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:41 pm Post subject: my new toy... |
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hello everyone,
first i just wanted to say that i enjoy reading everyones posts here on this forum and i hope to contribute to the community like others have done.
i usually dont spend money on myself (saving for a house) but couldnt let this one go... i now think i have a problem! 
i bought the cine 9 that was on auction at trademe.co.nz last month. for those who may not have seen the auction, it has around 3000 hours on the set and is in excellent condition. i just received pictures of it this morning being packed for shipping (from nz to australia) and wanted to share.
hope it travels safely...
will take more photos when it arrives down under and probably ask for everyones opinion on what equipment to use to drive this thing!
thanks for looking.
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zaphod
Joined: 16 Jun 2006
Posts: 2002
Location: Cloverdale
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:06 am Post subject: |
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sweet machine mate, looks well packed.
_________________
walk gently. leave a good impression.
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dturco
Joined: 06 Feb 2009
Posts: 3778
Location: Eastern Shore Maryland
TV/Projector: Runco DLP VX-3000i Marquee 9500 parts doner
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:14 am Post subject: |
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Man that is some CYA packing there. Those pictures do not relay the true size of that P/J. Wait until you see it. Freakin huge machine.
Welcome to the 9" Club 
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Firefly rules. Can't stop the signal.
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:20 am Post subject: |
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Very nice! Top of the line!
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ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 1640
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 7:56 am Post subject: |
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Black Beatuy
ElTopo
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Barco Cine 9 the one and only
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prover
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
Posts: 166
Location: Stuttgart, Germany
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ilias
Joined: 20 Apr 2007
Posts: 116
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:34 am Post subject: |
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Very nice top machine!!!
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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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And what about...
YOU SUCK!?
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akajester
Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 934
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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beautiful! congratulations!
dale
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jantje112
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 328
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| Posted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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Nice catch! Is à cine affordable these days?
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justin_f
Joined: 27 Nov 2010
Posts: 52
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 11:41 am Post subject: |
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thanks all, looking forward to getting my hands on it.
i dont know whats affordable these days, but paying 1/16 of an $80k set makes me feel like i got a good deal, regardless of its age...
glad the set is now shared with the forum! wish i had more than one of these though...
i may need some professional callibration however - calibrating my cine 8 is not enjoyable - is anyone in melbourne recomended?
thanks!
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justin_f
Joined: 27 Nov 2010
Posts: 52
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 11:06 am Post subject: |
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so i've been searching for cine 9 setups on forums to get some ideas, but cant find more than a few threads. i was wondering what size screen to throw my newly acquired cine 9 at?
i walked into a projector sales shop the other day (the big picture people) and saw a jvc throwing a 120" blueray image of avatar and was impressed at the image and size (not quite film like and looked rather grainy, but thats my impression of blueray movies anyway). the salesman asked me if he could help. i wasnt going tobe completely honest, as i was looking to compare the crt with digital; i told him i was looking to buy a screen when he asked 'what projector are you using?'. i replied simply, 'a crt.' he quickly replied with a chuckle 'oh, then youre not interested in our overpriced jvc then!'. ha! so we got into a conversation about screens with high gain. i must admitt i was going in over my head as i hadnt researched anything on screens and this guy was lacing me up for a sale. i didnt want a small screen but was impressed with the 120" image i was looking at. am i going to lose the "pop" at 120" diagonal? anyway, he was asking a flat $1000.00aud for a fixed frame screen and i didnt have the heart to say i've seen cheaper on ebay, so i took his business card and left. what sort of gain and what brand should i look at for my cine 9?
i have found a local seller on ebay with a few hdfury 3's for sale. i think theyre the original ones, before the big hoo-ha about legality issues. not cheap, weighing in at $300.00aud. i figured i'll use one of these and a blueray player to feed the cine 9?
i have no idea what is required to feed the cine 9. anyone got good suggestions?
i do not currently own any hd equipment. the only device i have that has hdmi output is an xbox360. my daily tv is a 54" lg rear pro that accepts component! never had a display device that accepts hdmi...!
thanks for your time.
regards,
justin
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garyfritz
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 12088
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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Personally I think it would be a grave mistake to stretch a Cine 9 across a 120" screen. Kind of like Bilbo feeling "like butter scraped over too much bread." You will DEFINITELY lose the "pop" and you might very well be unsatisfied with the picture. If you've got a gold-standard projector like that, you should use it properly so it can perform like it's capable of.
