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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
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Location: Budapest, Hungary
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 Link Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| draganm wrote: | | ...then VDC switched back to the 1100 again. Does anyone know what year that happened? |
I think that was in 2008.
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current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Link Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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Arrgggggggggg Ok for the last time to get the colors to match does mean you need only high band width , there are other factors also!! If the lines are resolved and are sharp the BW/MTF is good. Then there are other variables to get them to match in color and brightness.
My old Marquee 8000 had a nice uniform 1:1 and that had stock boards with 1080p@48 now my blend with a much lower BW to the PJ's can not get the uniformity my M8000 had. its all about set up. Geezus freaking Christallmighty *******!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok I feel better now
Nashou
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2251
Location: The Netherlands
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| Link Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| gjaky wrote: | | draganm wrote: | | ...then VDC switched back to the 1100 again. Does anyone know what year that happened? |
I think that was in 2008. |
He I have a 2008 VIM that just arived and it has the clc449.
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Nashou66 wrote: | Arrgggggggggg Ok for the last time to get the colors to match does mean you need only high band width , there are other factors also!! If the lines are resolved and are sharp the BW/MTF is good. Then there are other variables to get them to match in color and brightness.
My old Marquee 8000 had a nice uniform 1:1 and that had stock boards with 1080p@48 now my blend with a much lower BW to the PJ's can not get the uniformity my M8000 had. its all about set up. Geezus freaking Christallmighty *******!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok I feel better now
Nashou |
If that was pointed at my post, i had no intentions to talk about color match, it was just the pics i had from my G90, and displays very will how you cant evaluate bandwidth of the source on a display where the bandwidth performance is very low, and based mostly on peaking to keep up a output level at high resolution.
But im willing to put the color match into the debate if you like. Just dont think it has much to do with the Moome card. 
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Francisco
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 305
Location: The Netherlands
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| Link Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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THANK YOU NASHOU!
Pfff I sometimes get a point head (as we we call it in Dutch) from you Kurt!
Always bashing Barco hammering at lack of BW. Now I own several Barco's 909 series (Sony's in the past as well) and can tell you that the BW 1:1 performance raised drastically from stock boards and moome ext. V2 and V3 to modified by Greg boards and the new Moome Barco-HD board. It does 720p hands down. Also 817p@72hz, and 1080p@60hz very well.... maybe not as good as your inferior Marquee, but as Nashou stated there are also other variables to look at and that is very true.
As my personal test results are that this internal Moome Barco-HD board has a slightly better performance than ext. V3 with stock Barco video chain.
When you take modified video chain you surly will benefit the better BW capabilities and clean signals out of the Moome Barco-HD board and it wil show you a: noise free, sharp and very reasonable 1:1 BW
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Francisco wrote: | THANK YOU NASHOU!
Pfff I sometimes get a point head (as we we call it in Dutch) from you Kurt!
Always bashing Barco hammering at lack of BW. Now I own several Barco's 909 series (Sony's in the past as well) and can tell you that the BW 1:1 performance raised drastically from stock boards and moome ext. V2 and V3 to modified by Greg boards and the new Moome Barco-HD board. It does 720p hands down. Also 817p@72hz, and 1080p@60hz very well.... maybe not as good as your inferior Marquee, but as Nashou stated there are also other variables to look at and that is very true.
As my personal test results are that this internal Moome Barco-HD board has a slightly better performance than ext. V3 with stock Barco video chain.
When you take modified video chain you surly will benefit the better BW capabilities and clean signals out of the Moome Barco-HD board and it wil show you a: noise free, sharp and very reasonable 1:1 BW |
Its great that the bandwidth has improved, my intentions was not to pick on the 909, more to pick on how its possible to evaluate the bandwidth performance on a moome card when nobody has ever shown the 909 to resolve a 720P 60 hz signal.
Im trying to defend the Moome card here, as i think its the best thing ever happened to CRT projectors, and illustrate that different dacs can make a low bandwidth projector behave opposite of what you expect, and its important to look beyond 1:1 full on off, but also evaluate how 1:1 behaves from black to white if you want to find a decent compromise.
Ill love to see how well the new solutions do the 720P 60hz, and again im sure the Moome card will be a great piece of hardware for Barco machines to.
The Sony V3 card i have here do a perfect 200Mhz pixel clock, and the new Barco card looks to be quite identical design. 
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| Francisco wrote: | THANK YOU NASHOU!
Pfff I sometimes get a point head (as we we call it in Dutch) from you Kurt!
Always bashing Barco hammering at lack of BW. Now I own several Barco's 909 series (Sony's in the past as well) and can tell you that the BW 1:1 performance raised drastically from stock boards and moome ext. V2 and V3 to modified by Greg boards and the new Moome Barco-HD board. It does 720p hands down. Also 817p@72hz, and 1080p@60hz very well.... maybe not as good as your inferior Marquee, but as Nashou stated there are also other variables to look at and that is very true.
As my personal test results are that this internal Moome Barco-HD board has a slightly better performance than ext. V3 with stock Barco video chain.
When you take modified video chain you surly will benefit the better BW capabilities and clean signals out of the Moome Barco-HD board and it wil show you a: noise free, sharp and very reasonable 1:1 BW |
And at the end of the day the image on your 909 is probably still nicer that his inferior Marquee as well. Bandwidth might be an issue, but sharpness certainly is not.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 12:35 am Post subject: |
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| kal wrote: | | CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | ...its not that i dont want to believe what Kal says either, but he seems to make no real secret of the fact he doesnt think much of Greg's work, for whatever reason ( ive never seen one given, here or on AVS ), as almost every single time Greg comes here and states a claim, Kal is right on here to argue the point, having owned a Cine 8 Onyx, which isnt even in the ball park of being capable of 1920x1080p without SERIOUS reworking. |
Please read all the comments I've ever said about Greg's mods. I (like many others) are not saying that they don't improve the image or that they're not a step in the right direction. What we are always commenting on is how the information is presented. Greg gives hard facts like "a 600% increase in image quality" when nothing is provided to explain where that 600% comes from (for example).
