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Vidikron Vision 70 1080p DLP projector issue

 
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 12:26 am    Post subject: Vidikron Vision 70 1080p DLP projector issue Reply with quote


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OK guys, I'm hoping Mac can assist here.

I had an installer bring in a high end ($30K!) Vidikron DLP projector. He inherited the customer from some other dealer that I think went under, and the projector is installed in a house that the wife got in a divorce. Her ex husband bought the projector, she now has it. She doesn't want to spend any money, go figure.

So, I told the installer that I'd never seen one before, but would look at it for $100. The problem was originally described as the 12 volt screen trigger output jack wasn't working, but that fault then morphed into 'the bulb comes on for about 30 seconds, then shuts off... AND the screen trigger doesn't work' Rolling Eyes Mr. Green

so.. I looked at the unit. Certainly not worth $30K IMHO, the case is welded together and powdercoated. PC boards are decently made, but no better than anything else.

What I found is that the 12 volt screen trigger is sitting at 9 volts continuously, right from when the main power switch is turned on. Powering the projector on and off via the remote doesn't change the 9 volts at all. It only drops to 0 when the master power switch is turned off, killing the power to everything.

So I got into the video input board where the 12 volt screen switch goes to. It's obviously very complex and I didn't get far. What I did see when I powered the projector up and down is that the bulb starts dim, then I see a blue flash on the screen for 1/10 of a second, then the fans change pitch, and the bulb sits there for maybe 30 seconds if that at an all black screen (no menus when I push the menu button), then eventually the bulb turns off, and the set itself keeps running.

That's consistent with what the installer says it does.

Now I talked to RUnco, that were trying to be helpful, but they can't assist much. With 2 ownership changes of Vidikron, almost all parts are discontinued and for sure the RGB board is NLA, which is where the screen trigger goes to.

I've made this deal with the installer: I said I'd post here, and will email Runco to see for sure if parts are NLA (I called after hours, the tech will email me back tomorrow). If parts are NLA and I can find no other repair depot to look at it, I will dive into it, to unearth the main power supply which may be bad, causing all problems in the first place. (installer nor the owner can tell me if the bulb going out started at the same time that the screen trigger failed).

I do suspect a common issue between the two problems, but my guess is that very few of these sets were sold in the first place, and with parts being NLA, the customer is probably screwed. If she decides to go for a new projector, then the installer is begging me to find someone to fix this. Short of sending the whole projector to Mac, does anyone have any other ideas here?

Cheers!
Curt
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Jeremy112



Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2643
Location: Fond du Lac, WI


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd agree with what you think it is, the power supply. I had an issue on a Sony where the video went to hell on it, got all washed out and lines in it, I thought for sure the mainboard was bad, BUT, just for the heck of it, since it's an older model, I reworked the entire PSU (mainly all the capacitors and some other small components that got hot from the years of wear and tear). After that it worked perfectly again. The set had over 8000+ hours on it, not bad for a 12 year old digital really!

How old is the projector? Other than that I would suspect the mainboard to be at fault, could be a IC or a power regulator on the mainboard? I've seen it happen on a few Epson 1080p units (but they aren't $30k Vidikrons)

If neither of those, then I wouldn't be sure unless I was able to examine it myself.

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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Second bulb has 100-200 hours on it, I'd assume the first one lasted about 2000. 7-8 year old projector maybe? We'll see. If no one comes through that can repair it, then with the customer's written permission, I'll strip it down to the power supply which is buried deep in the unit.
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macgyver655



Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508



PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I won't agree that it is probably the power supply. Laughing
A power supply failure is usually a no voltage issue rather then an off voltage issue. But, it is possible it could be the P/S. Is that an answer, lol. Very Happy
Surely there is a 12v regulator but I doubt it is the reg itself but rather the line being pulled down on either the output or input. Or maybe the reg itself. Laughing Is that an answer, lol?

Or maybe a rail that is feeding a dozen or half of regs and one of those regs have failed pulling the main rail down. Or one of those regs is feeding an ic that has shorted pulling down that reg and straining the rail. Is that an answer, lol. Laughing

But, you already know this. Very Happy

So what you have to decide is what is more economical for you. Spending hours trying to find the problem or just suck up the shipping and send it down, Laughing

Just let me know and I'm happy to assist.
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Jeremy112



Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2643
Location: Fond du Lac, WI


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

macgyver655 wrote:
Well I won't agree that it is probably the power supply. Laughing
A power supply failure is usually a no voltage issue rather then an off voltage issue. But, it is possible it could be the P/S. Is that an answer, lol. Very Happy
Surely there is a 12v regulator but I doubt it is the reg itself but rather the line being pulled down on either the output or input. Or maybe the reg itself. Laughing Is that an answer, lol?