Assuming the 120" was diagonal on a 16:9 screen, that would be 104" wide. The Cine 9, like all CRTs we use, is a 4:3 native display, and its 1200 lumen rating assumes that. So a 104" wide screen is equivalent to a 104x78" 4:3 screen, which is 8158 sq in = 57 sq ft. So on a 1.0 gain screen, 1200 lumens / 57 sq ft = ... hm. 21 ftL ??
I must have an error in my calculations somewhere. There is no way a 1200 lumen projector can produce 21 ftL on a 104" wide screen. My 8500 is rated 1200 lumens and it struggles to deliver 10-12 ftL on an 87" wide screen. A 120" screen should have roughly HALF the ftL, not DOUBLE. 12-14ftL is what you want, and there is NO WAY you'd get anywhere near that on a 104" wide screen.
Bottom line: I think you'd be really unhappy with a 120" screen. The image would be dim and lifeless. Throw that thing at a 100" screen OR SMALLER and the picture will be a lot more vibrant. A bit of gain, maybe 1.3, will help, but much more than that and you'll get hotspotting. (Unless you want to build a torus...)
One other possible solution if you REALLY want a big screen: get a High Power. But then you have to have the Barco's lenses within about arm's reach of your eyes. The HP is an AWESOME screen IF the light source is close to your eyes, but if you hang the projector from the ceiling, it will likely be worse than a 1.0 gain screen.
If you really need a 120" screen, you ought to go back and talk to that salesman about his overpriced JVC...
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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| garyfritz wrote: | | Personally I think it would be a grave mistake to stretch a Cine 9 across a 120" screen. Kind of like Bilbo feeling "like butter scraped over too much bread." You will DEFINITELY lose the "pop" and you might very well be unsatisfied with the picture. If you've got a gold-standard projector like that, you should use it properly so it can perform like it's capable of. |
Gary is correct. For a very high quality image, CRTs MUST be used on small screen. You can do the Cine 9 on a 120" screen, but it will not have much "pop" and will be much dimmer than recommended brightness and softer than on a smaller screen. This should be on an <100" screen for a reference quality picture.
I ran a Cine 8 Onyx on a 106" 1.2 gain screen and that was too big. Should have been on a 92" screen or less.
Basically:
- A brighter picture looks better to humans than a dimmer picture (you can set someone in front of a flawless 8 ftL image and a 14 ftL image with minor flaws and the 14 ftL will look better--that is the way our brains our wired. Works the same with sound).
- The higher the ANSI CR the more "pop" and, depending upon other factors, the more dimensional high APL scenes are.
- The higher the on/off CR the more natural low APL scenes will look.
| garyfritz wrote: | Assuming the 120" was diagonal on a 16:9 screen, that would be 104" wide. The Cine 9, like all CRTs we use, is a 4:3 native display, and its 1200 lumen rating assumes that. So a 104" wide screen is equivalent to a 104x78" 4:3 screen, which is 8158 sq in = 57 sq ft. So on a 1.0 gain screen, 1200 lumens / 57 sq ft = ... hm. 21 ftL ??