I've never used or seen Greg's mods so I cannot comment at all as to how well they work.
Now back to our regularly scheduled program...
Kal |
I have yes, youre all over him basically every time he makes a claim. It sure does look like there is more to it than just his stated figures. Not to say it is, but i must say i almost never ever see you jump on any one else, but youre straight onto Greg the second he posts!!
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 17860
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 1:13 am Post subject: |
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| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | I have yes, youre all over him basically every time he makes a claim. It sure does look like there is more to it than just his stated figures. Not to say it is, but i must say i almost never ever see you jump on any one else, but youre straight onto Greg the second he posts!! |
Thta's true.
We allowed him to have an official thread here about his products even though it competed directly against our own products. After continual threats from Greg that we moderate and remove posts from people that questioned him in this thread (culminating in him threatening legal action against us), I told him that while I wouldn't moderate or remove posts, that I would remove his entire thread if he didn't want anyone talking about his products. He agreed.
Since then I've tended to keep a close watch on all his comments and dealings (as well as what others say about his products). I don't need more of this noise. It's a giant waste of time. He used to also email me to take action for comments that people made on the AVS forum. Dealing with him via email/forum was generally very confusing.
Kal
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Last edited by kal on Thu Sep 25, 2014 3:37 am; edited 1 time in total
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 2:49 am Post subject: |
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Well it is very confusing trying to make sense of some of his emails yes, no arguement from me there.
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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| redfox001 wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | draganm wrote: | | ...then VDC switched back to the 1100 again. Does anyone know what year that happened? |
I think that was in 2008. |
He I have a 2008 VIM that just arived and it has the clc449. |
what about those 2008 neck-boards you just got. the ones with the fans. Look at the chip under the Black wires, that's your primary video input, what chip did they use there?
thanks,
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2251
Location: The Netherlands
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 5:01 pm Post subject: |
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| draganm wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | draganm wrote: | | ...then VDC switched back to the 1100 again. Does anyone know what year that happened? |
I think that was in 2008. |
He I have a 2008 VIM that just arived and it has the clc449. |
what about those 2008 neck-boards you just got. the ones with the fans. Look at the chip under the Black wires, that's your primary video input, what chip did they use there?
thanks, |
clc449 and the motorola transistors.
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draganm
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 8990
Location: Colorado
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| redfox001 wrote: | | draganm wrote: | | redfox001 wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | draganm wrote: | | ...then VDC switched back to the 1100 again. Does anyone know what year that happened? |
I think that was in 2008. |
He I have a 2008 VIM that just arived and it has the clc449. |
what about those 2008 neck-boards you just got. the ones with the fans. Look at the chip under the Black wires, that's your primary video input, what chip did they use there?
thanks, |
clc449 and the motorola transistors. |
ok, thanks
I guess they had stock of those for some time then, even into 2008. I know at some point they ran out, and a VDC Engineer told us they switched to HA1100. I don't like that chip, Electrohome used it in 1994 and part of 95 and while it was miles ahead of the old CL409 it's a low performance part by today's standards. Switching from the CL449 to the HA100 is an obvious drop in picture quality
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2251
Location: The Netherlands
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| Link Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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Yes true and guess what arrived from Hong Kong today?  5166 drop in chips for all the 1100 that I will find left on the Barco
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 7:16 am Post subject: |
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I will be interested to see the outcome of that Tjeerd
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2251
Location: The Netherlands
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| Link Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | I will be interested to see the outcome of that Tjeerd |
We have to remember that just replacing the 1100 by these 5166 might also raise the noise level. It takes much more to get it right but I will try what these will do on the neckboards. With the MP mods on the other boards there is not much noise. I found that especially using an internal hdmi lowered noise very much. I hope this Moome will do the same with the noise. I think it does because of the special caps.
Still i am much shaky to do Barco mods. Spare parts are very expensive. That is why the Marquee might be a better project for me. The Barco is more for people that just want to watch movies without all the modding
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:02 am Post subject: |
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Wouldnt you be able to reduce the noise by putting a 1pF cap between output and ground?
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redfox001
Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 2251
Location: The Netherlands
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| Link Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | Wouldnt you be able to reduce the noise by putting a 1pF cap between output and ground? |
Yes those kind of things and perhaps some coils in the dc supplies. Or low esr caps on some places.
The hardest thing that I am struggling for weeks now is why I could not simple replace the OPA688 limiter with a el5166. It should have worked but somehow the blanking signal did not get through and than the G2 ABL went wrong.
Perhaps I should post the schedules once here and perhaps a real electronics specialist knows why this different opamp rects different. I have been thinking on just making the schematic of a non inverted opamp on a mini board or so. But I don't understand it and that is not a good thing.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:37 am Post subject: |
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Macgyver might be worth a shot, the man has talent. ( not the one from the Phoenix Foundation )
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Link Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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Do this for the El 5166's . For decoupling use a 1nf, 10nf and a 100nf COG (or SMD film if possible) for decoupling chips then put a 22uf or higher Oscon across the power supply pins.
maybe get some other values to also test. Like 5nf,15nf, and 150nf etc. It be cool to try three different values sets on each channel and look for the noise levels and choose the one that cleans it up the best.
Athanasios
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Marquee Modifications and Performance Enhancement
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