Or maybe a rail that is feeding a dozen or half of regs and one of those regs have failed pulling the main rail down. Or one of those regs is feeding an ic that has shorted pulling down that reg and straining the rail. Is that an answer, lol. Laughing

But, you already know this. Very Happy

So what you have to decide is what is more economical for you. Spending hours trying to find the problem or just suck up the shipping and send it down, Laughing

Just let me know and I'm happy to assist.


Rofl Laughing

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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 25791
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

macgyver655 wrote:
Well I won't agree that it is probably the power supply. Laughing
A power supply failure is usually a no voltage issue rather then an off voltage issue. But, it is possible it could be the P/S. Is that an answer, lol. Very Happy
Surely there is a 12v regulator but I doubt it is the reg itself but rather the line being pulled down on either the output or input. Or maybe the reg itself. Laughing Is that an answer, lol?

Or maybe a rail that is feeding a dozen or half of regs and one of those regs have failed pulling the main rail down. Or one of those regs is feeding an ic that has shorted pulling down that reg and straining the rail. Is that an answer, lol. Laughing

But, you already know this. Very Happy

So what you have to decide is what is more economical for you. Spending hours trying to find the problem or just suck up the shipping and send it down, Laughing

Just let me know and I'm happy to assist.


You are such a helpful person Laughing

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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, Mac's points are very valid, and if it comes down to it, I'll ask the client if they want me to send the projector down to Mac for repair. I'm sure he can do it, but not sure if the end user wants to pay $500ish for shipping, customs, and for him to look at it. I have a feeling she will end up installing an $800 Costco special, and abandoning this one. Go figure.
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macgyver655



Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508



PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
Actually, Mac's points are very valid, and if it comes down to it, I'll ask the client if they want me to send the projector down to Mac for repair. I'm sure he can do it, but not sure if the end user wants to pay $500ish for shipping, customs, and for him to look at it. I have a feeling she will end up installing an $800 Costco special, and abandoning this one. Go figure.


Geez, that thing only weighs @ 47 lbs., how much could shipping be, 45-55 bucks each way using Fedex maybe, if you ship from Wa.? I ship AVR's heavier then that for that price.
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I was incorporating $100 for the time I've spent on it and $300 for you. Smile
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HogPilot



Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383


TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope the customer (or her husband) didn't pay $30K for that unit originally. It's MSRP was $11,995 back in 2006-2008 when it was new, and even the Isco 3/sled option was still under $20K total. I believe it was Vidikron's clone of Runco's RS-1100, as the product sheet specs are almost identical and this was sold back when Runco owned Vidikron.

That being said, it used an HD3 DMD and had pretty decent optics, so she'd be hard pressed to find anything new below about $2K that will offer any improvements in PQ. Anything at a retail store for $500 won't come close to this PJ. The repair route - if successful - will be her best bet.

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ecrabb wrote:
Curt Palme wrote:
Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure.

He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.

SC
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well that's the number I was given. It does have the sled, and remember that things are automatically more in Canada. Maybe it included the installation and screen, who knows.

also, we're dealing with a woman that has no concept of value of a HT, and regardless, she doesn't want to spend any money on it. It's like us going to buy a wallet at Walmart vs a Coach wallet. Very Happy
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2014 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just an update: Customer has declined any repair, I'd recommended that I send this down to Mac for a look-see. Instead, she wants to hire a lawyer to sue Runco for not having parts available.
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HogPilot



Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383


TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2014 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
Just an update: Customer has declined any repair, I'd recommended that I send this down to Mac for a look-see. Instead, she wants to hire a lawyer to sue Runco for not having parts available.


Haha, please tell me you are joking!?

_________________
ecrabb wrote:
Curt Palme wrote:
Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure.

He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.

SC
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 23921
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2014 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope, but in the client's eyes, it's a $30K projector with no parts available. I personally have had zero contact with the client, but the installer told her exactly the same thing that I would have regarding parts, Runco markups, etc.
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HogPilot



Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383


TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD


PostLink    Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I can kind of understand that perspective. I think she's wasting her time and money, but whatever floats her boat Smile
_________________
ecrabb wrote:
Curt Palme wrote:
Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure.

He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.

SC
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