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Bruce 09
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 747
Location: Kamloops BC, Canada
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 1:47 am Post subject: |
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Kal I just read somewhere you measured 14ft-L . Are you are saying that was on a 1.1 gain screen? what size is it I thought it was a fairly large screen as well right ? .
Bruce
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 2:02 am Post subject: |
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| kal wrote: | | Person99 wrote: | | kal wrote: | How'd you adjust CM on your Dave? Just eyeball it? Moving a colorimeter around to measure levels at various points of the screen seems too much of a pain to me.
Kal |
It is not that many points as the barco has the taper built in. You are already measuring the center, you just need to measure the right and left edges. |
Top and bottom too I suppose? Since the CM menu items let you do both directions.
Uniformity's something that has never bothered me at all. I can see it on an all even coloured screen but with any real content I can't. It may be because my screen is fairly low gain (1.1-1.2).
Kal |
In a 16:9 raster, top to bottom is not that bad, so I only did right/left
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 3:52 am Post subject: |
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| jkruger wrote: | | perisoft wrote: |
I wonder if there'd be some way to get the optical effect of LC while using the same tubes... eh, probably not without hosing the image up completely in other ways. Too bad tubes are so expensive.  |
Why not make some clear acrylic inserts that would attach to the tube face and have the same contour as the lc faces? Flat on one side and concave on the other? |
Because you will no longer have a lens.
It is the refractive index transition combined with the curvature that forms a lens. If I understand you correctly you'd end up with a solid block.
All that needs to be done is to remove the current bare tubes from the AC housing, fit them to LC housings, and fit LC lenses. You'll need brackets too. It's not that hard, I've done two NECs. The tubes themselves are the same.
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perisoft
Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 3:58 am Post subject: |
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Well, it doesn't make sense to try it before I get the room done, but once I get up and going well enough to really judge what the PJ can do it'll be a good upgrade for not much $. That'll get me to the top of the 8"ers! 
Well, I'm guessing the P16s can resolve better than the sonys in the 808s... but I'm more inclined to go for color and contrast than resolution, anyway.
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r.bauer
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 280
Location: The Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 7:33 am Post subject: |
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| perisoft wrote: | | Well, I'm guessing the P16s can resolve better than the sonys in the 808s... |
No. They perform the same.
| perisoft wrote: | | but I'm more inclined to go for color and contrast than resolution, anyway. |
If you swap the first two, you have your priorities just right. And you are probably on of the few out there.
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 8:32 am Post subject: |
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It's almost impossible to find colored c-elements to 8" retro lc hardware, so I used HD10 hardware in my 808s.
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WTS
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1276
Location: Calgary
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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Dave,
What are your approx setting in the CM menu for the various settings, ie: red H, red v etc, can't remember what the last 2 settings are. I do remember that for the last 2 setting in the menu, CRTea from the other forum said not to set those over 20 for what ever reason.
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Walter
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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Bruce 09
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 747
Location: Kamloops BC, Canada
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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OK so the 14 was a rounding up from a the spyder 2 measurement gotcha 
I see you used behr eggshell paint so your screen is probably right on the 1.1 1.3 mark.
11.4 is still a very high number on that screen you must be driving them pretty good , OR the eye one is a little optimistic as well
I would suggest using the cm card, the ccm on the marquee really makes a noticeable difference. Like dave said earlier it's really only three measuring points ( I would imagine you must have done hundreds already) are really needed, But do it before gray scale setup.
Bruce
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Bruce 09 wrote: | OK so the 14 was a rounding up from a the spyder 2 measurement gotcha
I see you used behr eggshell paint so your screen is probably right on the 1.1 1.3 mark.
11.4 is still a very high number on that screen you must be driving them pretty good , OR the eye one is a little optimistic as well |
Not driving very hard at all: Contrast is at 65/100 and my green gain (aka "drive") is down from a default of 69 to 60 and the other colours are greyscale calibrated to match (so the same as reducing contrast 9 points). It's an incredibly punchy image without any smearing/blooming. About 2500 hours on the PJ and tubes.
| Quote: | | I would suggest using the cm card, the ccm on the marquee really makes a noticeable difference. Like dave said earlier it's really only three measuring points ( I would imagine you must have done hundreds already) are really needed, But do it before gray scale setup. |
I've actually already played with it a few times. It pretty much simply lowers the contrast in a big circle that you can resize and move around. I did notice a different on an all even coloured background but not on movie content really. Likely just me not noticing/caring. Next time I redo my greyscale again I'll try it out again.
Kal
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| kal wrote: | | Bruce 09 wrote: | | Kal I just read somewhere you measured 14ft-L . Are you are saying that was on a 1.1 gain screen? what size is it I thought it was a fairly large screen as well right ? . |
Mine's a 96x54" screen. Info on how I painted it is here: http://www.curtpalme.com/Building_a_Screen5.shtm
13.8 ftL according to innacurate Spyder2. 11.4 according to the more accurate Eye-One Display LT. 
Kal |
I still don't believe that number. I think your screen is 1.0 gain which means you'd need to be throwing out 410 lumens to do that. If it is 1.1, you'd need about 370 Lumens. I had a known calibrated 430 lumen output projector set up right next to mine. Let me tell you, ours is not doing near that! Ours look to me to be much closure on most content to PJs with about 280 lumens that I tested. If you are pushing it, you might be in the low 300s for all but the smallest white box. You might get close to that on a 10% window, but on real high APL content, you are getting less.
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Dave
A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Person99 wrote: | You might get close to that on a 10% window, but on real high APL content, you are getting less.
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I misse this part above. Yes, of course, this rating I'm giving is all on a 100IRE 10% window pattern. At full screen it's about 1/2 that amount.
I tried the 18% window patterns on the new DVE: HD basics and the numbers are the same, so light output on my projector doesn't change when you go from 10 to 18% window.
When people say you should be doing 12-16 ftL on a screen/projector setup, they always mean relative to a window pattern (usually between 10-18%) from what I understand. At least that's what the experts have been telling me. This matters for plasma's and CRTs but not other technologies.
It's all relative - I suppose someone can't say "I get 12 ftL" without quantifying it.
Kal
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