View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central
|
Link Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 5:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | Spanky Ham wrote: | I haven't kept up that much, but even with a wider color gamut how are you planning on displaying the wider color gamut on a CRT? |
Bloody good question that, brings me back to my first reply |
Theoretically one could make some new c-elements that would adhere to the new standard. The problem is that no one seems to know how to do it easily. A new c-element was talked about in the past, but the project fizzled. I guess it would be possible to use a translucent colored paint on the outside of the element, but I am not sure how good it would be.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 1608
|
Link Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 6:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Ok 2160i
Better case ?
_________________ Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 2790 Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
Link Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 6:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Spanky Ham wrote: | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | Spanky Ham wrote: | I haven't kept up that much, but even with a wider color gamut how are you planning on displaying the wider color gamut on a CRT? |
Bloody good question that, brings me back to my first reply |
Theoretically one could make some new c-elements that would adhere to the new standard. The problem is that no one seems to know how to do it easily. A new c-element was talked about in the past, but the project fizzled. I guess it would be possible to use a translucent colored paint on the outside of the element, but I am not sure how good it would be. |
A good question if it is a viable solution to crop the rec709 color space out of the (otherwise) bigger rec2020 (with software) and transform the primaries, what is missing from the 709 it should be substituted somehow, just an idea.
_________________ projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central
|
Link Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
If you reduce it down to REC709 then you are eliminating one of the big advantages of going to new standard. The hope would be that even if you couldn't go UHD resolution then you could at least take advantage of higher bit and expanded color. Barring that then there would be no real reason for a CRTer to use the new BR.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia
|
Link Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
ElTopo wrote: | Ok 2160i
Better case ?
|
Have you tried it yet??
Ive done 2560x1600 before, and it wasnt sharp enough to bother.
_________________ Barco CineMAX, 120" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 5.1...
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 2790 Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
Link Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 5:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
Spanky Ham wrote: | If you reduce it down to REC709 then you are eliminating one of the big advantages of going to new standard. The hope would be that even if you couldn't go UHD resolution then you could at least take advantage of higher bit and expanded color. Barring that then there would be no real reason for a CRTer to use the new BR. |
The color space might be smaller, but that doesn't mean you can't experience the advantage of the better color resolution -maybe.
_________________ projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
virusc
Joined: 11 Apr 2007 Posts: 322 Location: Massachusetts
|
Link Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 12:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
So I meant UHD blu ray and not cinema 4k. Everyone but one person here I think assumed that too. I have used a d5 deck 4:2:2 10bit video to a CRT projector and I can tell you it is amazing due to 4:2:2 and 10bit. If we could have that UHD disks somehow display 4:2:2 10bit to CRT it could hold me over until 4k projectors come down in price and they settle all the compatibility issues.
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 1608
|
Link Posted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 1:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I tried 2048 x 1536 (4:3) and that was fine.
You could then use 2 projectors with that resolution and blend.
2 x 2048 = 4096 and gives you a blend zone of 256 to achive 3840
For cinemascope you only need 1536p like it is with 800p.
My Sony CRT monitor looks superb sharp with that resolution.
ElTopo
_________________ Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia
|
Link Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
This isnt about CRT monitors with very high bandwidth though, this is about a Barco CRT projector that i dont reckon will do what you think it will.
Trying 2048x1536 is nothing special, i said before i did 2560x1600 and it was soft, what i want to know ElTopo, is have you tried 3840x2160i on your machine?
1536p is NOT like 800p, youre 64 lines short, and what do you then do for 2.35:1 or 1.78:1 movies? Boarders at the sides? Youre still 75 lines and 624 lines short. You either cut parts off or distort and scale, and for what?
_________________ Barco CineMAX, 120" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 5.1...
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia
|
Link Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
virusc wrote: | So I meant UHD blu ray and not cinema 4k. Everyone but one person here I think assumed that too. I have used a d5 deck 4:2:2 10bit video to a CRT projector and I can tell you it is amazing due to 4:2:2 and 10bit. If we could have that UHD disks somehow display 4:2:2 10bit to CRT it could hold me over until 4k projectors come down in price and they settle all the compatibility issues. |
No, all except one person has an interest in using the correct term, rather than being the sheep that follows the masses in thinking UHD and 4k are the same thing, when theyre vastly different. One is a commercial standard, the other is consumer grade.
The thing is, youll spend all kinds of money to make this work, and it wont serve you the same as just buying the right projector for the job in the first place.
I have sent 1920x1080 stills to my CineMAX at 4:4:4 and sure it looks great, better than 4:2:0, but if i put 3840x2160 stills on my Barco and compare them to my UHD monitor, theyre truly worlds apart, even if i set them 1:1 on the Barco and only view 1/4 of the image. Ive downloaded half a 3840x2160 demo video and viewed it on both, the Barco doesnt look much better than a regular bluray, where as the UHD monitor easily looks 4 times better.
