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Clarence
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 3827
Location: Smith Mtn Lake, VA
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:28 am Post subject: Dell M109S - 50 ANSI lumens, 858x600, 800:1, 10K LED, $399 |
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I'm curious... the 10,000 hour LED sounds interesting.
But 50 ANSI lumens, I'd have to see.
At 60", so do you think it'd be better or worse than an ECP?
But 000.8 lbs!
Not for HT, but would it be fun for kids to use/carry as a 60" TV for their iPod, PSP, Wii?
50 lumens... would that allow any ambient light?
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Dell M910S - $399, 858x600, 800:1, 50 ANSI lumens, 10K LED
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?sku=224-0939
PROJECTION
Brightness:
50 ANSI Lumens (maximum)
Contrast Ratio:
800:1 Typical (Full on / Full off)
Resolution:
858 x 600 (SVGA)
Uniformity:
80% Typical (Japan Standard – JBMA)
Projection Lens:
F/2.0, f=17.67 mm fixed lens
Image Size:
15 - 60 inches (diagonal)
Projection Distance:
23.6 – 94.5 inches (60 cm – 240 cm)
CONNECTIVITY
Multi-input connector to:
- DC power input
- VGA connector
- Composite connector
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LIGHT SOURCE
LED Module Light Source Life Cycle:
Up to 10,000 hours
LIGHT SOURCE TYPE:
R/G/B LED module
HDTV (1080i, 720P, 576i/P, 480i/P)
Composite Video
Component Video
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AUDIO
Noise Level: 32dB (A) (Normal Mode), 35 dB (A) (Bright Mode) KEYSTONE CORRECTION
Auto Keystone and Vertical Keystone Adjustment
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dimensions (W x D x H):
3.64" x 4.12" x 1.46"
Weight:
0.80 lbs.
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Clarence
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 3827
Location: Smith Mtn Lake, VA
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Brooklyn
Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:52 am Post subject: |
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Definitely worse than a ECP CRT. They are meant for business travelers who need to show visuals without accurate color reproduction, contrast ratio, response time, etc.
For kids, they probably wouldn't notice the difference.
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Brooklyn
Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:38 pm Post subject: Re: Dell M109S - 50 ANSI lumens, 858x600, 800:1, 10K LED, $3 |
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| Clarence wrote: |
At 60", so do you think it'd be better or worse than an ECP?
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Probably worse, but there are a slew of under $800 used digitals that will simply murder an ECP. There are some new with 3 year warranty digitals at $1000 that will also keep up (and in some ways exceed) most 8" machines now.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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garyfritz
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 12088
Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: Dell M109S - 50 ANSI lumens, 858x600, 800:1, 10K LED, $3 |
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| Clarence wrote: | | 50 lumens... would that allow any ambient light? |
Depends on the screen size. If you try to project to an 8' wide screen, you won't see much even WITHOUT ambient light.  But with a smaller screen... e.g. with a 4 sq ft screen you'd get 12.5 ftL -- typical CRT viewing level. So a 2.66' x 1.5' screen (32x18") would give you the same type of light you get with your G90.
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Mr. Green
Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary
TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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It would be really amusing to go from a giant CRT and go straight to an IPod sized projector. Hopefully, they'll get to 1080p resolution in the next few years. I want to skip the current "bulb" projectors when I finally have to go with a new technology.
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You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.
Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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Leo
Joined: 02 Oct 2006
Posts: 55
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26706
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:09 am Post subject: |
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Hmmmm maybe I just found something to play with next year 
Ok let me be the first to sugest it. A retro fit for the CRT projectors to RGB lasers
Whaddaya think? 
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Tech support for nothing
CRT.
HD done right!
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Leo
Joined: 02 Oct 2006
Posts: 55
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| Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:26 am Post subject: |
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| AnalogRocks wrote: |
Hmmmm maybe I just found something to play with next year
Ok let me be the first to sugest it. A retro fit for the CRT projectors to RGB lasers
Whaddaya think? |
Considering the first generation of these are going to be limited to DVD resolution and 10-20 lumens, I am actually thinking a stack or blend of these paired with a dalite high power screen would rock!
I know you're joking about retro-fitting a crt, but I would strongly advise against it none-the-less. The reason is that although lumen output will be very low with the first generation of these laser projectors, Ansi contrast (as well as on/off) should be quite high. Think about it, you have a single laser beam bouncing off a dlp-like mirror to your projection surface. There is no lens or complex optical path which causes light scatter and kills ansi contrast. A stack or blend of these could potentially yield the highest ANSI contrast as well as on/off from any video projector to date!
I should also add that if you like the image quality of CRT you will probably like this as well:
Soft edged pixels that blend into one another for a film-like image.
Image is created one pixel at a time, so motion/movement should be very smooth and no sample-and-hold effect.
If projector can be calibrated, colors should be fantastic due to color range and color saturation of laser light.
No details yet...but resolution may be adjustable because there is no fixed resolution.
Anyway, we will know in 6 months.
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perisoft
Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY
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| Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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As far as laser projectors go, my big concern is laser sparkle - I'm not sure how or if you can get rid of it. Laser sparkle would be obnoxious even for gaming or presentations, let alone HT.
I saw a quite amazing laser projector at the I/ITSEC military show a year or two ago; it was very bright on a 50" or so rear projected screen, and was running 5500x4500. Yes. They had a flight simulator mockup, kind of like google earth, and you could stick your nose up to it and see detail on the horizon - it was like a high quality poster print. The resolution was staggering. Couldn't evaluate color/contrast/blacks due to the content.
But it had laser sparkle. Bleah.
Not that I'd turn one away if UPS brought it...
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26706
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| perisoft wrote: | As far as laser projectors go, my big concern is laser sparkle - I'm not sure how or if you can get rid of it. Laser sparkle would be obnoxious even for gaming or presentations, let alone HT.
