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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 3:59 pm Post subject: Barco Graphics 1209s/E -horizontal "shadows" |
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Dear Experts,
The image quality that my BG 1209s/E produces is flawless, except for one problem that has appeared recently. There are some horizontal "shadows" at the top of the screen, which come and go randomly (please see the attached .jpg file). When they are visible, they are present in all tubes, and does not depend on the image sources (I've tried different players, cables, HDFurys, and so on...).
The shadows first appeared after the lightning struck (without warning) VERY close to our flat. Maybe the events are unrelated... Or maybe not?
What do you think?
Some set-ups that I've tried (both give the same result):
Standard set-up: HTPC (Radeon 4890) @ 1080p/60 -> Clicktronic 10 m HDMI-HDMI -> HDFury3 -> BG1209s/E port 5.
Alternative set-up: Sony blu-ray player @ 1080p/60 -> Supra DVI-DVI 10 m -> HDFury1 -> BG1209s/E port 5.
Best regards,
Peter
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 6635
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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Do they roll up or down ?
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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Tom.W wrote: | | Do they roll up or down ? |
Good question... Actually, I don't know... It's really hard to see. It seems that they are quite "stationary" when they appear, as shown in the jpg. No major (visible) rolling. Just "fixed" horizontal shadows, which now and then change appearance (e.g. different number of "shadow rows") or disappear.
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 6635
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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Never seen this happen but maybe Curt has. Take a close look at the scan coils and check and clean the wiring harness and connectors.
Did it start right after the lightning hit ?
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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Tom.W wrote: | | Never seen this happen but maybe Curt has. Take a close look at the scan coils and check and clean the wiring harness and connectors. |
Maybe you could translate that for me...?  I don't even know where those things are located.
The lightning struck at around 2 PM. When I turned on the projector later that day (at around 6 PM), the shadows were there... 
Yes, maybe Curt will have some ideas? Thanks Tom.W.
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 6635
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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The scan coils are mounted on a board above the CRTs directly on the top aluminum cover.
http://www.curtpalme.com/Barco1208_Layout5.shtm
Hopefully Curt might have on idea. The close lightning strike can do weird things...
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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Tom.W wrote: | | The scan coils are mounted on a board above the CRTs directly on the top aluminum cover. |
OK. Thanks!
Some new information. When displaying a static image, the shadows are there all the time. They don't come and go "randomly". This only happens when watching a movie. Apparently, the contents of each frame is important for provocing the shadows.
Also, displaying the (Barco) menu has an impact on the shadows. The number of "shadow rows" decreases when the menu is shown.
Finally, when there are many "shadow rows" (about 4), there is an audible buzz from the power supply. When there are fewer shadow rows (e.g. when pressing the menu button), the buzz is inaudible. Also, the variations of the buzzing sound matches the visible interference, or variations, around the shadows.  Wierd! What's going on?
Do I have a faulty power supply?
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dvh99
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 2158
Location: nederland
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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since it is on all 3 tubes i would suspect the hv ps and not the deflection coils.
i am no expert but i think it is common sense.
it would be nice if you had a spare hv ps.
_________________
1 answer always poses multiple questions.
marquee 9500ultra HD10L moome hdmi1.3 v3+ some mods.
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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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| dvh99 wrote: | since it is on all 3 tubes i would suspect the hv ps and not the deflection coils.
i am no expert but i think it is common sense.
it would be nice if you had a spare hv ps. |
Sorry for the stupid question, but "hv ps" = high voltage power supply? Is that the same as the SMPS? I should be able to test another one in about a week or so.
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 6635
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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The lightning part bothers me a bit.... Do you have a spare EHT card or HV (high voltage) quadrupler ?
http://www.curtpalme.com/Barco1208_Layout3.shtm
Last edited by Tom.W on Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dvh99
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 2158
Location: nederland
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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i am not familiar with barco terms but yes hvps is high voltage powersupply, if its the same as smps i dont know.
what happens if you disconnect 2 hv leads from the tubes to the hv splitter and for instance only run the green.
_________________
1 answer always poses multiple questions.
marquee 9500ultra HD10L moome hdmi1.3 v3+ some mods.
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 6635
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| Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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See the above post I added a link. The SMPS or switch mode power supply and the HV power supply are two different animals.
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 6635
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 3:05 am Post subject: |
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It could also be a problem in the SMPS send Curt a PM and see what he thinks. If it is Curt can repair it.
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TbX
Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 94
Location: Sweden
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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:38 am Post subject: |
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Thanks TbX!
Yes, the projector was in standby mode when the lightning struck.
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry, no idea on this one. Check the 17.5 volt test point on the SMPS maybe. If the lines flicker, then it could be a small HV arc. If so, try disconnecting each HV lead to the tubes one at a time to see if the problem goes away when you discconnect one of the leads.
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to_shine
Joined: 24 Jun 2010
Posts: 17
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Curt! I'm a bit worried when someone like yourself answer "Sorry, no idea on this one"...! Time for me to go digital? Yeah, right! 
Sorry for the stupid question, but how exactly do I check the voltage?
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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It's on the main site in the Barco 808 tech tips section.
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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I have seen similar bars when top blanking is adjusted all the way down to picture edge, moving blanking higher removed problem.
Also some vertical timings can cause similar bars, chancing vertical porch sizes and sync width from source removed problem.
Both of these problems are there all the time, not come and go randomly. Some material show problem much easier though.
If it's projector problem, I have problems to believe that it's smps related issue. Smps board fail much worst after over voltage from lightning, projector won't even show green stand by led. Even without lightning I can't imagine that problem in smps can cause horizontal bars to picture. AC input board work or not (deliver 300V to smps), it can't cause problem like this.
I'd chance Vertical deflection board first, but it's just my logic.
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zGman
Joined: 22 May 2006
Posts: 599
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| Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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Agree with Ile - seems like I have seen this long ago with V board in bg808s....
G
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