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My Irule experience
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AnalogRocks
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PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


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Nashou66 wrote:
Steve how many iRule guys are there in Western New York area? Maybe I should look into doing it as well during my free time Wink

Nashou


You have free time?

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ecrabb
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PostLink    Posted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnalogRocks wrote:
Nashou66 wrote:
Steve how many iRule guys are there in Western New York area? Maybe I should look into doing it as well during my free time Wink

Nashou


You have free time?


Yeah, no kidding. Knowing how busy you are at the restaurant, I can't see you having the kind of time or flexibility to dedicate to it. I know I don't. I suppose you could do it - some even remotely - if you were just helping DIYers get up and running… Initial consults, speccing hardware, tweaking remotes, and that kind of thing.

There are 10 dealers in New York, but at least half of those are NYC-area, I believe.

http://iruleathome.com/dealer-locator

Cheers,
SC
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Spanky Ham




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PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, you have SoFl pretty much covered. Also, I see that you have like three dealers near my sister in NE Atlanta. Can't you give Crestron and AMX a piece of the action?Smile
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YEAH BABY! I have a basic program up and running! Only took 2 days. Can I offer my 'per hour' services to program something for you? Razz

As I said above, massive learning curve, made worse by me never having done any kind of universal remote programming. It's all about putting the right schtuff in the right place.

Going to set up a different A/V system tomorrow and will start from scratch. I pretty much have to do one of these per day in order to get up to speed. I did send Steve an email just now with a couple of other hardware ideas...
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Nashou66




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PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
YEAH BABY! I have a basic program up and running! Only took 2 days. Can I offer my 'per hour' services to program something for you? Razz

As I said above, massive learning curve, made worse by me never having done any kind of universal remote programming. It's all about putting the right schtuff in the right place.

Going to set up a different A/V system tomorrow and will start from scratch. I pretty much have to do one of these per day in order to get up to speed. I did send Steve an email just now with a couple of other hardware ideas...


Cool!! hey curt can you post in the first thread the links to the tutorials for anyone who wants to learn can do it.

Steve there is only one guy here in western net york that doest it and he does it for large conference halls schools churches etc. I could get into the home theater installation world possibly.

Athanasios

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ecrabb
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PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nashou66 wrote:
Steve there is only one guy here in western net york that doest it and he does it for large conference halls schools churches etc. I could get into the home theater installation world possibly.

Yes, you could… Just be careful… You could turn a perfectly good and fun hobby into hard work. I may know a little something about that. Wink

SC
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ha, my new Irule hardware is at the border. I now need to mentally prepare for a weekend of intense learning, extreme frustration, and (hopefully) exceptional elation! Smile
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Update: So I walked away from this for a week, while waiting for the new hardware boxes to show up. As per another thread here, I bought a GC-100 box used off eBay (then Steve jumped in and pointed out the limitations of it, DOH!), along with 3 more Icache boxes from Irule...

-IP2SL, wired serial interface
-WF2CC Wifi contact closure
-IP2IR wired infrared

I've said before that I lack massive training regarding networks, and for the last hour I had to re-learn what I learned last week, as I forgot a couple of crucial steps, namely talking directly to each module to reset them to a network IP address on my network rather than the default that comes with the box.

I now have run through all boxes, and all are talking to my network. Now onto programming a new system. This one I'll actually use in my upstairs HT with the Barco retro 808. I see that Barco codes are not in the IRule library, so here's a new learning thing for me, figuring how to input the IR codes into the IRule system...
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe someone here can give me assistance with a basic learning block I'm struggling with.

I understand the basics of Irule now, can muddle myself through setting up the hardware with Wifi or an IP address, etc.

What I'm having trouble grasping is how to link to a secondary page from the home page. I've done it twice before, but have been sitting here for 2 hours this afternoon, trying to do it with no success. Can't find any tutorial showing how to do it either on the Irule site.

Here's what I've done (and this is for my demo system..)

I've got my home page showing a bar, with 10 TVs over it. (see below).

I've created invisible buttons over each group of 4 TVs at the far left and right, and another invisible button over the two TVs in the center. Each of these buttons have been converted to links as per the tutorial. I now have no idea how to open the secondary pages when I press those 4 links on the home page.

