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jbltecnicspro




Joined: 23 Apr 2016
Posts: 512



PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


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HaydnG90 wrote:
Curt Palme wrote:
Went to go see a movie last weekend. The image didn't fill the screen, the color balance was a mile out, and the red image was peeking out to to the left of everything. Got 2 free movie tickets because of that. Smile


I agree I think the viewing public are way too accepting of the image quality. For them size is everything. We should complain more and only then will the Cineplexes buck up their ideas. I only go to IMAX presentations now (not the IMAX lite that Cineplexes upcharge) and even then only in 2D.


You can complain all you want, but what you just said is true. Joe Public doesn't care about image quality. There's a reason we're at the state in which we are, and that's because Joe Public only cares about size of image. Seriously. I did some movie nights with my Yamaha projector, which is 720p on a 92 inch screen. I was nervous that if some people sat too close they'd see pixels. NOPE! No one gave two craps. Everyone was like "WOW!"

Not to say that the Yamaha has a BAD image (it doesn't), but truth is that most people see the big image and that's good enough for them. Unless there's something glaringly bad at the center of the screen, most people don't notice imperfections at all.
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jbltecnicspro




Joined: 23 Apr 2016
Posts: 512



PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But hey the upside is that it's easier than ever to entertain friends! Just pop a movie on the big screen and prepare to be dazzled! Very Happy
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 17849
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7


PostLink    Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jbltecnicspro wrote:
You can complain all you want, but what you just said is true. Joe Public doesn't care about image quality. There's a reason we're at the state in which we are, and that's because Joe Public only cares about size of image. Seriously. I did some movie nights with my Yamaha projector, which is 720p on a 92 inch screen. I was nervous that if some people sat too close they'd see pixels. NOPE! No one gave two craps. Everyone was like "WOW!"

Very true. Whenever someone sees my JVC (which is now an older 2013 model but still frankly throws a great pic) they always say "I want that" but I tend to steer them towards something cheaper because frankly, most people just don't care about image quality.

Kal

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Last edited by kal on Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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km987654




Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 2852
Location: Australia

TV/Projector: Barco BG809s


PostLink    Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These are the things that people here care about and just like audio enthusiasts we notice things that others don't care about.

Last edited by km987654 on Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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rod




Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Northern Ontario, Canada


PostLink    Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I finally had to jump to digital after my 1208/2 died after having it for 12 years; before that an Electrohome 7" since 1999 (setup was with pots!). Was seriously contemplating a Cine9 until dismounting the ol 165lb monster and reviewing Cine9 setup process. I decided it was time to risk digital despite pretty much any digital home setup I saw to date was garbage. I have to say the new digital pic is stunning, especially in 4K HDR.
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HaydnG90




Joined: 22 May 2006
Posts: 1335



PostLink    Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rod wrote:
I finally had to jump to digital after my 1208/2 died after having it for 12 years; before that an Electrohome 7" since 1999 (setup was with pots!). Was seriously contemplating a Cine9 until dismounting the ol 165lb monster and reviewing Cine9 setup process. I decided it was time to risk digital despite pretty much any digital home setup I saw to date was garbage. I have to say the new digital pic is stunning, especially in 4K HDR.


Which pj did you get?
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rod




Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Northern Ontario, Canada


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Optoma UHD65
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Rod
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pj-toso




Joined: 19 Mar 2015
Posts: 69
Location: Norway - Oppland


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rod wrote:
Optoma UHD65


Why did you go from crt to a projector like UHD65? Crt is known for its good on/off contrast and low black levels. From what I have read about the Optoma, it has barely over 1000:1 in contrast and generally very poor black levels? I do not say that it is poor projector, but I would like to know why and what you like about it?

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rod




Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Northern Ontario, Canada


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not arguing your comment related to CRT vs digital. I seriously considered a Cine9, but in the process of waiting for one to come available I reconsidered.. Factors included living in a remote area and not having qualified techs to repair (Curt for example lives 10 Norways away from me), future parts availability, mounting and dismounting 165-185 lbs vs 30lbs, setup.... All personal choice of course. In 1999 I soughed at all of that!

Back to the UHD65, it has good reviews compared to others (in that price range). You can check all the specs online. CR for example is 1,200,000:1 (not the 1000:1 you stated).

As the late Tom Petty wrote, "Time to move on".

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Rod
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gjaky




Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2789
Location: Budapest, Hungary


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rod wrote:
CR for example is 1,200,000:1 (not the 1000:1 you stated).


FYI even the human eye does not have a dynamic range of 1,000,000:1, so if that spec would be true that projector should be able to project a wider range of light intensities than what your eyes can perceive.
Think about a completely dark room and the sun at noon, does your (or any?) projector reproduce that range, I doubt Wink

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projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
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Pzyked




Joined: 02 Apr 2017
Posts: 30
Location: Sweden


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The UHD65, has around 700-1200:1 native contrast on off, or less for shore. But anyway it will bring out a very good picture overall, that no CRT will do in many areas.
But like said here on off is not this projectors strong side. So black will be grey compared directly with a CRT.

Here real measurement of the UHD65.



Last edited by Pzyked on Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:29 pm; edited 2 times in total
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pj-toso




Joined: 19 Mar 2015
Posts: 69
Location: Norway - Oppland


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rod wrote:
Not arguing your comment related to CRT vs digital. I seriously considered a Cine9, but in the process of waiting for one to come available I reconsidered.. Factors included living in a remote area and not having qualified techs to repair (Curt for example lives 10 Norways away from me), future parts availability, mounting and dismounting 165-185 lbs vs 30lbs, setup.... All personal choice of course. In 1999 I soughed at all of that!

