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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 12:54 am Post subject: The ultimate hack |
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I would love to find one more Marquee 9" coupling, a burned tube XG 1350LC and another set of Thomas tubes.
Can you guess what's going through my mind??? 
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Chip
A Barco is only a AmPro with training wheels
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 1:00 am Post subject: Re: The ultimate hack |
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| stefuel wrote: | I would love to find one more Marquee 9" coupling, a burned tube XG 1350LC and another set of Thomas tubes.
Can you guess what's going through my mind??? |
Thats what I have planed for that Ampro 3600 I have here
I have the Marquee LC chamber set and two sets of green and red C-Elements too 
PS: So Itake it you like the High rez Thomas tubes !!!!
Nashou
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 1:14 am Post subject: |
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That would just be a 4600. Not bad but still a low bandwidth chassis. The XG 1350 is a high bandwidth chassis that could be had for cheap money. In my opinion is a much more capable chassis than the Marquee.
I did look at the 3600 and there is not enough room between the bulkheads for 9" LC optics. I'm not sure there's enough room in a XG but a torched tube one could be had cheap enough that I wouldn't mind running the nose through a bandsaw to make room. As far as I know, when the tubes in a XG are used up there are no more (new) available so hacking one up is not that big a deal.
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 1:19 am Post subject: |
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Oh, and I do think those Thomas tubes are great. I will know in a few months if they will stand up to high useage. I have hundreds of hours on them already.
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cmjohnson
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 5180
Location: Buried under G90s
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:00 am Post subject: |
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It looks like I'll soon be messing with the idea of running a complete set of G90 magnetics in a Marquee. How does that qualify?
I'll even be installing additional power supplies to drive the electronic CPC magnets.
CJ
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:24 am Post subject: |
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| cmjohnson wrote: | It looks like I'll soon be messing with the idea of running a complete set of G90 magnetics in a Marquee. How does that qualify?
I'll even be installing additional power supplies to drive the electronic CPC magnets.
CJ |
It qualifies as something that doesn't need to be addressed with the XG.
Quite frankly, other than to give someone somthing to do. I don't understand why someone would want to spend the time and money trying to beef up the Marquee when a better stock projector could be had for less money.
I mean geeze, you guys spend more time frigging around with them than watching them.
If you could drive a set of high rez 9" tubes with a late model XG chassis, use a good LC coupling and the best lenses, you would have a winner hands down, with no other chassis modifications.
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Drew Packard
Joined: 12 Mar 2006
Posts: 43
Location: Monroe, Washington
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:49 am Post subject: |
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Hey Chip, This is something I've been toying with for a couple years now! 
I think an XG driving 9" tubes would be THE killer machine...
There's a few hurdles,(different defl yokes, focus/astig coils to use, adapter plugs for plugging in the XG neck cards to 9" tube as well as winding a coil for the electronic raster centering) but I think it can be done!
Drew
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cmjohnson
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 5180
Location: Buried under G90s
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 4:02 am Post subject: |
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No, a better stock projector can't be had for less money.
The Marquee chassis is the one that is arguably best suited for performance modification. It's the one that HAS the most performance upgrades available for it.
And it's the only one still being manufactured today.
I think it makes more sense to focus my efforts on a chassis that hasn't been discontinued for eight years or so.
I don't think there's anything wrong with XGs but I wouldn't trade any Marquee for any "comparable" XG in the same condition. I'd keep the Marquee. I can do more with it...and to it...and get more out of it.
At this point in time, the top 3 projectors for picture quality are the G90, the Cine 9, and the Marquee 9500LC. If a stock Marquee may
not qualify, a well modified one certainly does. And I believe further improvements are still possible...and that's why I'm
working on my third round of experimental upgrades.
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 10:53 am Post subject: |
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" It's the one that HAS the most performance upgrades available for it"
That could be because it needs it most.
All Mike did to the XG was a few neckboard mods and some opamps further up the video chain (or so I gather, I haven't seen the neckboards yet).
I'm dead keen to see how it goes. It won't be easy. Deflection coils with the right convergence and raster centering coils, a focus and astig coil with the right windings, and neckboard adapters.
And no, 9" tubes won't fit in the chassis. You'll have to cut the sides off and rebuild the chassis.
Doug said NEC did build a 9' protptype, but the CRT business died before it went any further.
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
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Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark_A_W wrote: | " It's the one that HAS the most performance upgrades available for it"
That could be because it needs it most.
All Mike did to the XG was a few neckboard mods and some opamps further up the video chain (or so I gather, I haven't seen the neckboards yet).
I'm dead keen to see how it goes. It won't be easy. Deflection coils with the right convergence and raster centering coils, a focus and astig coil with the right windings, and neckboard adapters.
And no, 9" tubes won't fit in the chassis. You'll have to cut the sides off and rebuild the chassis.
