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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2790
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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 Link Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: |
Please post your 1080p 72hz 1:1 from your setup, and compare it to mine, running my hdfury4 |
The only valid way to evaluate this would be comparing oscillograms showing rise and fall times... |
Why is on screen performance not valid? |
Because you don't know what's your pj's bandwidth. Besides it's not hard to find oscilloscopes with 300+ MHz bandwidth. You pj's bandwidth surely not high enough to not fool the "measurement".
Two devices in series when each has a bandwidth of 100MHz you'll get a sum of 70MHz, while one is significantly better than tha it converges to the 100MHz, but only would reach if the other box would have infinite bandwidth.
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current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| gjaky wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: |
Please post your 1080p 72hz 1:1 from your setup, and compare it to mine, running my hdfury4 |
The only valid way to evaluate this would be comparing oscillograms showing rise and fall times... |
Why is on screen performance not valid? |
Because you don't know what's your pj's bandwidth. Besides it's not hard to find oscilloscopes with 300+ MHz bandwidth. You pj's bandwidth surely not high enough to not fool the "measurement".
Two devices in series when each has a bandwidth of 100MHz you'll get a sum of 70MHz, while one is significantly better than tha it converges to the 100MHz, but only would reach if the other box would have infinite bandwidth. |
I get that, and i dont have a scope that can go that high.
There is a reason to why i post pics of same signal but true different da converters, that to ilustrate the difference of the converters.
I dont need a scope to see that the hdfury has a problem resolving 1080p it wont even do 720p right.
I keep wondering why you guys always need more evidence all the time, from here it seems i post the most pics confirming performance from different video chains.
As long as no others seems to be able to do anything close to the bandwidth im running displaying a decent 1:1 1080p signal running 200mhz i doubt any of you can resolve a 720p signal right.
Your welcome to post scope measurements of your setup running 200 mhz and how that translate to the 1:1 pattern, and compare to mine.
Im also sure Mac will post some pics showing how a 1080p with contrast all up signal is supposed to look like on a crt. So ill feel ashame to post more pictures untill i also have 20 years of crt experience. And have Mike Parker calling me for help.
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 4:07 am Post subject: |
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I have a Fury 4 here, and probably Baclay66 coming here in the next time. Anything we could test to help?
(I got the Fury 4 as my moome Ext 3d was not able to convert 1080p at 3d capable refresh rates to analog. The Fury 4 did - but my 9500 Ultra setup was far from evaluating on the high level that stridsvognen offers. But the Fury only puts out a 3d sync signal if in 3d mode - and that means all is output is scaled to 720p with high refresh rates. If I feed the Fury 4 directly 1080p high refresh rate frame-sequential - I did get it converted to analog but no 3d sync signal. While the moome card, beside many limitations, always offers 3d sync in a for CRT "natural" 3D frame-sequential mode.
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| noos@xp37+ wrote: | I have a Fury 4 here, and probably Baclay66 coming here in the next time. Anything we could test to help?
(I got the Fury 4 as my moome Ext 3d was not able to convert 1080p at 3d capable refresh rates to analog. The Fury 4 did - but my 9500 Ultra setup was far from evaluating on the high level that stridsvognen offers. But the Fury only puts out a 3d sync signal if in 3d mode - and that means all is output is scaled to 720p with high refresh rates. If I feed the Fury 4 directly 1080p high refresh rate frame-sequential - I did get it converted to analog but no 3d sync signal. While the moome card, beside many limitations, always offers 3d sync in a for CRT "natural" 3D frame-sequential mode. |
It would be great if you can run 1080P 72hz RGBHV out of the Hdfury 4, and see if you get the same noise issue on the high resolution part of the SMPTE pattern, and its mostly after 30 min i see it.
I have no idea about the 3D performance and options, i never ever used any time with 3D.
Did you ever try to use the scaler GUI software.?
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:05 am Post subject: |
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Will do the 1080p72, plus a resolution at the high limit of the Fury4 - in any case I want to see if I can force that noise. Have not used it for some time. I did went higher than 1080p72, but no testpatterns in these days as I was focused to increase 3d experience. I am also pretty sure I used it for 1080i144 and higher refresh and more vertical lines. Modern GPUs do not /rarely interlace on analog outputs - so you need that DA converters to output interlaced from modern GPUs.
I have that noise ( all the time) when I run my Moome EXT 3D at 1080p72. So I guess that is beyond the specs.
I never uses the scaler firmware, as I was very satisfied with the special firmware removing/stripping stuff from the digital signal.
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| noos@xp37+ wrote: | Will do the 1080p72, plus a resolution at the high limit of the Fury4 - in any case I want to see if I can force that noise. Have not used it for some time. I did went higher than 1080p72, but no testpatterns in these days as I was focused to increase 3d experience. I am also pretty sure I used it for 1080i144 and higher refresh and more vertical lines. Modern GPUs do not /rarely interlace on analog outputs - so you need that DA converters to output interlaced from modern GPUs.
I have that noise ( all the time) when I run my Moome EXT 3D at 1080p72. So I guess that is beyond the specs.
I never uses the scaler firmware, as I was very satisfied with the special firmware removing/stripping stuff from the digital signal. |
Will be nice with other eyes on this.
Can you also tell me the trim of your Marquee, then i might be able to copy it, and compare results.
I like to know what VIM your using, a picture of it would be great.
Or see if it looks like any of those in the picture.?
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Will be able to this on the weekend the latest.
