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shaky 3D-Theatre

 
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Poccapx



Joined: 29 Jan 2019
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 11:17 am    Post subject: shaky 3D-Theatre Reply with quote


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The purpose of my 3DN-200 is to convert HDMI signal from PC to view SBS/OU content on 2D monitors. The 3D is great; iím very happy with the depth Ė it really is cool to see ordinary two-dimensional screens suddenly show some elevation (always via button push on the back, no autodetection). Iím also not really bothered by the 60 Hz flickering (of the lucky few, i guess).

However, there is one problem: parts of the picture are more or less always juddering. Itís actually easily visible even without glasses, and especially on slow scenes. Attached are some enlargeable GIF-converted videos which i filmed of the screen when movies were paused. Iíve played a ton of them (SBS or OU, no difference), tested various conversion settings in TMPGenc during own conversion, 3D YouTube clips, even ran Tridef for games. Different computers (both stationary workstations and laptops), several screens (from 7" car monitors, to internal laptop displays via HDMI-in, to CRT screens). This judder is always there. The amount varies between scenes, but itís there.

What is this? The way 3DNOW produces the depth effect or a hard-/firmware problem on my unit? If itís the former, i guess itís possible to live with (after all, this is a really cool product). But if itís not supposed to work like this, something needs to be done (after even more, it is also an expensive one).

Please comment.

   
 
 
 



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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15848
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the forum!

I don't remember ever hearing of shaking like this. How long have you had the 3D-Theatre? Has it always been this way?

Biggest problem is that the 3D-Theatre is now discontinued and no longer available and the manufacturer defunct, so replacing it isn't going to be possible (unless you go used).

Kal

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Poccapx



Joined: 29 Jan 2019
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks alot! Less than a year. And itís always been like this. However, SBS/OU feed from PC via HDMI is the only feed it is used with (as i understand, most usage cases involve it being connected directly to some autonomous video source, like disc players, for displaying frame-packed BD movies). But you are saying that you know of cases where 3DN-200 was used on HDMI-out from PC for SBS/OU display, and this phenomenon wasnít observed?
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15848
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poccapx wrote:
But you are saying that you know of cases where 3DN-200 was used on HDMI-out from PC for SBS/OU display, and this phenomenon wasnít observed?

It's hard to tell from the tiny pictures how noticeable this is, but I don't see how this phenomenon could be considered normal.

Kal

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Poccapx



Joined: 29 Jan 2019
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can enlarge them slightly, as they are clickable. This is very much noticeable on slow scenes. If you have a 3DN-200, would you mind testing it on a PC HDMI-out? Any YouTube SBS clip will do, as this shaking is there on any content. There are currently 3D-Theatres available on Ebay, so if this is indeed a failure on my unit, i will be buying a new one. But for that i need to be sure that itís not an issue with any 3DN-200.
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15848
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The amount of 'jitter' or how much the image moves seems to be relative to how far in the distance the object is, and it's also different for the left and right frames (they move in opposite directions). My guess is that the 3D feature is turning on/off quickly, going between just passthrough and actually processing/converting the two frames to 3D.

I don't have a unit to test this. That said, as I mentioned above, I don't see how this could be deemed normal. It's unwatchable.

Kal

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Poccapx



Joined: 29 Jan 2019
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PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aye, this is especially noticeable on 3⁻ʳᵈ and 4⁻ᵗʰ images, where only the backgrounds are shaking while the forefronts are stable.

The lack of unit to test is unfortunate. I guess we will have to start discussing the refund question regarding this purchase. My order was placed on 1 march 2018. If you need further confirmation (like the original quality clips of the attached GIF animations) or some more testing on my end, i would gladly provide such.
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15848
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please contact the seller (Consignia) if a refund is being requested by replying to the original order email. They will be able to provide further support / confirm if this is actually an issue. While it doesn't look normal to me, they can confirm.

I'm confused why the refund however as a few hours ago you mentioned you could live with this issue when you wrote "The way 3DNOW produces the depth effect or a hard-/firmware problem on my unit? If itís the former, i guess itís possible to live with (after all, this is a really cool product)."

I would try with a 3D Blu-ray player to confirm. If it doesn't happen there then it's likely source/signal related.

Kal

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Poccapx



Joined: 29 Jan 2019
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PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The order was placed here on CurtPalme.com. Original order letter contains 2 addresses, 3d@curtpalme.com and kal@curtpalme.com, which i guess is you.

The refund can be partial. I said that i can live with that if thatís how 3DN-200 creates depth. But you have a several occasions said that this canít be normal. It would be very beneficial if you would have at least one unit to test, of course, considering your site was selling them less than a year ago. But however that may be, if a product is advertized as being able to use SBS content for input, and then displays an unwatchable picture, you are very right Ė itís not fully functional.
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15848
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Payment is done to the 3d@curtpalme.com email address which is set up in Consignia's PayPal account such that they are paid directly. From the order page: "Orders are fulfilled by our partner 'Consignia'. You are paying them directly when ordering.". CurtPalme.com does not have access to their account hence the reason you need to contact Consignia.

My kal@curtpalme.com email is not on any of the order emails sent to customers, but I do receive copies of everything sent to emails like 3d@curtpalme.com.

I looked up your order: You've been in contact with Jason at Consignia numerous times over the year so you'll need to contact them again for any warranty concerns or refunds.

Poccapx wrote:
I said that i can live with that if thatís how 3DN-200 creates depth.

I don't see how the image jumping back and forth creates depth. Looks incorrect to me.

Quote:
But you have a several occasions said that this canít be normal.

That's my guess. It doesn't look normal at all.

Quote:
It would be very beneficial if you would have at least one unit to test, of course, considering your site was selling them less than a year ago.

We don't have a unit to test. We don't sell them directly ourselves per my comments above.

Quote:
But however that may be, if a product is advertized as being able to use SBS content for input, and then displays an unwatchable picture, you are very right Ė itís not fully functional.

That's my guess. But again, best to contact Consignia and confirm. They are the experts on this product.

Cheers,

Kal

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Poccapx



Joined: 29 Jan 2019
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the elementary level, an image jumping back and forth like this is how the depth is created. In fact, all 4 images almost look like they have depth Ė ęthanksĽ to this shaking they look layered to me. Itís just that these ęjumpsĽ have to be much more frequent and not as noticeable. On slow scenes, this can even be sickening, so yes, this canít be working as intended. In the mean time, i have ordered another 3DN-200.
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15848
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually - good point! I forgot that you're taking a video directly of the screen (not going through glasses). So yes, it's flashing two different pictures back and forth (left eye / right eye / left eye / right eye / etc). So I take back what I said.

Kal

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smilerman1



Joined: 18 Apr 2019
Posts: 1



PostLink    Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a theatre plus box thats been in storage for a while. I wired it up ( I was involved in the development of the Theatre box so am familiar with the process) and while 2d pass through of video is fine, a 3d signal (bluray or iptv) lights up the 3d indicator but only audio gets through to the tv I am using. The screen is a dull black with a feww lines of large pixels at the top. Any ideas?
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