Doug said NEC did build a 9' protptype, but the CRT business died before it went any further. |
Where does the main problem exist? It it the physical tube neck size where it would not permit the installation of the XG's magnetics on a 9" tube?
Could the focus and deflection coils from another brand be adapted to the XG's electronics?
What magnetics did the 10 PG use?
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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| stefuel wrote: | | Mark_A_W wrote: | " It's the one that HAS the most performance upgrades available for it"
That could be because it needs it most.
All Mike did to the XG was a few neckboard mods and some opamps further up the video chain (or so I gather, I haven't seen the neckboards yet).
I'm dead keen to see how it goes. It won't be easy. Deflection coils with the right convergence and raster centering coils, a focus and astig coil with the right windings, and neckboard adapters.
And no, 9" tubes won't fit in the chassis. You'll have to cut the sides off and rebuild the chassis.
Doug said NEC did build a 9' protptype, but the CRT business died before it went any further. |
Where does the main problem exist? It it the physical tube neck size where it would not permit the installation of the XG's magnetics on a 9" tube?
Could the focus and deflection coils from another brand be adapted to the XG's electronics?
What magnetics did the 10 PG use? |
Thats right Chip. The NEC and G70 tubes necks are more narrow than a typical 8 and 9 inch tube.
So you would need to measure the inductance and resistance of the nec focus coils and fine similar
measurements in 8/9" focus coils. then you have to make sure the deflection coils have the same inductance values and deflection degree. Now with the convergence coils my understanding is most designs fall with in the same parameters give or take a few % points in either direction of voltages.
I am not sure what the Cut off voltage for the NEC tubes are. For most 8 and 9 inch tubes i think it should be between 160-180. I think the Ampros use 180 and is why they have a bit more POP in the image. I think TSE mentioned this somewhere once.
So there is lots to consider but it can be done. I think you should go for it. If you can measure the inductance and resitance values of the NEC coils for static and dynamic i can tell you if its close enough. I think a few uh or mh off in either direction will be ok as it is with my testing of the marquees.
Athanasios
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Don't blame your underwear for your crooked ass~ unknown Greek philosopher
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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10PG used physical magnetic raster centering rings. They may work.
I'm not sure exactly how the electronic raster centering works, it may also work with a 10PG coil. I have no idea.
The PG did not have dynamic astig.
I think G90 coils may be the best bet.
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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All of this is great but I'd need to get a working chassis for next to nothing to butch up to start with. I have a Marquee LC and a good green to experiment with and in the meantime look for magnetics that can be used. It would be nice to work
it all out on paper first before demolition starts 
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Drew Packard
Joined: 12 Mar 2006
Posts: 43
Location: Monroe, Washington
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| Posted: Sat May 22, 2010 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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You wouldn't want to use a 10PG defl yoke....it only has one Hor coil vs the XG's 2 coils for high scan switching for lower retrace.
I have a 1209 yoke that I think would work, or possibly a 1292/G90 yoke.
Making the elec raster centering work is easy. Its a small coil on the back of the XG yoke...looks like a static focus coil from a focus Mg
When I did my full out 10PG Plus, I used the focus coils from a 1209 and rewound them with the windings from the 10PG. It worked perfectly......So, that would be easy as well.
That leaves some sort of adapter cards to plug the 9" tube into the XG neck card socket....that shouldn't be too tough
I've been tossing this idea around for quite awhile.....I think it would be well worth the effort!
Drew
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central
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| Posted: Sun May 23, 2010 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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Why would you use a different chassis? I think it would be easier to leave the tubes in whatever chassis you use and transfer the electronics.
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 10:05 am Post subject: |
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| Spanky Ham wrote: | | Why would you use a different chassis? I think it would be easier to leave the tubes in whatever chassis you use and transfer the electronics. |
Well, what if you don't have the whole doner chassis and only have the optics.
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Chip
A Barco is only a AmPro with training wheels
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 10:14 am Post subject: |
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It would be easier if you could scrounge a big chassis.
There is NO WAY you will get 9" LC housings to fit inside the XG Chassis.
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 10:15 am Post subject: |
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Oh, if you don't have a donor XG already, make sure you get one ending in xxx1 or xxx2.
Not an xxxx0 model - inferior electronics.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 8:19 am Post subject: |
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| Mark_A_W wrote: | It would be easier if you could scrounge a big chassis.
There is NO WAY you will get 9" LC housings to fit inside the XG Chassis. |
What if you mounted the tubes and tube mounts as far foward in the chasis as you could, to make it look like the older Barco models that had the lenses sticking way out of them?
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 8:24 am Post subject: |
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The XG chassis doesn't get any wider towards the front.
It just fits the 8" XG LC hardware. G70 LC hardware won't fit.
You'd have to cut the sides off the forward part of the chassis and widen it. You may be able to move the whole chassis sides out, with some spacer bits made for the base.
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