The tutorial says : In the Link properties, select the panel name, page type and page name of the page that the Link will jump to.

Well, I can't do that, because I can't type in the page that I want the link to jump to!

So fundamentally I don't understand how to get a 'link' function to open a another page. HELP, I've been staring at this for 3 hours now, and am getting nowhere!

In the pix below, I want the button/link that I press that's on the leftmost 4 TVs to open another page that shows those individual TVs. Ditto for the rightmost 4 TVs.

I have created 2 pages that shows 4 TVs, called 'LEFT TVs' and 'RIGHT TVs', but I can't get the main button to link to those pages.



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ecrabb
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PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
The tutorial says : In the Link properties, select the panel name, page type and page name of the page that the Link will jump to.

Well, I can't do that, because I can't type in the page that I want the link to jump to!

So fundamentally I don't understand how to get a 'link' function to open a another page. HELP, I've been staring at this for 3 hours now, and am getting nowhere!

In the pix below, I want the button/link that I press that's on the leftmost 4 TVs to open another page that shows those individual TVs. Ditto for the rightmost 4 TVs.


Curt,

You don't need to type anything; Once you select a link, you then use the Properties box to:

1) Select your target Panel from the 'panel name' field/menu
2) Select your target Page from the 'page name' field/menu

You must select a target Panel from the Panel first. Once you do, that will then populate the 'page name' menu with pages from the Panel you selected.

SC
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, that's where the confusion comes in I guess. What's the difference between a panel and a page?

I've created 3 extra pages, one called 'Right TVs', one called 'Left TVs', and then the 'master off' page.

I'm still stuck on how to tell the link on the home page to go to the new pages...
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ecrabb
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think of a Panel as a folder. It's more than that, but think of it first and foremost as a hierarchical element. A folder contains things; a Panel contains Pages. Pages are what the user sees and interacts with. So, when you point a link at something, you point it at a specific Page IN a specific Panel.

There is no hard/fast rule for how to layout a remote. I've seen people build a giant remote of 20-30 Pages in a single Panel. I don't recommend that, and we had to limit Pages to a Panel because people were doing crazy things and it broke certain functionality. So, normally, you'd let organization, function, and user experience determine the layout.

With the built-in templates, Panels contain Pages for a certain activity, i.e. Watch TV or Watch Move. Within the Watch TV Panel, you have 2-3 pages for controlling a DVR for instance.

In your case, you might lay it out like this (first level is Panel, second is Page):

Home
- Home (layout) of TVs

TV1
- Control TV1 (modified iRule Watch TV page)
- TV1 Favorites

TV2
- Control TV2 (modified iRule Watch TV page)
- TV2 Favorites

TV3
- Control TV3 (modified iRule Watch TV page)
- TV3 Favorites

And so on. This assumes the TV tuners are controlling the content with a modulator or whatever.

If you were only powering the TVs on and off and controlling with a matrix switch and DirecTV or DISH receivers, then the remote would look a little different. In that case, you'd make tuner control pages for each tuner (or a single tuner control page and use Variables to set which tuner the user will control), and probably a single page to make source/display selections. You could probably build a remote like that with 2-3 pages.

Let me know if that doesn't make sense.

SC
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, a bit more. I need to abandon CRTs for 2 weeks, and build a new program every day.

I did figure out panels and pages, but the layout tree in the panel window still doesn't come easily to me.

Now let me ask you this, since I did finally get the new page to open, so the link works. Got the second one going too.

Now, if I don't program a 'return to home page button' (or I called it 'cancel'),then you're stuck on that page right, without the ability to return to the home page, right? The only way I could get out of the secondary page is by completely turning off the Iphone, powering back up, and then going into Irule again. Is there no way to avoid that if I forget a return to home page button on a secondary page?
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ecrabb
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TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010


PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
Yep, a bit more. I need to abandon CRTs for 2 weeks, and build a new program every day.

Nah, it's not that bad. Yes, you can build a new remote every day - that's an awesome way to learn a tool is to actually use it. But, just integrate it into your day. An hour or two a day here and there, when it's convenient.

Curt Palme wrote:
I did figure out panels and pages, but the layout tree in the panel window still doesn't come easily to me.

