CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[Elaine Benes]

Actually, Xtra's and plain PG's are not compatible at all, really. The closer cousin to the Xtra is the XG, even the tubes in an Xtra aren't compatible with a plain PG...

[DARNOLD]

"Is your name Dan Arnold? Or are you "Big-D" from Arnold?"

No, its Dave.

Quoting this site:

"The PG series use tubes made by NEC, and they are rebuildable. They were classified as 7” tubes, but actually have a bit larger phosphor area over the typical 7” tube, so I call them 7 ½” tubes. The 6 PG scans to 60 Khz, the 9 PG to 90. The 6 PG came stock with only the RGB input working, the video and S video input were only activated with the installation of the optional video decoder board. The 6 Pg also did not come stock with the 100 point convergence board. The 9 PG came stock with both boards.

NEC PG + projectors

The NEC PG + sets added an astigmatism board for enhanced control of corner focusing. Other than that, the tubes and chassis of the PG + is identical to the NEC PG series.

NEC PG Xtra projectors

The NEC PG Xtra sets were similar to the + models, but the deflection board had some changes so that it could not be interchanged with one from the PG or PG + sets. The same applies to the LV power supply. The Xtra set used slightly larger (longer) tubes, and the brightness thus increased to 1000 lumens from 800. The max H scan rate changed to 64 Khz on the 6 PG Xtra and 92 Khz on the 9 Pg Xtra. Overall, the Xtra series gave a bit more punch than the PG and PG+ sets. The green tube used in the PG Xtra can also be used in the higher end NEC XG series, but the R and B tubes are not interchangeable with the XG models."

They sound quite different, but some boards may interchange.

[Mark_A_W]

Curt's mostly right.

All PG and XG tubes (and G70) are 160mm across the tube face.

Only the Green tube is longer in the Xtra - the red and blue are the same length as a PG, and I have used a PG blue in an Xtra.

[D-ARNOLD]

stopped by the gentleman's house today who gave me the Runco pj and picked up the wireless remotes for both the scan converter and pj. Offered to help in any way I could with his new HT setup. He's a super nice guy and I appreciate the freebie cause sooner or later it'll be working or parts!
It has the HD 145 lenses and the E8508A tubes. Nice and clean inside.

We'll see how I fare!

[Brooklyn]

I've had both a regular 6PG & 6PG Xtra, and almost none of the boards are cross compatible. Actually I can't think of one that you should swap between the two. I once put a deflection board from my Xtra in my 6PG temporarily and it worked, however it is not recommended.

Actually there is one thing that I found to be useful out of the Xtra for my regular PG, and that was the "front crt bezel." The regular PG uses spacers for crt/lense toe in, which is a pain. The Xtra uses a pivoting system that allows you to easily set the perfect toe in for your screen size. You could directly bolt in the bezel from the Xtra to the regular 6PG.

I don't know if you said this already, but did the projector give you an error code? That should be able to help you figure out which part you need.

[D-ARNOLD]

Brooklyn,

No, no codes as no crt's are firing...........

Its a power supply problem i believe, but won't know more til i find more info.........

Peace.....

[Curt Palme]

If the tubes don't light up at all, it could be a bad deflection board. That has the HV turnon circuit on it, and if that fails, you get no HV. Also, the video output board can cause the HV to die. Check the filaments to make sure they are lit.

[Curt Palme]

If the tubes don't light up at all, it could be a bad deflection board. That has the HV turnon circuit on it, and if that fails, you get no HV. Also, the video output board can cause the HV to die. Check the filaments to make sure they are lit.

[D-ARNOLD]

Thanks for the input Curt. No, there’s no power to the tubes (filaments) that I can see.

This thing is acting weird.

When I attach the power cord, turn on the main (front) power switch, the unit goes into standby mode with the amber LED for standby lit and the LED’s behind controls labeling lit on the rear of the unit. Also, there’s a super brief flash of “FF” that appears on the 7-segment displays, going immediately back to “00”, upon pressing the main power switch.
Unit remains “looking” ready and on standby at that point. The (2) 7-segment displays for error codes/selected slot number read “00”. The amber standby LED remains lit.

Then when I press the power button on the control panel (rear of unit) the amber standby LED goes out, the green power LED and the green remote LED light, the cooling fans (all 3) bump very slightly, but do not start, nor does anything else fire up. The unit will stay this way for approximately 10 seconds, then a very quick flash of “FF” appears on the 7-segment displays, going immediately back to “00”, and unit goes back to standby, amber LED lit and stays this way for 3 seconds. Then unit powers itself up again and this cycle repeats continuously. Repeated pressing of the power switch on rear control panel, during the cycling, will sometimes interrupt the cycle and the unit will remain in standby until power is pressed again. Then the whole scenario repeats…………….

