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Digital Projector Purchase. Please Help
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 5:21 pm    Post subject: Digital Projector Purchase. Please Help Reply with quote


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Hey guys,

I know a lot of you have gone digital over the years and I'll be at least supplementing my fleet with a digital. I haven't looked into digital projectors since before I got my first CRT.

I still have the 9PG+ and the Marquee 9500lc (with a pile of new parts to go in). The issue is that we want to watch movies, but I want to do the bellows, add red C element, add new green and blue tubes that I've had for about 2 years and haven't had time to put in. I seem to be forever procrastinating as there's never enough time to even do more than walk up and put my hand on the projector and look at the parts sitting on the shelf above, give a sigh and walk away. I've spent about $9k on this hobby so I have no interest in walking away, I just need a supplement.

In the mean time I haven't had a projector up for almost a year (last October it came down to sell the house). I need the convenience of a digital so I can pull the marquee apart and have it spread on a bench so I can take time to work on it and still have something to watch. Let's just say the NEC isn't an option right now (as it would be the obvious solution).

We originally went to CRT as my wife is really susceptible to rainbow effect and motion artifacts, so back in the day, DLP was out, but LCD was terrible and washed out and all that. I think 3 chip LCD was just coming out when I stopped looking at them. don't know if those problems even exist anymore. I'm hoping you guys can let me know where to start as I don't have the hours at night to put into research like I did before kids. Especially a 4 mo old baby (I'm off work playing Mr. Mom again).

Looking to spend up to $2,000. Don't care either way about 3D (so would be a bonus, but not required), just want a decent projector with good lamp life and decent picture, blacks, etc... Just something that's a good overall projector, just to be the work horse until I get the marquee up and running or as the substitute if the marquee isn't working and I'm having people over. I used to use Projector Central as my main source of info with their top tens and such, but don't know if they are the most reliable source of info.

Any help is appreciated.

Curt, keep posting when you are doing road trips as I might need you to help with the marquee... I just have a feeling I'll need it. Wink

_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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the big E




Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would look into the three chip dlp units as they don't use a color wheel and are better in picture quality then the LCD ones(lcos units are a good choice also)
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crt king of black
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26690
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check out a couple year old JVC DLA. If you want something smaller loos at a Canon LCOS. JVC has the better black level from what I have read.
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Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24296
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I've seen, go for a JVC. You certainly can get a used one for under $2K, and I haven't heard of any major issues with them at this point.
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would you go used or get new knowing lifespan tends to be an issue with digitals?
_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I take it sites like projector central aren't any good. I've seen JVC being recommended a lot and they never have them in their top 10 lists.
_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, ouch JVC's are pricey.
_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24296
Location: Langley, BC

TV/Projector: All of them!


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A used one should be under $2K landed though, right?

When I saw the first generation RS1 at Cliff's place about 5 years ago, I was impressed. I'm sure those are well under $2K at this point, but I haven't checked.
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HogPilot




Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383


TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll make a shameless plug for my Sony VPL-VW200 in the classifieds: excellent optics and black levels, the Xenon bulb gives a much richer spectrum than UHP bulbs, and it's very quiet. Comes with an extra bulb!

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36464


EDIT: added link ~AR~

_________________
ecrabb wrote:
Curt Palme wrote:
Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure.

He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.

SC
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Jeremy112




Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2645
Location: Fond du Lac, WI


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Get a JVC.

Wink

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When I'm asking for a Model number, that doesn't mean I'm asking for a nude photo with your number on it Wink
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Jeremy112




Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2645
Location: Fond du Lac, WI


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HogPilot wrote:
I'll make a shameless plug for my Sony VPL-VW200 in the classifieds: excellent optics and black levels, the Xenon bulb gives a much richer spectrum than UHP bulbs, and it's very quiet. Comes with an extra bulb!

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36464


EDIT: added link ~AR~


Or Hogs if you want a high end projector Very Happy

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When I'm asking for a Model number, that doesn't mean I'm asking for a nude photo with your number on it Wink
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Jeremy112




Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2645
Location: Fond du Lac, WI


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Green wrote:
Oh, ouch JVC's are pricey.


I'd probably sell you my JVC HD-350 (RS10) projector for $600 if I got around to repairing the power supply Haven't seen what it can do yet, but then again my projects always take a back seat Sad

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When I'm asking for a Model number, that doesn't mean I'm asking for a nude photo with your number on it Wink
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HogPilot wrote:
I'll make a shameless plug for my Sony VPL-VW200 in the classifieds: excellent optics and black levels, the Xenon bulb gives a much richer spectrum than UHP bulbs, and it's very quiet. Comes with an extra bulb!

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36464


EDIT: added link ~AR~


I'll have a look at this and see what's what. I haven't looked at digitals in almost 10 years so will have to do some reading first.

Why are you getting rid of a newer unit?

_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has anyone here purchased a projector in the $1500 to $2500 range that's any good or is consensus still cheaper units are just that?
_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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HogPilot




Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383


TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Green wrote:
Has anyone here purchased a projector in the $1500 to $2500 range that's any good or is consensus still cheaper units are just that?


