CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

Paul dont give up buddy !!!!!!!! maybe someone there can help you out. And I am wondering if its a bad lens focus screwing you up. You could do it Looking intot the tubes but that is reallly hard to do position wise unless you set up a mirror infront of the lenses where it relects the tube face back to you, and you need to wear sunglasses, dark ones. I am most definitly comming to europe either in the fall or winter, I plan on stopping in London for a 4 or 5 days to visit my cousin. If you keep the PJ I would love to come toy uor place and do them for you. no charge just Fish and Chips out and a few pints !

Where in England are you located and how far from London?

Athanasios

Elaine Benes · Joined: 25 Apr 2006 Posts: 1416

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

I know he has had crt for years and just now was doing the maintanece stuff and working on the magnetics, so Paul may have moved the PJ from its original location, that is why i asked this.

Athanasios

garyfritz · Joined: 08 Apr 2006 Posts: 12088 Location: Fort Collins, CO

Sorry to hear that, Paul. Isn't there another CRT owner nearby who can lend a hand? It's always possible (though unlikely) that something is wrong with your magnets, and somebody who knows what to expect might recognize that. Assuming that's not the problem, a local helper could walk you through it and show you how it works. It really shouldn't be this hard.

stefuel · Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 5:07 pm Post subject:

There's soooo many of these God-awfull Marquees around that someone should make a Quee specific setup video.
This stig/flare problem has been a thorn in many a disgruntled CRT owners ass. The general proceedure for that operation is pretty much generic. Someone should at least post a video of that with close-ups of the screen.

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

stefuel · Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:30 pm Post subject:

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

stefuel · Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:59 pm Post subject:

I'm sure I don't know what "mod" you're talking about. I built some ducts to change the air flow circuit around the 4600 which reduced the internal temperature by about 20 degrees. I added a red c-element to improve the color. And I completely redesigned the front end and got rid of the awfull AmPro liquid couplings. I replaced them with Maquee couplings to increase the corner focus and contrast. That 4600 is still on the shelf half finished. I just don't have time for it right now. About the only thing that experimental 4600 needs is a kick in the bandwidth ass. It does a great job of 1080P 60 but that's about it.

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

I think that was it and I thought you or someone may have done somthing to a neck board to improves its reliability cause they always went bad, i saw this when i first got on the forum in late 2006 sometime, Like I said I researched both before the marquee got the go.

Athanasios

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

Back to this thread though I sent Andy (MadMrH) an E-mail to help out poor paul and said he sent him a PM. I wonder whats going on?

Athanasios

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:02 am Post subject:

PaulB · Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:06 am Post subject:

Thanks for the encouragement guys.

Well, I've decided to take a week off work and try to nail these bloody magnets. I just can't bare walking away from this, so close but yet so far, on the other hand I can't bare the thought of having to fiddle with the magnets for hours on end Sad

I really, really hate the magnet system on the marquee, whoever designed these needs to be shot! Mind you, so does the poor fool that fiddled with them in the first place Embarassed

Good points about the lens flapping, I've only touched upon them, will look at that in detail. Will also re-do the (temporary) install setup in case thats not helping the situation.

I'm at the other end of the UK unfortunately Athanasios, up in Scotland (beautiful scenery, dismal weather - summer has consisted of rain, rain and yep, more rain!) otherwise I would have been waiting at the airport for you pj in hand! Marquees are as rare as hen's teeth here!

Hey, its haggis and porridge we eat up here sonny, none of that sasanach fish and chips for us (we don't really but we need to keep up the pretence for the tourists)!

How are you getting on with the Frankenyokes - big difference from stock I presume?

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

Glad to see your back, I sent Andy Halliday an e-mail explaining your situation, did you get his e-mail? i think maybe you should have him help you out.
I have'nt even opened them up yet(franken yokes). Still working on other issues(Grounding problem) I'm glad it was that and not something wrong with the PJ.

Remember to disconect the astig amp connection when doing the cpc magnets.

Athanasios

garyfritz · Joined: 08 Apr 2006 Posts: 12088 Location: Fort Collins, CO

Paul, when you jump back into it, don't spend hours tearing your hair out. Run through just the minimum magnetic adjustment process quickly a few times, and describe to us *exactly* what you see. Maybe we can figure out what's up. Maybe the magnets are doing what they're supposed to but you're not aware of what to look for? Take pictures if you can.

