CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

dochlywd · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 7:09 am Post subject: Spyder3 WORTH BUYING?

My curiousity and desire to actually start really getting to know this hobby of mine has me wanting to learn how to do greyscale and gamma. Are these lower units worth buying as an entry level device that one can start the learning curve with? I've had my G90 set up by Ken Whitcomb a while back. I added an HDVD player pretty soon after that but haven't really used it that much since it's a little dark and hasn't been calibrated. I can't see the "shadow" on the HDVD logo that everyone talks about when the gamma is set correctly and the shadow detail just insn't there. I would love to use this as an opportunity to learn this procedure.

So, will the Spyder products suffice? Or do you need to have one of the CP5000 expensive units? If the Spyder products work just fine, where does one start to learn this procedure? Keep in mind that I have absolutely no experience or background knowledge so I am about as green as it gets?

Also, is there anyone in the St. Louis area that knows this procedure and would want to swing by and give me a '101' on this?

Thanks!

Doc

kschmit2 · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:32 am Post subject:

You can't use the Spyder3 to calibrate external players yet, unless you buy Calman ($200 or so), and even then CRT PJs are not supported in Calman yet.
Support is pending though. They are simply waiting for a fix from Datacolor.

Once the Spyder3 is fully supported in Calman, it should be very good. My initial tests using the Spyder3 Studio are extremely pleasing.

The Spyder3 sensor will also be added to the HCFR calibration suite (freeware). HCFR is about as good as Calman.

Ultimately I think there will also be a SpyderTV 3 Pro. That would be Datacolors HT calibration system with support for front projector calibration, and external sources. It'll cost in the range of $800 though, and still use the same Spyder3 sensor as the cheapest package. So I don't think it is a reasonable alternative to Calman or HCFR.

Kai

**kal** · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 3:31 pm Post subject:

I'll be putting together a simple greyscale procedure using the HCFR software and the inexpensive Spyder2 sensor (hover over for price) very soon as a sticky in this Audio & Video Calibration forum. Excellent results are each to achieve. Mine's reading down to 10IRE consistently when I extend the reading period.

Digital Video Essentials: HD Basics [Blu-ray] is currently on sale as well for $16.95 and has all the patterns you need if you want to calibrate to HD colour space (Rec709). Also available on HD DVD (for $2 more for some reason).

For less than $100 you can learn and do a complete greyscale from start to finish and measure your primaries/secondaries. I've been playing with this combo for about a week now (on and off) and am almost ready to put together the complete start to finish guide. No previous experience in any of this will be necessary. One of the problems I've had with previous instructions is that they assume people know what IRE, primaries, gains, cutoffs, and other terms mean.

Kal

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 7:05 pm Post subject:

dochlywd · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 7:35 pm Post subject:

Thanks Kal!!!! It's been kind of bugging me for over a year now that I have a nice HT but really don't know much about the calibration area (both audio and video). I would REALLY like to start diving into this. I could NEVER be as good as Ken W. (video) or Mark Seaton(audio), but I would DEFINITELY like to be able to hold an intelligent conversation with them!!!! Plus, my buddies are always asking for my help. I tell them that I have a lot of the pieces of the puzzle up in the 'ol noggin, but I haven't put them all together yet. So, it would be nice to be able to help them out to the point of a decent video and audio calibration. And then if they want to take it to the next level, they can call in the BIG BOYS!!!!

To Kal and others here,

THANKS FOR ALL YOU DO TO KEEP THIS HOBBY GOING STRONG!!!!!

Doc

**kal** · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 7:39 pm Post subject:

No problems! I get frustrated myself when I have to wade through post after post after post trying to figure out what stuff means. Rec709? Rec601? Huh?

Experience gets someone really good at doing greyscale but that doesn't mean that the average person can't take their setup which is likely completely off and get it 80-90% of the way there.

You're supposed to redo greyscale every time you change any components and after so many hours on the tubes or bulb (digitals are worse for the colours drifting with age) but not everyone can afford to spend $300-500 on a calibration every 6 months or year. That's crazy.

Kal

dochlywd · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:37 pm Post subject:

Can it be any of the SPyder2 sensors? Or does it have to be the Express? Not sure if the sensors are all the same but the software is what is different.

Thanks!

Doc

**kal** · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject:

Yes, it can be any of the packages as all the Spyder2 sensors are the same, it's only the software that is different and you're not going to use the software anyway for your projector. That's why I recommend the least expensive one: The Spyder2 Express at around $60.

If you want to do some more advanced things with TVs or computer monitors you can get the more expensive packages (like the Spyder2 TV) and it comes with better software. The instructions I'll put together will use the free HCFR software so it doesn't matter which package you buy.

Kal

larryk · Joined: 23 Aug 2007 Posts: 106 Location: Edmonton Alberta

That's music to my ears, thanks Kal for doing this. I would really like to be able to properly setup grey scale, I tryed but with no previous experience in this area I just didn't get it. I have the Spyder2 and I am ordering the bluray DVE right now so it's ready and waiting.

Larry

**kal** · Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 2:04 pm Post subject:

Sounds good Larry! My own adjustments are going really well - I really don't see anyone having too many problems with this. The only other requirement will be some way to hold the Spyder in front of the screen. A cheap tripod works fine.

Kal

Moose · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 788 Location: Minnesota

So where can the HCFR software be downloaded? And what is it, exactly?

Moose · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 788 Location: Minnesota

Never mind - HCFR download is available here : http://www.homecinema-fr.com/colorimetre/index_en.php

David_Web · Joined: 02 May 2007 Posts: 418 Location: Sweden

Is there any way to manually (or automatically) input data to HCFR?
I have a huey calibrator and can easily read the corrected levels it outputs to the gfx card.
The raw numbers of the primaries is available in this forum.

**kal** · Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 5:36 pm Post subject:

You can simply hit the "Editable Data" (or something like that) checkbox and then enter your own data by hand.

Kal

**kal** · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:38 pm Post subject:

The GREYSCALE CALIBRATION FOR DUMMIES guide is now up for those that haven't seen it already!

Kal

ang007 · Joined: 08 Jul 2008 Posts: 1