Back to the UHD65, it has good reviews compared to others (in that price range). You can check all the specs online. CR for example is 1,200,000:1 (not the 1000:1 you stated).

As the late Tom Petty wrote, "Time to move on".


Real life measurement of native calibrated contrast on the Optoma UHD65 is about 1000:1. Just search Optoma UHD65 native contrast. It is stated several times on avsforum and other places. The Optoma specs are pure fiction.

And again, I dosent claim that the projector is bad, it is probaly very good value for money, but then again a poor choice if you are interested in inky deep blacks.

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Audio_Geek_00




Joined: 07 Aug 2014
Posts: 82
Location: SF Bay Area


PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm out of CRT. My 1252 died and parts weren't available, which is not going get better no matter what CRT pj you have. I've lost interest in working on CRT and chasing fixes. I haven't chose a replacement as of yet but OLED is in the cards, at least for a replacement of my current TV, and likely an eventual solution for my theater. Until then a JVC or Sony digital for the interim. Digital has its' issues. I won't know if I can tolerate them until I try one. Not having my theater running is a bigger issue for me than the differences between CRT and digital right now. When it comes time to change a digital projector will be easier to sell. Good chance that if I picked up another CRT it would be a boat anchor by the time I need to replace it, or I can't find parts to keep it running and recycle it like I did my 1252. Not interested in that path again. No doubt CRT is the target performance, but that dance is coming to an end.
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garyfritz




Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 12023
Location: Fort Collins, CO


PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Audio_Geek_00 wrote:
Until then a JVC or Sony digital for the interim. Digital has its' issues. I won't know if I can tolerate them until I try one.

You might be pleasantly surprised. I bought a 5-yr-old JVC RS-45 and it's dramatically better than my 8500 in every way. My 8500 was never perfect, but the RS-45 beats it hands-down. I'd bet a similar JVC would blow you away.
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Audio_Geek_00




Joined: 07 Aug 2014
Posts: 82
Location: SF Bay Area


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:09 am    Post subject: Digital Reply with quote

garyfritz wrote:
Audio_Geek_00 wrote:
Until then a JVC or Sony digital for the interim. Digital has its' issues. I won't know if I can tolerate them until I try one.

You might be pleasantly surprised. I bought a 5-yr-old JVC RS-45 and it's dramatically better than my 8500 in every way. My 8500 was never perfect, but the RS-45 beats it hands-down. I'd bet a similar JVC would blow you away.


Good input. I'll likely be able to suffer through ok Very Happy My Sony had a less than stellar image, even after I re-tubed it. Image got brighter and a little sharper but still a little soft for my tastes. Blacks and refresh good. I won't miss the fan noise. But it did make for a good heater Wink
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 17849
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Definitely! I think you'd be shocked coming from an 8", non-LC, non-EM focussed CRT projector and going to a JVC digital. I know I was and my CRT was a bit higher grade (LC and EM).

Kal

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Spanky Ham




Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have both a JVC and an OLED. The latter gives me the blacks that CRTers always loved and wanted. It is only a 55", but it is more than satisfactory for me. I don't see a need to upgrade for a long time with this TV.

The JVC is great as well. At this point, I am not sure I would go all in and spend a lot of money. There is still a lot going on and no reason to be on the bleeding edge. Call Craig Peer at AVScience and try to get a b stock JVC. They had some blow outs at the end of the year with a RS400 going for $1500.
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Audio_Geek_00




Joined: 07 Aug 2014
Posts: 82
Location: SF Bay Area


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:
Definitely! I think you'd be shocked coming from an 8", non-LC, non-EM focussed CRT projector and going to a JVC digital. I know I was and my CRT was a bit higher grade (LC and EM).

Kal


Good to know Kal. I knew my Sony was a bottom rung pj but had no reason to replace it while it ran. Time to explore.
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Audio_Geek_00




Joined: 07 Aug 2014
Posts: 82
Location: SF Bay Area


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spanky Ham wrote:
I have both a JVC and an OLED. The latter gives me the blacks that CRTers always loved and wanted. It is only a 55", but it is more than satisfactory for me. I don't see a need to upgrade for a long time with this TV.

The JVC is great as well. At this point, I am not sure I would go all in and spend a lot of money. There is still a lot going on and no reason to be on the bleeding edge. Call Craig Peer at AVScience and try to get a b stock JVC. They had some blow outs at the end of the year with a RS400 going for $1500.


I agree. I'll buy used or B stock to get my toes in the water. Appreciate the info. I'll look into it. OLED has been on my radar since I read the first reviews. Then when I saw my first set I knew I had to own one. I am intrigued as to how large LG will be able to make these displays in the next few years. Wall sized obviously would be a pj killer. And 8k! I want that! Seeing that rollup demo unit at CES was compelling.
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kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 17849
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7


PostLink    Posted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Audio_Geek_00 wrote:
kal wrote:
Definitely! I think you'd be shocked coming from an 8", non-LC, non-EM focussed CRT projector and going to a JVC digital. I know I was and my CRT was a bit higher grade (LC and EM).

Kal


Good to know Kal. I knew my Sony was a bottom rung pj but had no reason to replace it while it ran. Time to explore.

I wouldn't call your CRT PJ 'bottom rung'. they can definitely through a nice pic.

I was in the same boat as you back in 2013 and was concerned that I'd be trading off image quality going from my 8" LC/EM machine to a JVC (as I'm fussy) and I had the opposite experience. You can read my findings here:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=32973

Kal

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