CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[Nashou66]

Well i need two set for my future blend project.

Athanasios

[gpavlin]

hi athanasios ,

i am the one who bought the coils from hammerhead . i also dont know if they are the correct ones , but i bought them anyway as the part # was right and they only cost me 35 usd a piece . they are now on their way to terry , who is building me 9500 ultra for my blend project . as i wll also need another set of this coils in the near future , can one of you guys who said that sony canada can still sell a new one give me a contact details from someone from sony canada , just in case if i wont be able to get another set on the used market ,

thanks .
grega

[Joust]

I called Sony Canada and got a quote. they Quoted $1350 for a set of three. Cables not included.
do you really want the #?
that is insane.
the % focus increase is simply not that great.
tell what I'ma gonna do. I'll give you my set for 30% off the sony price. and I'll include the custom Marquee cables

[Nashou66]

I may have found a company that would be willing to look at the KF22-22 and see if they can reproduce it with out the casing and probably connectors of course. I have no idea how much they want to make them. I also might see if they can take the other barco yokes and re-magnetize the magnet cores to correct values and then rewind the other coils to KF22-22 specs. It be great if they can use the parts from the KF2203/05's and make the KF 22-22.I sent them the Patent data with all the values i think but it doesnt have the gause of the individual magnets on it. Remeber this is just to see if they can even attmpt it. I dont have a KF22-22 to send them but if anyone has a spare and is willing to sell it to me for experimental purposes let me know.


Athanasios

What would a reasonable price be if they can make this focus magnet/coil for us? I would pay even 200 each for all new and then negotiate if we send them the KF2203 for remanufacturing.


Athanasios

[cmjohnson]

The connectors are easy enough. They're a stock Molex part.

Tse has a coil gaussing rig which is used to adjust magnetic values as required. AND...if this could be done for reasonable cost,
I THINK that VDC might be interested in this project as it could represent a viable replacement for Thomson yokes, which as
I understand it, have high defect rates from the factory and may not be available much longer. Plus they'd be better yokes
offering measurably better performance.

I would suggest that you contact Tse about this and see what he has to say about it. If there is indeed a manufacturer that could
reproduce the 22-22 or make a custom version of it, for a reasonable price, you might have struck a winner.


CJ

[Nashou66]

I was Thinking the same thing about VDC. I was going to use that as a selling point to make it more inticing for them to go ahead with the project.
I'll send an email to them and to TSE. But I think it might be hard for them to find the nylon bobins , This is where the other barco yokes might come into play.
And if that is the case those could go up in value as well. All i need is a test yoke to send them. So if anyone has one let me know.

Athanasios

[Nashou66]

Hi Guys, As i said before i might have a company that could possible make the coils we need or at least do all the rewindings. I was looking over the specs you all found for the different yokes and have a few questions for those who are using the franken yokes. You all seem to think that the KF2222 from the 1292's are the best yoke. Now, are these stock yokes untouched, that is they have not been rewound to match the values for each wire coil as found in the original 8500 foucus coils. Because after going over the values it seems the stock KF2222 has a lesser dynamic value than the stock 8500 coil. Which value is best? I want to know so I can give this company the exact values for each winding. Or if it is possible we could find out the best combination of the coils and make our own custom coil pack.

So the static value is most important i think, correct? so should we go with 29.9mH of the 8500 , 14.9 of the KF2222 or the 25mH of the KF2211.

The dynamic seem to be between 40 and 51 uH for all coils that work.
And both astig windings are about 100uH difference from the 8500 to the KF2222 yokes. so what value should we use?


I'd like to get this info to them along with a coil from a 1292. TSE is sending me a coil similar tot he KF2222 i'll measure the henry values and see how close they are.

But these are the values I propose for the rewinds

Static 30mH

Dynamic 45mH

And the astig values from the sony KE023:
2-4 pin 52.6 uH
6-8 pin 52.4 uH


what do you guys who are using them think?

Lest hope these guys can make these for us.

Athanasios

[cmjohnson]

I rewound ONE static coil on a 22-22 to match Thomson specs. It made virtually no difference compared to the other two, so I
didn't even bother to rewind the other two.

The 22-22 design uses dynamic focusing coils which are wound in flat spiral form and the individual coils are tape wrapped around the
coil former. Essentially, imagine eight coils spaced evenly around the surface of a cylinder. This is how they're set up. They would be almost impossible to modify by the typical hobbyist.


CJ

[Joust]

if you are going to have them made, I'd go with the stock marquee inductance and resistance that way it will match the amps best for what they are designed for.
its the magnetics that are giving us the tighter focus. the amps give us teh control.
I'd like to experiment to get the control points more in the middle of the range. the stock Sony yokes put the middle focus point way down near the bottom of the focus range.

BTW I use them unmodified.

[Nashou66]

[Nashou66]

Hi Guys, I'm preparing to send a set of KD yokes to be looked at by the people who said they may be able to make or at least rewind the bobbins for the frankenyokes.

One is a KF-22 22 KPH6 that scott sent me, its the one in pics on this tread with out the dynamic winding and missing the top thin cap magnet and the pcb board. I measured the inductance on the static winding at around 23 mH.