I'm not at home so I'm going from memory on this, but here's a rough outline of how to do it. (Athanasios, please check me and make sure I didn't get something wrong.)

1. Work with one color at a time. Let's start with green and worry about red/blue later. Set the electrical (PIC 4) focus as sharp as possible, then adjust the optical focus for sharpest focus in the CENTER. At this point don't worry about flapping, zone focus, raster centering, or any of that stuff. Let's just go for learning how the magnetics work, and you only need to worry about the center for that.
2. Run the focus (PIC 4) down to 0 and contrast up to 100. Hit # until you get the dots pattern -- or, as I prefer, the dots and crosshatch pattern. The dots should be roundish blobs with slightly brighter edges -- like the picture you posted earlier. Adjust the stig (UTIL, 9, something? I forget) to get the dots as round as possible. Just adjust the center zone for now.
3. When your blobs IN THE CENTER are as round as possible, run the focus up to 100. You should see a bright area in your blobs, and bright bars inside the crosshatches. Now you adjust the flare ring. Twiddling the knob will move bright area one direction (up/down?) and rotating the ring will move it another direction (left/right?). (If that's not the behavior you see, do you have another set of rings? Maybe you have 6-pole magnets, in which case the second rings are astig rings that affect the blob's triangularity.) I find the crosshatches much easier to see than the dots. Adjust the rings so the bright bar in the crosshatches are centered vertically and horizontally. This will move your entire raster around, but don't worry about that at this point. We'll add raster centering into the mix once you've mastered the magnetics.
4. Run the focus down to zero to touch up the roundness of the blobs, and back up to 100 to touch up the bright bars. Hopefully as you run the focus from 0 to 100 and down again, you should see very little movement of the dots. They should stay stationary but just change in shape. If you see that, it indicates you've got the magnetic adjustment nailed.

That is magnetic adjustment in a nutshell. Remember to set the contrast back to a reasonable level before you sharpen up the focus again!

There are several other steps you need to add for a complete setup (full optical focus, including center/edge focus and lens flapping; centering the raster by adjusting the focus coil, which throws off the magnetic adjustment so you have to go back & forth a few times to zero in on a good setting; setting the zone focus; setting the zone astig; etc). But those don't seem to be the parts you're having trouble with. Let's just isolate the magnetic adjustment and get you comfortable with that first.

Gary

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

Gary shouldnt he leave the astig coils unpluged first then put them on after he has done the CPC rings?

Also sometime you may think you have 6 pole CPC rings when in fact the center ring does nothing, its blank. CJ has stated this before, as some set that have electronic astig have a Blank ring magnet. That might be what was going on before, I just remembered this while working.

Athanasios

VideoGrabber · Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 933 Location: Michigan

Athan,
> ...some set that have electronic astig have a Blank ring magnet. <

It would be ironic if Paul was frustrated when adjusting a ring that didn't seem to be doing anything, when it was a ring with no mags, which won't do anything. Shocked

Well... maybe ironic wouldn't be the best word for it. Wink

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

PaulB · Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 6:37 am Post subject:

garyfritz · Joined: 08 Apr 2006 Posts: 12088 Location: Fort Collins, CO

"Normal" magnets have 2-pole (for centering), 4-pole (for flare adjustment) and 6-pole (for fixing triangularity errors). Marquees use the focus coil for centering so one set of rings is "blank." I think they're totally non-magnetized and they don't have a twiddle knob. If you have a set of 6-pole rings, then there should be three sets of rings, but one of them (usually the center set) doesn't have the twiddle knob. The other two are 4-pole and 6-pole, and if you've got one of these you'll have to experiment to make sure you've got the right rings when you're setting the 4-pole.

Athanasios, if he had 6-pole magnets I think he could unplug his stig coils. But you have to adjust both shape AND flare when you set up the magnetics, and with an 8500 you set the shape with the astig adjustment. I think you need to keep it plugged in. Paul could experiment with just the flare (4-pole, getting the bright area centered in the blob) adjustment with the stig coils unplugged, but I'm not sure it would really help much.