CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

Curious, how many of you ever bring material that demands high CR and low BL? Also, when looking at shops, I find its a must to be there letting my eyes become accustomed to the ambient lighting considering sunshine is orders of magnitude above the scene. This produces a mis-perceived condition. I think this is why I haven't had more of a desire to see what is out there digitally in the past three years.

Uncalibrated, unprepared in material, an a wife not willing to wait +30 minutes for eyes to adjust.

stgdz · Joined: 07 Dec 2008 Posts: 107

Well I made the switch last night.

AVS was offering a sim2 300 extra last weekend for $350 and I just couldn't say no any longer, I haven't hung it up yet as I am trying to figure out how to get the beast down from the ceiling. After playing around with it last night though here is what I have to report back.

Sony 1272
Pro
Delivers film like quality
Negatives
loud
not as bright as the sim2
No where near as sharp
Heavy and a freaking beast to lift up into the ceiling but once it was up there
Convergence, went out of alignment without correct timings.

Sim2
Pro
Much brighter
Much much sharper, the wife commented that the DVD's we were watching look HD
Pretty quiet, not silent but quieter then the 1272.
No messing with power strip
Cons
Delivers a digital image and not a film image

Some background of my system is that I have a wilson art 110" screen, HTPC as a source, and HD feeds are a through a HD homerun. The fiml comment that I have is that when I switched from the CRT to the DLP it displayed a razor sharp image with the DLP where as the CRT was more grainy and had a bit more blur in the motion scenes. It's hard to describe.

amt_austin · Joined: 23 Jan 2008 Posts: 38 Location: Austin, TX,

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

Willie · Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 169 Location: Green Bay

ralpharch · Joined: 02 Nov 2007 Posts: 211 Location: Derwood

I actually cancelled my HD20 order - am waiting to see if I can fix a sync problem and if not with reasonable effort plan to get a digital of some sort. So whatever is best bang for the buck is important; but I will probably wait at least until after CEDIA to see what new is available. Also very interested in Person99's perspective on the cheap 1080ps not being as desireable as some 720 ps with better image??

Willie · Joined: 13 May 2006 Posts: 169 Location: Green Bay

My point is this stuff is highly subjective.

I have a Sharp XV-Z2000; a 720DLP that is a very nice compliment to my 9501LC. I use it for HDTV viewing and web surfing.

I agree that a good 720DLP can be nice. However, the HD20 was just introduced in July. Let's at least wait till somebody has actually seen it till we indict it. Don't rule it out till you have seen it.

Willie

CRT_Ben · Joined: 28 Aug 2006 Posts: 1684 Location: Northern Virginia

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

Mr. Green · Posted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:49 pm Post subject:

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central

Willie,
I agree. I read where the Optoma is supposed to have pretty good contrast of 4k to 1. It will be interesting to see what the LCD camp has in store now that DLP seems to have taken the low price 1080p category from them. I am sure projector central will do their best to downplay it and pimp LCD.

Ralph,
As far as low cost, this might be it for DLP. There will probably be new LCDs and LCOS coming out. Matter of fact if you wanted to spend the money, then JVC has a new pj with a claimed 80k to 1 and improved ANSI.

WanMan · Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10270

Is this 4,000:1 CR On/Off? What is its ANSI CR?

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central

Dave,
According to Guitarman over at AVS, there is no DI on the 20.

With all of these CRTers switching, are we going to now call them Dave's digital sheep? Mr. Green

Of course, I may be head sheep much sooner than anticipated. Fortunately, I will be attending Cedia next month and will get a look at all of the pjs in action. I really want to see the JVC.

Person99 · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 4899 Location: Flower Mound, TX

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central

After the 20 was mentioned, I went over to AVS and read the thread. Guitarman said that Optoma wanted to keep the price as low as possible, so they didn't put one in. Since it is supposed to have like 1700 lumens, this could be a good pj for those with ambient light. Hopefully, I will see it in a month.

VideoGrabber · Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 933 Location: Michigan

Person99 commented:
> I would find a used high-end DC 720p PJ that was bright like the Marantz VP12s4 before grabbing one of these. It will have image quality that blows the HD20 away. <

In some respects, I'm surprised to hear you recommending this PJ, Dave. Granted the optics are excellent, which is a critical and often shortchanged area. And it does have some good characteristics, like the Gennum VXP that deinterlaces 1080i (motion-adaptive) before downconverting to 720p (unlike some that bob to 540p and then scale up). And an ANSI CR of 800. BUT, for someone like you looking for image punch from a bright PJ, I wouldn't think it would satisfy you, based on reviews like Kris Deerings at HTHF. With only about 11 ftL with a new bulb (260 ANSI lumens, calibrated), this seems like a non-starter for you.

Other problems include video level clipping, "does not retain the proper video levels when it receives a 4:2:2 signal. Instead it remaps the input to PC levels and clips head and toe room. The only way around this is to do a colorspace conversion of the signal BEFORE it goes to the projector." So even though you've got (and paid a premium for) a quality VXP scaler, you need an external processor to fix this deficiency. And to fix the gamma problem, because it is set up to do no more than 1.9 max... "My chief complaint for this projector is probably gamma. The S4 has eight different preset gamma curves to choose from. Unfortunately the highest curve results in a gamma of about 1.9, which is pretty low."

These are still rather expensive, even as used units 3 years (4?) after introduction. And their normal throw lens makes them a tough fit for PJ owners looking to replace their unit. (Though a short-throw lens is available, you're unlikely to find one on a used PJ.) For example, I couldn't fit one in my room even if I wanted to, and still fill the screen. No horizontal lense shift probably wouldn't be a big deal, but lack of power zoom and focus means that an anamorphic lense solution would be required (where a power zoom might be more desirable to some), increasing the cost and complexity further.

So all in all, I wouldn't think this would get your recommendation (unless possibly they were later able to correct the clipping problem with the Silicon Image HDMI chip, and reconfigure the gamma curves). I couldn't find any followups anywhere though that indicated this was the case.