I must have an error in my calculations somewhere. There is no way a 1200 lumen projector can produce 21 ftL on a 104" wide screen. My 8500 is rated 1200 lumens and it struggles to deliver 10-12 ftL on an 87" wide screen. A 120" screen should have roughly HALF the ftL, not DOUBLE. |
No problem with your math, problem is you data! The 1200 Lumen rating is either A)misleading or B) just stupid. That rating usually comes from a 10% white window. I don't know about you, but I watch movies not 10% white windows. On a movie, a 9" PJ on a 16:9 screen will deliver under 200 lumens on a high APL scene. On a 50% APL scene they can deliver a bit over 250 or so.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
Last edited by Person99 on Tue Mar 22, 2011 2:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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| justin_f wrote: | | i told him i was looking to buy a screen when he asked 'what projector are you using?'. i replied simply, 'a crt.' he quickly replied with a chuckle 'oh, then youre not interested in our overpriced jvc then!'. |
Seems like an odd comment given that I know of a large number of CRTs that have been replaced with JVC projectors. In fact, it is probably the most common upgrade from a CRT. IIRC the JVC was the projector the Guy Kuo used almost exclusively to replace CRTs.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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dturco
Joined: 06 Feb 2009
Posts: 3778
Location: Eastern Shore Maryland
TV/Projector: Runco DLP VX-3000i Marquee 9500 parts doner
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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Hey I can answer this with real world experience. I have a Marquee 9500 machine with modified boards, it is a near perfect match to your Barco. I have a 120" diagonal 1.3 gain screen [A do it yourself Wilsonart DW]. I had a 100" 1.1 gain pull down screen before.
The 100" screen looked better in light output but not color. The 120" screen colors look better but is not bright enough. I am in fact going back down in size to 102" diagonal with a new screen material from Seymour screens, again a do it yourself type as I am ordering the acoustically transparent material 1.2 gain.
http://www.seymourav.com/screensDIY.asp
So 120" diagonal is on the "too big size" but if your room is totally darkened, no light like mine, it is passable, but having seen the smaller 100" inch in the same room with the same P/J, I preferred the smaller screen.
Hey it's not like a 100" screen is small you know.
And to feed your Barco you need a Blu-ray player and a HD fury 3 or a video processor to get the video to the levels your Barco deserves.
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Firefly rules. Can't stop the signal.
http://www.hulu.com/firefly
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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I agree that 104" screen is kind of pushing it, but I think brother Clarence is running that size screen with his G90. I agree with Dave on brightness. I love a bright image and have to keep from going into torch mode with my dlp. You might give Mark_A_W a PM. I believe he is somewhere in Melbourne. I think he has a DIY screen and that is what I would recommend.
| Person99 wrote: | | justin_f wrote: | | i told him i was looking to buy a screen when he asked 'what projector are you using?'. i replied simply, 'a crt.' he quickly replied with a chuckle 'oh, then youre not interested in our overpriced jvc then!'. |
Seems like an odd comment given that I know of a large number of CRTs that have been replaced with JVC projectors. In fact, it is probably the most common upgrade from a CRT. IIRC the JVC was the projector the Guy Kuo used almost exclusively to replace CRTs. |
I think he went with a dlp for his first non-CRT. I think someone said he has moved to the JVC now.
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garyfritz
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 12088
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Person99 wrote: | | Gary is correct. |
Well *DUH*. 
| Quote: | | No problem with your math, problem is you data! The 1200 Lumen rating is either A)misleading or B) just stupid. That rating usually comes from a 10% white window. I don't know about you, but I watch movies not 10% white windows. |
I've done the same calcs for my projector and I came up with the 10 ftL range for an 87" wide screen. Not sure where I went wrong. But yes, those lumen ratings are for a 10% window. Unless you're watching Ice Age I think you can come reasonably close to that (for small bright areas) for most movies, certainly for the dark movies CRTers love. But any sunny or otherwise bright scenes will definitely overtax any CRT. That's the nature of the beast.
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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Here's one more data point... I love the image my G70 puts on my 110 diagonal Wilsonart DW... I wouldn't want to go any smaller, personally - the scope image would just be too damn small. I think the image is plenty bright. Bright enough that it almost strains the eyes when you go from a dark scene to a light scene.
I would think 110 diag 16:9 would be no problem at all with a 9" machine...
Just my opinion.
SC
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2011 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Spanky Ham wrote: |
I think he went with a dlp for his first non-CRT. I think someone said he has moved to the JVC now. |
IIRC, he originally got an H79 to replace his personal NEC. But I think he only replaced a few customer NECs with DLPs. Once the RS series JVCs came out, he starting pulling out many customer NECs and replacing them almost exclusively with the RS. I remember it distinctly because even with his calibration and set up skills he claimed the every customer's NEC he had replaced with an RS saw an increase in picture quality--that actually kind of floored me and made me start looking more seriously at a switch!
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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