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HPhase out on one tube Barco909

 
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Flash



Joined: 08 Aug 2017
Posts: 32
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 3:12 pm    Post subject: HPhase out on one tube Barco909 Reply with quote


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Technician here today trying to solve my on-going Barco 909 saga.

He took the lenses off and managed to perfectly centre the rasters on each of the tube faces. The settings are far from 49/49, but the technician reckon this is because these are aftermarket replacement tubes.

So with the rasters definately centred on the tube faces, the image is shifted over to the extreme edge of the blue raster when itís perfectly centred on the red and green rasters. Technician has never worked on a Barco before (Iím in North of Scotland so CRT techs are a little thin on the ground). Technician wants to know whether there are controls inside the projector that will allow the blue HPhase to be adjusted separately?

Does anyone know the answer to this?
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23813
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your tech is off the mark. New or used or rebuilt tubes, it doesn't matter. The overall raster shift has no adjustment independently for each tube in the H position, there are only adjustments of the V shift on the V board.

THe H phase adjustment controls all 3 tubes at the same time. In the 100s, or 1000s of projectors I've worked on, I've never seen the H phase being out on one tube only. H phase is a function of the incoming video signal, and I simply can't see it being off on one tube only.

Take the lenses off, and post a pix of the test grid pattern on the face of all tubes, and then with a video signal as well.
Thanks!
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Flash



Joined: 08 Aug 2017
Posts: 32
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland


PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We managed to figure out whatís causing this. The raster center fine on the tubefaces, and the internal test pattern almost fills the rasters although itís slightly offset to the right in all three tubes by the same amount.

Sending a image through prior to convergence, it also appears centred on the raster on all three tubes, once H-Phase shifted.

The problem with the blue tube was only occurring after aligning the crosshairs and converging. The convergence was pulling the whole image over to the righthand side of the tubeface.

We noticed that the blue lens was toed in 3mm further than the red lens, so what we did was instead of aligning itís crosshair, we aligned the outside of a test pattern on it, which resulted in a toe within 0.5mm of the red lens, then converged from there. The resulted in an imagine that was properly centred on the ratser.

The horizontal shifts needed to centre the raster were still pretty weird though, but theyíre def centred, it was much easier to do this with the lenses off:

Course Green 37H
Course Red 42H
Course Blue 53H

Donít have time to take the lenses off just now, the tech has to leave at 3pm today.
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23813
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 10, 2020 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've found that to be pretty normal in the 909s, your numbers aren't bad at all.
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Flash



Joined: 08 Aug 2017
Posts: 32
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland


PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At last! Itís working! Thanks for all your help.


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SPL800



Joined: 10 Nov 2009
Posts: 148
Location: Israel


PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:06 am    Post subject: . Reply with quote

very nice detailed picture you got.
what resolution do you feed the barco?
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Flash



Joined: 08 Aug 2017
Posts: 32
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland


PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Standard 1080p@59.94. Either the card I have or the projector itself doesnít like 1080p24, which means the panning shots can be a little jerky in some scenes.

The problem I have though is that it will only play Blu Rays properly. My original Denon player scaled DVD to Blu Ray but the projector displayed them stretched vertically but squashed horizontally. Assumed that this was an issue with the player, so I purchased a brand new Pioneer LX800 (the best there is), and the same thing is happening. Next I tried a Decimator Scaler and I canít even get a picture out of it, even with Blu Ray.

Interestingly the projector will display modern very recent DVDs, for example it plays Fargo Season 2 correctly.

Now Iím suspecting that it may be the HDMI card in the projector. This is an Eisemann card. I also have that most recent version of the Moome card sitting unused in a box. So questions:

Whatís the Moome Card rated at in terms of 1080p? Will it display 1080p24 correctly, or is the just beyond the bandwidth of a Barco 909? Any ideas what could be up with the Eisemann card?
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SPL800



Joined: 10 Nov 2009
Posts: 148
Location: Israel


PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flash wrote:
Standard 1080p@59.94. Either the card I have or the projector itself doesnít like 1080p24, which means the panning shots can be a little jerky in some scenes.

The problem I have though is that it will only play Blu Rays properly. My original Denon player scaled DVD to Blu Ray but the projector displayed them stretched vertically but squashed horizontally. Assumed that this was an issue with the player, so I purchased a brand new Pioneer LX800 (the best there is), and the same thing is happening. Next I tried a Decimator Scaler and I canít even get a picture out of it, even with Blu Ray.

Interestingly the projector will display modern very recent DVDs, for example it plays Fargo Season 2 correctly.

Now Iím suspecting that it may be the HDMI card in the projector. This is an Eisemann card. I also have that most recent version of the Moome card sitting unused in a box. So questions:

Whatís the Moome Card rated at in terms of 1080p? Will it display 1080p24 correctly, or is the just beyond the bandwidth of a Barco 909? Any ideas what could be up with the Eisemann card?


can you post your video chain. do you have any video splitter on the path?
i use Lumagen HDQ video scaler with 1080p@24 works perfectly.
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Flash



Joined: 08 Aug 2017
Posts: 32
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland


PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Itís just the LCX800 going straight into the HDMI card of the projector via a cable. The LX800 scales the picture to 1080p.
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km987654



Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 2789
Location: Australia

TV/Projector: Barco BG809s


PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flash wrote:
Itís just the LCX800 going straight into the HDMI card of the projector via a cable. The LX800 scales the picture to 1080p.


You can't feed 1080p/24 directly to a CRT projector as it won't sync to that frequency you need to have a processor. You can feed the processor /24 and then the processor can feed the projector /48/60/72. Not sure about the abilities of the LX800 but it sounds like its not really up to the task as there should be no image judder.
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