Try sending 2160i to a CRT projector and see what you reckon.
_________________ Barco CineMAX, 120" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 5.1...
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 1608
|
Link Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
I don't have a gaphic card with analog out which supports that resolution.
Any graphic card which does it ?
_________________ Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Jeremy112
Joined: 28 Sep 2006 Posts: 2645 Location: Fond du Lac, WI
|
Link Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
ElTopo wrote: | I don't have a gaphic card with analog out which supports that resolution.
Any graphic card which does it ? |
To my knowledge no graphics card out there supports an analog resolution over 2048x1536. I only know that because I was recently looking for a graphics card for the HTPC to support 4K for projectors. The one thing I noticed is that none of them supported 4K or UHD with analog signal. Most did support 4K however through DVI, HDMI, and/or DisplayPort.
I'd be quite surprised to see one CRT be able to resolve a 4K image that would be worth watching... I just don't see it happening unless some magical new CRT projector just came out that supports 4K natively like most current CRT PJs supported HD natively)
the blend idea for doing 4K sounded like something that could happen though... but I wont go there since I've never attempted a blend or even seen how one gets setup, so I'll just keep my mouth shut on that subject
_________________ When I'm asking for a Model number, that doesn't mean I'm asking for a nude photo with your number on it
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CIR Engineering
Joined: 25 Aug 2008 Posts: 4264 Location: Chicago USA & Berlin Germany
|
Link Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 4:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Haven't read the whole thread, but I will say that what I have seen is that the BD ultra HD color spec is going to use Rec709 but have more color information and better codecs. So color depth should be better on 4K BD as it stands now and the existing CRT color gamut will be compatible... for the moment.
Im on vacation now in Glacier National Park, but I can post more about this when I get home. There is almost no internet here let alone cell phone service.
craigr
_________________ *NEW JETI 1501-HiRes 2nm Spectroradiometer
JETI 1211 Spectroradiometer
Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer
Klein K10-A Colorimeter
X-Rite i1Pro2 Spectroradiometer & Spyder Colorimeters *For JVC auto-calibration when Klein & Jeti are not applicable
Murideo Fresco SIX-G HDMI 2.x Multimedia Generator
Murideo Fresco SIX-A HDMI 2.x Analyzer
*NEW Light Illusion ColourSpace XPT Version β Color Calibration Software
Light Illusion LightSpace XPT Pro Version 10.x Color Calibration Software
*NEW OMARDRIS JVC Software Patch to use K10-A and Jeti with JVC OEM AutoCal Software!
Sencore CR7000 CRT Tube Analyzer / Rejuvenater
Authorized Dealer for Lumagen & just about everything worth buying
www.CIR-Engineering.com - craigr@cir-engineering.com
Phone: 865-405-6892
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 1608
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia
|
Link Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 2:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
The Sony CRT monitor will probably have in excess of 200MHz bandwidth, making it no problem.
The nVIDIA 760GTX can output 2560x1600 via analog output.
_________________ Barco CineMAX, 120" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 5.1...
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 1608
|
Link Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 6:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
The tv one's should also do interlaced with 2048 x 1536.
Will try that.
_________________ Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia
|
Link Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 12:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Im still interested to know what relevance 2048x1536 has with anything at all.
_________________ Barco CineMAX, 120" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 5.1...
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
ElTopo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 1608
|
Link Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 1:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
2048 x 1536 = 4:3
So if you have this on each projector you get 8:3 = 2,66666
Minus the blend zone you'll get 1:2.35 / 1.2:40
It would be the same as Nashou does with 1064 x 800 on each = 2128 x 800 (2,66 incl. blendzone of 208)
_________________ Barco Cine 9 the one and only
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
xmob135lc
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 80
|
Link Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 7:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
ElTopo wrote: | 2048 x 1536 | x 60hz (72... 75... 90)
if this fits into the TV one's framebuffer in its entirety (can use scale / zoom operations?) it could be interesting to me (sent PM why).
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 Posts: 6319 Location: Australia
|
Link Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 5:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
ElTopo wrote: | 2048 x 1536 = 4:3
So if you have this on each projector you get 8:3 = 2,66666
Minus the blend zone you'll get 1:2.35 / 1.2:40
It would be the same as Nashou does with 1064 x 800 on each = 2128 x 800 (2,66 incl. blendzone of 208) |
But why 1536? Why not 1600 or 1636?
_________________ Barco CineMAX, 120" OZ Theatre Majestic 16:9 screen, H/K AVR 7.1...
RUNCO DTV991 LC ( NEC XG 852 LC ) 100" 4:3 screen, H/K AVR 5.1...
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
|
|