My $0.02 - obviously I'm biased - is that you will not find a new projector in your listed price range that comes close in overall performance to a used LCoS machine in the same price range. The optics alone on the Sony probably cost more than what I'm asking Smile

That being said, you get a much better bang for your buck in your price range than below $1500 for a new projector. There's some pretty decent machines out there in your range, but if you're coming from a CRT than none of them will even come close in terms of black level. LCoS is your best bet in that area.

_________________
ecrabb wrote:
Curt Palme wrote:
Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure.

He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.

SC
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Jeremy112




Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 2645
Location: Fond du Lac, WI


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with Hog all the way. The VW200 IMO would be a superior projector to any new $1500-$2000 unit. I have been scoping VW200s (aren't they nicknamed the sapphire?) because they are nice units overall, and still a worthy contender in the full HD projection department Smile

Hog I hope you sell it!! I'd buy it, but then I would be broke again! Razz

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When I'm asking for a Model number, that doesn't mean I'm asking for a nude photo with your number on it Wink
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah

TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Green wrote:
Would you go used or get new knowing lifespan tends to be an issue with digitals?

I wouldn't say "lifespan tends to be an issue with digitals." What I would say is some digitals are more prone to problems than others. It depends on what you're buying, who you're buying it from, and what you're spending. I'd feel pretty safe buying something in your target price range from a solid seller on AVS. Like Hog said, you won't find anything for under a couple grand that will compete in terms of image quality with a used Sony or JVC LCoS projector. For $1000-1500, you can get a hell of a used projector.

Mr. Green wrote:
Has anyone here purchased a projector in the $1500 to $2500 range that's any good or is consensus still cheaper units are just that?

I paid $2200 for my B-stock RS45 from AV Science about two years ago. Original MSRP was $3495, and new street was around $3000. I just sold it to move to a new place, and won't have a theater for awhile. It's truly a really excellent projector. In fact, it's the machine that got me to sell my G70 and switch from CRT. It's not perfect, but given that you've never seen a modern digital home theater projector, I think you'll be very impressed. You should be able to find a used one for in the $1200-1500 ballpark, depending on seller, lamp hours, and accessories. A slightly older machine like an RS20 or even an RS2/Pioneer Kuro Elite FPJ-1 would be great, too if it could be had for under a grand.

Hog's deal on his VW200 is also great. The only downside to those machines is lamp replacement cost, but since he's throwing in a lamp, you could probably use that machine for a year and flip it for close to what you paid.

HogPilot wrote:
That being said, you get a much better bang for your buck in your price range than below $1500 for a new projector. There's some pretty decent machines out there in your range, but if you're coming from a CRT than none of them will even come close in terms of black level. LCoS is your best bet in that area.

I agree completely. I'd just add that it depends on your expectations: Whether you had a gamma-corrected CRT, what CRT you had, and how much importance you place on other aspects of image quality and performance.

For me, I was a little concerned making the switch, but ended up happy to let go of a little black level (and I was a black level nut)… I was happy because in return I got superior sharpness, better brightness, good grayscale, and all in a massively quieter (read "essentially silent") package. That last bit was really important to me because the CRT really destroyed the noise floor in the room. I don't miss CRT at all, really.

SC
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the input guys. This is what I need to start looking again (knowing lots of you went away from CRT and are happy). I'm feeling pretty good about a good low hour used unit. I just need to convince my wife.

I did see that the bulbs on hogs unit are pricey. After all the years digitals have been around, you'd think bulbs would come down in price.

I'll look into some of the mentioned models and start working on my business case to my wife.

_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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Mr. Green




Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1394
Location: Calgary

TV/Projector: Marquee 9501LC / NEC 9PG+


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm assuming LCOS are easy on the eyes as far as fatigue and headaches are concerned?
_________________
You can be young only once but, you can be immature forever.

Current Projector Marquee9501LC with PS3 (BLu-Ray) at 1080P LOVE IT! Screen is an Elunevision 120" 4:3 (2.4 gain - no hotspots). (also own a NEC 9PG+)
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah

TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010


PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Green wrote:
I did see that the bulbs on hogs unit are pricey. After all the years digitals have been around, you'd think bulbs would come down in price.

Xenon bulbs are much fuller-spectrum, higher-quality light than the typical UHP lamps in most digital projectors. They're very low-volume and expensive to manufacture. There are probably literally hundreds of UHP lamps sold for every one Xenon lamp like in the VW200. Still, in general, I'm a little surprised lamp costs haven't come down much, either. I think it's because there's only a couple of manufacturers making high-quality lamps (Philips-Osram). The rest are all cheap Chinese knock-offs and don't last as long.

Mr. Green wrote:
I'm assuming LCOS are easy on the eyes as far as fatigue and headaches are concerned?

Definitely. I'm extremely sensitive to DLP rainbow, flicker, etc. I can't stand single-chip DLP. I think it looks terrible in almost every implementation. LCoS - either JVC's or Sony's implementation - has never bothered me one bit. It's more than just black level that has garnered LCoS the reputation of being the most "CRT-like" of any of the digital technologies in terms of visual display qualities.

Cheers,
SC
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