I saw a quite amazing laser projector at the I/ITSEC military show a year or two ago; it was very bright on a 50" or so rear projected screen, and was running 5500x4500. Yes. They had a flight simulator mockup, kind of like google earth, and you could stick your nose up to it and see detail on the horizon - it was like a high quality poster print. The resolution was staggering. Couldn't evaluate color/contrast/blacks due to the content.
But it had laser sparkle. Bleah.
Not that I'd turn one away if UPS brought it... |
I could just see the paniced UPS driver trying to recover THAT package LOL
( Knock on the door )
(Peri:) Yes?
(UPS guy ) Hi I delevired a pakage here yesterday by mistake. I need it back I was told it was worth more than I'll make in the next 3 years!
( Peri: ) Package......I didn't see any pakage.
(Camera looks over Peri's shoulder to 'his' newley mounted 50" Laser screen mounted to the front of his driving simulator. )
(UPS guy )Um ok....are you SURE you didn't see a big box on your front porche yesterday?
( Peri ) Nope, nothing here when I got home from work ( 12 steps away across the yard lol )
(UPS guy ) My boss is goimng to kill me!
( Peri: ) Good luck with that.
( closes front door )
( UPS guy drives away )
(Camera tracks to the side of the house, looking through window, slow pull in )
( Peri's leaning on the simulator squnting at the screen )
(Peri: ) Danm! That woman needs to wax !
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CRT.
HD done right!
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perisoft
Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| AnalogRocks wrote: |
(Camera looks over Peri's shoulder to 'his' newley mounted 50" Laser screen mounted to the front of his driving simulator. )
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Don't be ridiculous - that sucker's going in my HT. I also play games there, you know.
| Quote: |
(UPS guy )Um ok....are you SURE you didn't see a big box on your front porche yesterday?
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That dude better not leave a big box on my Porsche!
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26706
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| perisoft wrote: | | AnalogRocks wrote: |
(Camera looks over Peri's shoulder to 'his' newley mounted 50" Laser screen mounted to the front of his driving simulator. )
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Don't be ridiculous - that sucker's going in my HT. I also play games there, you know.
| Quote: |
(UPS guy )Um ok....are you SURE you didn't see a big box on your front porche yesterday?
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That dude better not leave a big box on my Porsche!
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LOL
DISLAIMER: I'm a car nut. Today I'm running on Sunoco 94 fumes and 3 hours sleep so expect some typos.
_________________
Tech support for nothing
CRT.
HD done right!
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Leo
Joined: 02 Oct 2006
Posts: 55
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: Dell M109S - 50 ANSI lumens, 858x600, 800:1, 10K LED, $3 |
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| Person99 wrote: | | Clarence wrote: |
At 60", so do you think it'd be better or worse than an ECP?
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Probably worse, but there are a slew of under $800 used digitals that will simply murder an ECP. There are some new with 3 year warranty digitals at $1000 that will also keep up (and in some ways exceed) most 8" machines now. |
You are saying that today I can buy a $1000 digital that will outperform or at the very least match the performance of my xtra or 808?, is this correct?
I remember people comparing a $5000 digital (forget the model but it was very popular) to an 8" a year or so ago and the general consensus seemed to be that it was on par with the CRT but I've never seen the claim made that a $1000 projector could actually out perform an 8: CRT
Which models would those be? I don't know much about digitalis and I'm not anti-digital but my buddy installed an Optoma HD72 in his home theater. He paid about $1600 for it perhaps 6 months ago. I don't think it compared favorably to either my PG xtra, Barco 808 or former G70. We did not do a side by side but there was nothing that I saw that looked as good as what I see on my Xtra. The Optoma was brighter, that was nice.
The brightness factor brings me to another point. I recently gave my brother a 1272 I had after the lamp in his 480P 16:9 digital ( I forget the model but it was old).. As I'm setting the 1272 up on a table, before we install it on the ceiling, He looks at the screen and said "That's much brighter than my projector was before the lamp went". Now this is in the middle of the afternoon. He said he could not watch his digital in the day at all where as you can easily watch the 1270 in the day providing you close the drapes etc. and the screen is not too big.
It just serves to show me that the brightness advantage with digitals is short lived not consistent and therefor not a real advantage after all. His digital was much brighter when we first installed it but was considerably dimmer than the 1272( which is not a very bright projector) after 1200 or so hours.
I think it's great if you can get a $1000 digital that performs as well as an 8"... You're just the first CRT owner (former owner?) I've heard say it.
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perisoft
Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY
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| Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 9:37 pm Post subject: Re: Dell M109S - 50 ANSI lumens, 858x600, 800:1, 10K LED, $3 |
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| stuffandpuff wrote: |
It just serves to show me that the brightness advantage with digitals is short lived not consistent and therefor not a real advantage after all. His digital was much brighter when we first installed it but was considerably dimmer than the 1272( which is not a very bright projector) after 1200 or so hours.
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I've seen low-end digitals with 1k+ hours that make my 808s look like it's turned off - and I'm talking about running the digital on the same screen at the same time. I doubt your experience there is normal.
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:21 pm Post subject: Re: Dell M109S - 50 ANSI lumens, 858x600, 800:1, 10K LED, $3 |
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| perisoft wrote: | | stuffandpuff wrote: |
It just serves to show me that the brightness advantage with digitals is short lived not consistent and therefor not a real advantage after all. His digital was much brighter when we first installed it but was considerably dimmer than the 1272( which is not a very bright projector) after 1200 or so hours.
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I've seen low-end digitals with 1k+ hours that make my 808s look like it's turned off - and I'm talking about running the digital on the same screen at the same time. I doubt your experience there is normal. |
I don't see why it wouldn't be normal.
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