The tree is just a list. The order of the Panels really doesn't even matter much. It is mirrored in the app, but it's nothing the user will ever see.

Curt Palme wrote:
Now, if I don't program a 'return to home page button' (or I called it 'cancel'),then you're stuck on that page right, without the ability to return to the home page, right? The only way I could get out of the secondary page is by completely turning off the Iphone, powering back up, and then going into Irule again. Is there no way to avoid that if I forget a return to home page button on a secondary page?

If you have the "Hidden Navigation" option enabled, it will hide the "navigation bar", or "nav bar". The nav bar contains the Panels button on the left, and if you've navigated through the remote at all, the Back button on the right.

There are two ways to "dead end" yourself if you have Hidden Nav enabled. One is easy to fix, another not as much, and one that's a pain.

The first is probably the one you mentioned. With Hidden Navigation enabled, and no 'back' button or other link somewhere on a page, you'll get stuck on that page. The only way to to fix it is to press the iPad/iPhone Home button, double-tap the home button, slide over to iRule, and either tap the red 'close' icon (iOS 6), or flick the screen image up (iOS 7), which will close the app. Then, you can relaunch the app.

In addition to eliminating dead-end pages, you should also put a Navigation Element (Panels, Gateways) somewhere you can get to it. You can make it an invisible button so only you know it's there if you want. The reason this is important, is that you can define a Home Page and Panel. Defining a Home Page and Panel will make iRule open to that Page and Panel as soon as it launches instead of going to the Panels or Settings panes. This is a good thing for customer remotes, as you can put a PIN on the app settings (which will keep the peons out), and you can set a Home Page and Panel so the remote always opens to the Home, or at least to last-used page, depending on whether the app was running or not.

Now, here's the fun situation: If you've enabled Hidden Nav AND you've set a Home Page and Panel, AND you haven't put a Panels or Gateways Navigation Element somewhere in the remote, you'll have no way to get back into settings. You literally have to delete the app and reinstall from the App Store, then resynch you're remote and either setup, or restore your gateways.

Note that all this is alleviated if 'Hidden Nav' isn't enabled, as you can just use the Nav Bar to get out of the remote.

SC


Last edited by ecrabb on Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, discovering more as I go along. Steve, I see that with the Iphone pages, the pre-programmed ones in portrait mode have the 'back' and 'panel' buttons at the very top of the screen, outside of the area that you drag and drop buttons and functions in. When I turn the phone to landscape, and I made up my own page, those 'back' and 'panel' buttons at the top disappear. that's why my page locked up previously, as I had no access to those functions.

Is there a way to access the back and panel buttons in landscape mode, or do I need to drag a 'back' button into my button page?
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ecrabb
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no nav bar in landscape mode on the iPhone because the screen would be so short as to not be usable for much. I don't generally use the phone in landscape mode, but you could certainly add Links or Navigation Elements if you wanted to.

The only thing I typically use the phone in landscape mode for is to get creative. For instance in my WatchTV panel, all but one page is Portrait. The one landscape page is essentially empty. That's my Gesture page. In the panel, I've defined gestures defined. When I rotate the phone, iRule automatically displays the landscape page, and I have gestures for channel up/down, volume up/down, and mute - don't need to look at my remote at all. Rotate it back, and it's back to the buttons in the portrait pages. You could do the same for favorites, help pages, or whatever.

SC
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, gotcha on the nav bar. that's what I figured. It just happened that the pix that I found online of a bar with 10 TVs on it was a landscape pix. I then built up a landscape 'watch TV' page to match, so that you don't have to rotate the phone to change channels, etc.

I'm gonna call it quits for tonight, but will continue tomorrow to finish this. 6 hours in a day is more than enough. Smile

I'm a bit confused about 'copying' the 'watch TV' page. From what we talked about on on the phone, with the 10 TVs in a bar, as per the above pix, I'm going to need 10 individual pages of IR commands, one page per TV, correct? But, I should be able to cut and paste the layers between control pages, then I assign the independent IR codes of all 10 TVs, one set per page, right?