I did manage to get a hold of an NEC manual but they don’t mention any “FF” errors.
According to the book, there are “Communication Errors” codes F3, F7, F1, F5, F4, F8, & F0. I thought “FO”could be the “F” I’m seeing the flash of and the “0” it reverts to on both 7-segment displays. This is indicative of fan stoppage, but I was able to test each individual fan and all 3 worked.
The other possibility I see is that the steady “00” could actually be “D0” indicating possible HV PWB failure. Book says “DO” = HV OFF with the protector operated. (is this something that can be re-set?)
----------- The PS unit 180 V dropped.
----------- DEF deflection stopped.
----------- Video OUT output abnormal.
----------- HV overcurrent.
----------- HV overvoltage

BTW, when powering down with the main switch on front of pj, rear control and standby or power/remote LED’s (depending on whether its cycling or has been stopped in the standby mode) do stay lit for several seconds before the power cuts off completely, then after a couple seconds, a “click” is heard near the front bottom of the pj and its finally off.

How about some more clues? anybody?

[DARNOLD]

BUMP

Would sure appreciate any guidance on this one still. Been almost a year since i messed with it and still has same symptoms. Re-read in manual about fan stoppage, so searched for this old thread only to find i had verified fans (3) all working. like to see this one get used.

[Curt Palme]

It's pretty much at the point where you need to pull boards and send them in for testing, or find another set with toasted tubes to do board swaps with.

BTW, there's a 4th fan in the unit, under the back gray cover in the right corner, bv the HV power supply. You need to pull off the back cover to get to it.

[Curt Palme]

It's pretty much at the point where you need to pull boards and send them in for testing, or find another set with toasted tubes to do board swaps with.

BTW, there's a 4th fan in the unit, under the back gray cover in the right corner, bv the HV power supply. You need to pull off the back cover to get to it.

[DARNOLD]

thanks curt
i'll check the 4th fan tonight.
seen a local ad here for the following:
"I have a Runco CRT front projector for sale. I think it is either a DVT947 but people have said that it is a DVT933 they think. Anyways the Unit has 7" CRTs, was owned and used by one person, will show 1080i HD images and comes with a video scaler from Runco as well. Unit is about 7 ot 8 years old, but has not been installed for about 2 years. Unit powers on and works great. Unit was used on a 16:9 screen so there is no 4:3 burn on the tubes. I do not have a remote for the unit, but control can be done from a programmed universal remote or from the controller display."
this thing looks exactly like my IDP 900, even has the same "SUPER HDTV" badge although mine says "SUPER HDTV II". asking $200.00 but has been for sale for some time, started at $350.00. May check it out.

[Curt Palme]

Offer $100.

THe 933 is an Xtra chassis, not much is transferable between the plain PG and hte Xtra chassis.

[Curt Palme]

Offer $100.

THe 933 is an Xtra chassis, not much is transferable between the plain PG and hte Xtra chassis.

[DARNOLD]

i'll second that offer!

so if its a DTV 947 is it just a 6PG?

[Curt Palme]

No, a 947 is a Barco Cine 7, a totally different beast..

[Curt Palme]

No, a 947 is a Barco Cine 7, a totally different beast..

[DARNOLD]

no, its doesn't look like the Barco

[Curt Palme]

He's got the model wrong then..

Runco DTV-863/873/940/943/947* Barco 70x

That could be any of the PG series. For $100, grab it regardless.

[Curt Palme]

He's got the model wrong then..

Runco DTV-863/873/940/943/947* Barco 70x

That could be any of the PG series. For $100, grab it regardless.

[DARNOLD]

I'LL SEE IF HE BITES AT $100.00

kinda doubt it as he's been holding out so long, several months for sure. Maybe he'll go $125 or $150

Quote from earlier e-mail from him: "IF you are interested I will take $200 for the unit if you want to come get it this week."

[dmarnold]

curt (or others),

with the DTV badge in the photo wouldn't it have to be a DTV 930 or 933 (6PG xtra)? The other runco models that are based on NEC 6PG, NEC 6PG+ or NEC 6PG xtra are the runco IDP models like my IDP 900A, at least according to the runco MODEL CROSS REFERENCE on this site.

Sound right?

[dmarnold]

Okay, here's the scoop on my runco that looks like a NEC. based on the photo above it has a badge in the lower left corner that says "IDP 900A SUPER IDTV II". It has the Delta HD145N tubes parts numbers (R) 74922056, (G) 74922057,(B) 74922058. It also has the "IDP Interlace Control Rev.C" installed. Also, the following from 03-04-09 still applies.

"It's a RUNCO IDP 900A Super IDTV II
Plugged in power cord, turned power on to standby, then pushed power on control panel.
LED for standby goes off, LED for power and remote glow but no power up on fans, etc.
After a second or two, power and remote LED's go out and standby led glows, then this cycle repeats.
Pressing power on control panel has no affect on repeating cycle.
Powered off with main switch."

All i can add is that it appears that the code "FF" flashes between the above cycles. I'm lost. what's wrong with this thing and should i buy the runco ? for sale in my area?

[dmarnold]

just got off the phone with the guy who read the labeling to me as "DTV 933" which according to this site's cross reference is a NEC 6PG xtra. going to have a look at it in a couple hours. hasn't been fired up in some years. hope its a nice one.