The other coil is a KF-3203 KOK21 that i tried to rewind but have not tested, and in the process of rewinding i forgot to note the winding direction and the + and - of the lead out wires as they were connected to the original board and bobbins.

I am writing up a document for them describing the general function of the focus yoke and also i want to describe how each winding should be placed inside the magnets with respect to how we put them on the tube. I want to also have them use the same lead out wire colors for the windings as on the original marquee so we can easily match up these wires to the marquees wiring harness.

So I'd like to know the wind direction on the bobbin in respect to its placement on the tube so say lets say for the remainder of this thread, if your looking from the back of the tube(neck board) to the front of the tube :

Which coil (Static or dynamic) is closest to the bell housing of the tube and which way do the windings go, counter clockwise or clockwise looking from the neck board to the front of the tube.

Also we need t know what the original colors of the Thompson focus yokes are with regard to polarity + or - for each wire. Then we can have them try to use the same wire colors of the Thompson yoke on the rewound/manufactured Frankenyoke


the Astig windings i have not opened up and looked at but they can also do these od shaped rectangular air core windings and wrap them around the bobbins.
id anyone has a pic of how the Marquees colors are connected to the PCb board of the KF-22 22 also showing the silk screen printings for the Static,dynamic, 4y and 4x on the board at the same time it be great. I can add that to the document. Or just tell me the wire asignments.

Thanks for any help. Lets hope this can be done or at least find out the KF-3203 magnets are within the same specs as the KF-22 22 then they can just rewind all the bobbins to Marquee specs and were set!

I'll also ask them to let me know the value of the KF-22-22 magnets so i we send other types of similar yokes to them for rewinding they can tell us if there within specs. I think it was posted here but cant find it. And if there is a tollerable limit up or down in value what +/- value can we look for.


Athanasios

[garyfritz]

Good luck with that, Athanasios!

I'm going to try to get my FYoke I's put together this month. I have a set of 22-11's, and I'm going to wire up a set of cables from the 22-11's little circuit board to the plug on the focus board. Question: the wires on the original Thompson coils kind of twine around each other but they don't seem to be intentionally twisted. Do they have to be? I bought some 4-conductor ribbon cable at Ratshack and was planning to use that for the coil-to-focus-board run. Any problem with that kind of wire run? I have no idea what frequencies are in those wires so I don't know if the wiring is at all sensitive. Thanks!

Gary

[tse]

The wires are not critical. Twist or not is ok. A couple of amps flows through the dynamic winding so wire should be larger than 26 AWG. The dynamic signal is a horizontal frequency parabola so horizontal frequency and a few higher harmonics are flowing through the wires.

Scott

[garyfritz]

My ribbon cable is 24 AWG so I should be good. Thanks Scott!

[Spanky Ham]

Athananois,
Since this is a patent, did you give them a link to it?

[tse]

Good point! The patent is very detailed and should have most, if not all, of the information needed to make the mags.

Scott

[Spanky Ham]

Hey Scott,
It looks like you were correct on the length of the patent. Is it one of these?

[tse]

5113162 is the closest one to the KD mag that I've seen

Scott

[Nashou66]

Hi guys, Yes i sent them the pdf to the patent and the two sample core yokes for them to look at they should have gotten them yesterday(thursday the 15th of Nov). I also sent them a discriptive paper on the yoke and what values we would like to see (many gramatical error's! ). i'll attach the word doc if anyopne is intreasted. Scott already saw it and had me make a few changes.

Lets hope they can do this! for a reasonable cost at least.


Athanasios

[garyfritz]

I already made a chocolate pecan pie, and somebody else is cooking the turkey, so I'm playing with my 8500 today. Finally getting moving on the FYoke I's.

I've got them mostly rewired but I had a couple of questions. I got these KF-2211's from Clarence last year, and he didn't remember where they came from.

* They all have a "KF-2211K" sticker on them. Two of them also have a "+10" sticker. The "+10" coils are closed with brass screws, the other was riveted shut. The "+10" coils say "KPJ22" on the back, the other says "KNJ22". Any idea how these coils are different? They look the same internally.

* I haven't been using my 8500 for a while, but I thought it had 2/4-pole CPC rings. Looking at the ring I pulled off it, though, I see it has only one moveable ring and the other is locked. Now that I think of it, it's probably just a 4-pole, since the Thompson coil's centering mechanism makes a 2-pole unnecessary -- correct?

* Clarence sent a set of CPC rings with the coils, and these appear to be 2/4/6-pole rings with the middle set locked. Any guesses what the middle rings are? I'm wondering if these are 4/6-pole ring sets?

* Is there any reason I couldn't unlock the extra set of rings (break off the locking tabs), which are presumably 2-pole, and use them for centering instead of the Thompson-coil centering method? (I wouldn't have the nifty twiddle knob, but I could turn the rings manually.) Or should I just assume that rotating the KF2211's will work to center it, as others have said?

* Two of the new CPC rings have "9629" written on them, and the other has "9432". I'm guessing the "9432" goes with the non-"+10" coil, but does anybody have any deeper insights than that? The 4-pole from my 8500 says "9619".

* If I decide to use these, should I remove the stig board, or should I just leave it in there?

Thanks!
Gary