CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[yonexsp]

After many years of happy CRT'ing I am having to go grey.

In my budget I have narrowed it to either:

1) Epson 8500UB
2) JVC DLA-RS10

Which one should I pick? The JVC would be used, or perhaps I will still have time for a B-Stock.

I'm thinking black level's so, the Epson I understand is better than the Panny 4000

Advice greatly accepted.

[cmjohnson]

You'll be back with your CRTs before long.

[antorsae]

If I were you I'd probably wait till Cedia (if you can) as there would be a few more with better blacks.

[greg_mitch]

[Willie]

RS10

[bbfarmht]

Panasonic PT-AE4000U

[benareeno]

I would go and look at as many as you can...it's hard to comment for someone else's taste.

A crt'er will likely prefer dlp technology...but they are always louder...

[greg_mitch]

[garyfritz]

With 3-chippers you risk unfixable alignment problems. A single-chip will always be razor-sharp. With LED technology there's no color wheel so no noise, no mechanical parts to break, no hot bulb to cook the video path or to replace, etc. Seems to me that 1-chip LED DLP could be almost the ideal way to go. Might not do the greatest blacks though.

[Bucketfoot]

RS10

I moved to an RS2 about 8 months ago and have not had a single regret.

[greg_mitch]

[garyfritz]

There might be some projectors that used a "white" LED source, though I didn't see any. Most of the LED projectors available now are pico / portable / pocket projectors. But the HT projectors I found all pulse their LEDs, many using the Luminus PhlatLight LED modules. They're still pretty pricey but I'm sure the prices will come down.

LED projectors have huge advantages and fit very well with DLP:
* No bulbs to burn out, lose brightness or color fidelity, or replace
* Roughly 60% less power consumption -- no cooking the components, less cooling requirements
* No worries about blowing a bulb if the power goes out
* More shock-resistant
* LEDs can cycle far faster than a color wheel, which should eliminate rainbow problems even for sensitive types

... and there's probably more but you get the idea! I think LED DLPs will be the way to go.

[HogPilot]

LEDs certainly have advantages over lamp-driven projectors - instant on/off with no lifespan penalty, ability to modulate the light source to improve CR (much like a DI), significantly longer life, relatively little light output drop over the life of the LEDs, and less light drop when calibrated to D65. However, LED-based PJs carry a significant price premium over lamp-based units (at least 2x), and they also cannot output the same amount of light that a lamp PJ can. Right now there's no HT LED PJs that are suitable for screen sizes above 100", unless you're using a high-gain screen of some sort.

I have yet to see an LED PJ in action, but they have garnered some positive reviews thus far. In all honesty I would think that a CRTer would prefer LCoS over DLP, just because the former more closely resembles a CRT with it's more "fluid" look (i.e. much smaller inter-pixel gaps and less pixel visibility than DLP) and deeper black levels. DLP - especially 1-chip DLP - definitely gives you a razor sharp image, but I personally find it to be too sharp to the point of being distracting, and improvements in black levels have stagnated in the last several years. The pixel structure on my RS35 - which is still a sharp unit - doesn't stand out nearly as much as on my buddy's BenQ W20000, or the Sim2 HT3000 that I played with for a bit. LCD would be my last choice, but it also offers the most "bang for your buck" if you're looking to keep the price in the sub-$2.5K area.

Ultimately I'd really recommend auditioning each display tech for yourself if you can - everyone is different and gravitates towards different techs for one reason or another.

[Spanky Ham]

Hog,
While in theory CRTers would prefer LCOS, there are a good number who have went DLP. I have a Marantz that looks pretty good. I theoretically bought a Sony 40, but the seller had an issue with it, so he backed out. I hope to still get it at some point. I know Brian likes his Sony, so I am hoping this looks good and is an improvement over the Marantz.


To me, the JVCs are the class of the field. Unfortunately, the used ones are still going for good prices. There is a rumor that Epson is going LCOS. If that is the case, then there could be some interesting developments in inexpensive pj category. All of a sudden, Cedia just got a lot more interesting.

[MikeEby]

My guess is, it will be 3D mania at CEDIA this year. Wish I was in Indy...Oh well I hope the XG holds up another year when it returns in 2011 to Indy. That way I can see all the choices in one spot.

Mike

[deronmoped]

Do the LED PJ's produce good color? I always heard that the LED's had issues with getting the correct color or at least not being able to have a LED that produces a good white. Maybe this is not a issue if you are combining RGB LED's.

I still love the image my 10PG produces, just seems so natural.

Deron.

[benareeno]

From what I understand...the LED's have the ability to produce very accurate colors..I'm excited to see one. I love the fact that the projector puts out less heat and therefore less noise.

[HogPilot]

Spanky - that's certainly interesting that some CRT guys have switched over to DLP. You never know what people see that makes them like one over the other.

deronmoped/beenareeno - there's really two parts to answering the question about the accuracy of LED's colors. Firstly, the colors produced by each R, G, and B LED are "more pure" than the colors we filter from UHP or even Xenon bulbs, so you can get a much more saturated color. So LEDs are capable of producing a significantly larger/more saturated gamut than any other commercial display technology out there. That being said, "proper color" is attained by adhering to SMPTE-C/REC709 or whatever gamut the material you're watching was mastered using. So from the perspective, the color from LED PJs is no better or worse than the color from any other digital - it really depends on the abilities of the PJ's CMS. From what I've read, it seems that most LED PJs have a pretty nice CMS so the colors can be dialed in quite accurately.

If you ask me, the only things stopping LEDs from totally overtaking the bulb PJ market are 1) price, 2) light output, and 3) DLP native contrast ratio (i.e. no LED dimming or DI tricks). #1 will come down as sales and production increase, #2 will hopefully continue to increase, but #3 is going to be the tough one. But an LED-lit single chip DLP with lots of light output and JVC RS-series native contrast will be one hell of a machine - bright, sharp, deep blacks, instant on/off, long lifetime. Possibly a digital contender to compete with CRTs performance-wise in a couple years...

[garyfritz]

[HogPilot]