My 9500 Ultra came dircetly from BMW, now 5000 hours (4000/1000) mostly done by me. Bright and clean tubes (LCP/PT22-19/LCP). Can not access backside because of wall. I have a comparable 8500 Ultra from another BMW factory, would it make sense to compare them (VIMs) for the 9500 Ultra use? The 8500 Ultra backside is at hand....
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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| noos@xp37+ wrote: | Will be able to this on the weekend the latest.
My 9500 Ultra came dircetly from BMW, now 5000 hours (4000/1000) mostly done by me. Bright and clean tubes (LCP/PT22-19/LCP). Can not access backside because of wall. I have a comparable 8500 Ultra from another BMW factory, would it make sense to compare them (VIMs) for the 9500 Ultra use? The 8500 Ultra backside is at hand.... |
I think that the 8500 will do fine for testing.
My Marquee 9553 was a 800 hour machine from a VW factory, also had the P22 green tube, and a 02VIM with peaking trimpots.
If your VIM has the trimpots, you need to be sure they are not turned up to high, that can make noise in the high resolution part of the test pattern.
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you for the apology wolfman. Apology accepted. 
Kurt. Wolfman told me what you said to him and why he deleted his posts and let me just say this. This is not your forum. You should be happy you have a place to post what you do. If you don't like the static then open your own forum. And if you piss me off again I will start responding to all of your posts and rest assured you will not be a happy camper. I, along with others here have kept our mouth shut on some of the stuff you have posted. So if you want to keep it that way then just ignore the static and don't tell people to delete their posts cause you want to keep the thread clean. Note how I changed your wording from "your thread" to "the thread".
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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noos@xp37+
Is it possible i you can use a bit of time, and see if you can download and open the scaler GUI program.?
I need it to adjust timings, so i can push out raster ringing.
I failed to make it work on 4 different computers, so might be me massing something up.
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Link Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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And here is the PM I get from Kurt:
"pis pis pis all over you."
Now is this being adult like you ask everyone else to be?
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6319
Location: Australia
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| Link Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:00 am Post subject: |
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What does that really mean to the common man Ron? Or couldnt you make anything of it either? 
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:06 am Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | noos@xp37+
Is it possible i you can use a bit of time, and see if you can download and open the scaler GUI program.?
I need it to adjust timings, so i can push out raster ringing.
I failed to make it work on 4 different computers, so might be me massing something up. |
I remember when updating to the special firmware, that it took some efforts to exactly reproduce it.
In fact, as the HDfury is useless to me without 3d sync at anytime - I should try it as scaler. I will look into this.
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:19 am Post subject: |
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| noos@xp37+ wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | noos@xp37+
Is it possible i you can use a bit of time, and see if you can download and open the scaler GUI program.?
I need it to adjust timings, so i can push out raster ringing.
I failed to make it work on 4 different computers, so might be me massing something up. |
I remember when updating to the special firmware, that it took some efforts to exactly reproduce it.
In fact, as the HDfury is useless to me without 3d sync at anytime - I should try it as scaler. I will look into this. |
My intentions was to see if the Hdfury 4 would be able to replace the Lumagen Radiance as a frame tripler, running up to 200Mhz, and if the analog output allows also replace the Moome Card.
As it looks now the analog out replacing the moome card wont happen, but its still possible it will run a smooth HDMI 1080P 72hz output at around 200Mhz, i just need to make the GUI work to test it.
I run the standard 1080P 72hz 178mhz now, and have not seen any problems there yet.
Compared to the Radiance with the firmware it runs at the moment, the Hdfury passes a much better Croma signal.
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 6:20 am Post subject: |
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Updated HDFury4 to scaler (version 1.2 downgrade to Fury, than Scaler FPGA 1.2.).
GUI running (included 1.1 version), as far as I can tell. Only option is 1080p72 and 96 plus custom timings for them. But I have to read all about the dip switches for the scaler firmware. Or might change when I input something.
What timings should I test?
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| noos@xp37+ wrote: | Updated HDFury4 to scaler (version 1.2 downgrade to Fury, than Scaler FPGA 1.2.).
GUI running (included 1.1 version), as far as I can tell. Only option is 1080p72 and 96 plus custom timings for them. But I have to read all about the dip switches for the scaler firmware. Or might change when I input something.
What timings should I test? |
if you can test 72hz
Vtotal 1125
Htotal 2450
Thats around 198Mhz, see if it will run that without overheating or noise issues.
Ill try test it on mine here to asap, if it wont work ill need to ship mine back.
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, my Fury just died. Was not close to test custom resolution. No power, no matter how I fuel it. Can update firmwares, but Fury4 shows no reaction (led swicht active for signaling power state via led).
Will test tomorrow again. Sad!
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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| noos@xp37+ wrote: | Ok, my Fury just died. Was not close to test custom resolution. No power, no matter how I fuel it. Can update firmwares, but Fury4 shows no reaction (led swicht active for signaling power state via led).
Will test tomorrow again. Sad! |
Crap.. Hope it comes back to life..
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noos@xp37+
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Berlin/Munich
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| Link Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2014 9:39 am Post subject: |
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No, nothing. No outputs or lights.
I can update it and have Pc based access to itīs programmable components. I am not sure the scaler GUI has access via PC, so I will run it without the HDfury connected one time. But does not matter...
Hmmm, I should get in touch with the Fury base. I have read about a return program of defective HDfury4īs that are out of warrenty - so with 50 Euros or Dollars you get a new one.
wildchild22 still reading this thread?
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stridsvognen
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| Link Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2014 9:26 am Post subject: |
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I wrote Hdfury back 28 Jul. and have had no response, so i just requested a reply.
Im not sure if they all went on vacation, i hope they will extend my 30 return periode as they have been sitting on thair hands for 19 days.
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