For some reason the page copy function isn't working right for me, but I'm too stunned right now to continue. Fresh start tomorrow. I think I'm stuck again on the panel/page thing...Will work on it before posting again.. thought I'd be completely done today, but I'm happy with the progress made so far.

I'll also need to address the 'one master Iphone/Ipad for multiple installations.. ie, I'm using my Iphone and Ipad for my home system as well as my portable demo system. Will need to figure out how to load in the demo program one day, but then revert the same handset back to my personal use.. if that can be done. Otherwise I'll need to buy another Ipad to be used with the demo system exclusively. Again, will check into that tomorrow.

thanks for the support!
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ecrabb
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
OK, gotcha on the nav bar. that's what I figured. It just happened that the pix that I found online of a bar with 10 TVs on it was a landscape pix. I then built up a landscape 'watch TV' page to match, so that you don't have to rotate the phone to change channels, etc.

Ah, when we were talking, I was thinking you were using an iPad. That's by far the most popular control device in a commercial setting. I'd make the remote a little differently for a phone.

Curt Palme wrote:
I'm a bit confused about 'copying' the 'watch TV' page. From what we talked about on on the phone, with the 10 TVs in a bar, as per the above pix, I'm going to need 10 individual pages of IR commands, one page per TV, correct? But, I should be able to cut and paste the layers between control pages, then I assign the independent IR codes of all 10 TVs, one set per page, right?

Let's just talk tomorrow. I can show you on-screen in five minutes what it will take us an hour to cover batting posts back and forth.[/quote]
We're releasing a new version for Android in the morning, but I'll have time after lunch (late morning for you).

Curt Palme wrote:
I'll also need to address the 'one master Iphone/Ipad for multiple installations.. ie, I'm using my Iphone and Ipad for my home system as well as my portable demo system. Will need to figure out how to load in the demo program one day, but then revert the same handset back to my personal use.. if that can be done. Otherwise I'll need to buy another Ipad to be used with the demo system exclusively. Again, will check into that tomorrow.

That's a piece of cake. I do it constantly. Just change the account username from the new customer account you were working on, back to your account, resync, and restore gateways. Takes less than a minute. I can even show you a little secret trick. Wink

SC
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Curt Palme
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, big strides in the first 10 minutes this morning. Smile

thanks for the above Steve! I did get the pages copied, and so far have 4 out of the 10 TVs on my demo Iphone page done, and can maneuver around, back to the home page, etc. Haven't programmed anything into the buttons, and will do that as well. Just for my own notes, it's best to take a break when frustrated. That holds true for the many times I've wanted to throw a piece of equipment across the room. Come back the next day, and it makes far more sense.

One very minor question... once I add a page, and it appears at the bottom of the Builder... I go into the name area of the properties, and rename that page...'TV1' for example. I hit 'save'.. but the name at the bottom of the builder page still says 'page 1'. What do I do to get the thumbnail at the bottom of the page to change to the proper name as well?

The other thing I found this morning is it really helps to close up any trees that you're not working on! This is one of the things that was screwing me up yesterday, I constantly got lost where I was. Once I closed the various branches of the trees, it made far more sense.

Now, depending on who is following this, you might think I'm a complete idiot, asking some pretty basic questions. I know one forum member is running circles around me, posting his pages of his AMX programming on Facebook, royally pissing me off (Smile), but I am indeed a complete newbie to even this drag and drop programming. I'll look back at this thread in 3 months from now, laughing at my mistakes and questions, but right now it's a massive learning curve for me.

Oh, and do you have an APPROXIMATE guideline for programming? Since I'm new to this, right now it's taking me far longer than when I get up to speed. I know training gave a $ value per handset at retail, which seemed fair. Do you typically allow a certain amount of time per piece of hardware? All excluding the installation time of the IR flashers and other hardware, of course. I can see the end being near for the demo programming, will definitely have it in place by Friday and I'll post a pix of how I'm demoing it for all to see...


Last edited by Curt Palme on Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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AnalogRocks
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PostLink    Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curt Palme wrote:
OK, big strides in the first 10 minutes this morning. Smile

I'll look back at this thread in 3 months from now, laughing at my mistakes and questions, but right now it's a massive learning curve for me


Just like any of us looking back on our original "How does this CRT thing work?" threads Very Happy

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