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Scaler for 3D-NOW Theater to Pioneer SD643HD5

 
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rjruby



Joined: 26 Sep 2011
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PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:02 pm    Post subject: Scaler for 3D-NOW Theater to Pioneer SD643HD5 Reply with quote


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What scaler could I use to take the output of the 3D-NOW Theater and run it to the component input on my Pioneer SD643HD5 that is 1080i @ 60hz?

TIA

Bob
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
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Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good question. I don't believe you can but I'll double check. If anything can do it it's likely only to be the Lumagen Radiance.

The format that the 3D-Theatre outputs is either 720p/60 or 720p/120 (60Hz in your case for your older RPTV since it can't take 120Hz).
Your TV sees this as a "regular" signal of course (which is why it works) but it's the 30Hz alternating signal that I want to make sure doesn't cause odd problems.

I'll send a note off to the Lumagen guys and see.

Stay tuned!

Kal

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kal
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PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sent a note off now but been thinking about it some more and really don't see how it's plausible such that it would give anything usable.

Reason:

1080i/60 is interlaced. That means two passes are done to draw the 1080 lines. The display basically does 540 lines at 30Hz and then another 540 at 30Hz to get the full 1080 lines. So you're already at 30Hz refresh which is why 1080i often has a bit of flicker. It draws twice as slowly since two passes are required.

1080i/60 exists because it requires 1/2 the bandwidth. Lower end displays can do it.

So how do you do a 3D signal interlaced? You'd need to do two passes PER EYE which means that you'd essentially be getting 1080i/30 per eye and because of the interlaced nature, it's actually two passes at 15Hz per eye. This would most certainly flicker like crazy and be unsuable. 720p/60 already "only" gives you 30Hz per eye which shows up as flicker depending on content.

We'll see what they say. While it may be technically possible, I just don't see how it's going to result in anything usable if it did technically work.

Kal

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rjruby



Joined: 26 Sep 2011
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PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kal,

Thanks for the prompt feedback and investigation.

I was hoping to upgrade to 3D without replacing my Pioneer which is performing flawlessly.

If it's not possible, I'll have to convince my wife that 3D is worth upgrading the TV.

Bob
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kal
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PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hang on a second Bob, got this response back from my guys at Lumagen:

Quote:

The Radiance can be used to scale the 720p60 Frame Sequential 3D signal to 1080i60.

You might also consider using the Mini with a Lumagen CRT-Sync-Box or a Mini-CRT-3D to do the entire job. The Mini, or any other Radiance, can convert any 3D that it receives to Frame Sequential at any frame rate you want. It can output 60, 96, 100, 120, or any other frame rate. It will do the same job but it is far more versitile than the 3D-Theater box.


I had completely forgotten about the CRT-Sync-Box.

See the bottom of this page: http://www.lumagen.com/testindex.php?module=products

That's CRT Glasses Sync Box which works with the Radiance Mini to display a 3D signal on a 2D display. This is similar to the 3D-Theater box in that both provide a connector for driving the 3D glasses. If you use the Lumagen CRT Glasses Sync Box you can set the 3D video output of the Radiance Mini to any video resolution and rate that your display can accept, not just 720p60 or 720p120. It can even do 720p72 or 720p96 for displays that can accept those but not 720p120 as these rates have far less flicker than 720p60. Far more more options available.

The CRT Glasses Sync Box is $399 but still requires a Radiance Mini which we sell at the lowest possible discounted price of $1499 USD.

They also have a Radiance Mini with the CRT Glasses Sync Box integrated called the "RadianceMini-CRT-3D" integrated for $1795 so you save about $100.

If interested email me at Lumagen@CurtPalme.com and we can take it from there.

Kal

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AnalogRocks
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PostLink    Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:


1080i/60 exists because it requires 1/2 the bandwidth. Lower end displays can do it.

So how do you do a 3D signal interlaced? You'd need to do two passes PER EYE which means that you'd essentially be getting 1080i/30 per eye and because of the interlaced nature, it's actually two passes at 15Hz per eye. This would most certainly flicker like crazy and be unsuable. 720p/60 already "only" gives you 30Hz per eye which shows up as flicker depending on content.
.

Kal


Just what I was thinking after our conversation yesterday.

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rjruby



Joined: 26 Sep 2011
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PostLink    Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:
Hang on a second Bob, got this response back from my guys at Lumagen:

Quote:

The Radiance can be used to scale the 720p60 Frame Sequential 3D signal to 1080i60.

You might also consider using the Mini with a Lumagen CRT-Sync-Box or a Mini-CRT-3D to do the entire job. The Mini, or any other Radiance, can convert any 3D that it receives to Frame Sequential at any frame rate you want. It can output 60, 96, 100, 120, or any other frame rate. It will do the same job but it is far more versitile than the 3D-Theater box.


I had completely forgotten about the CRT-Sync-Box.

See the bottom of this page: http://www.lumagen.com/testindex.php?module=products

That's CRT Glasses Sync Box which works with the Radiance Mini to display a 3D signal on a 2D display. This is similar to the 3D-Theater box in that both provide a connector for driving the 3D glasses. If you use the Lumagen CRT Glasses Sync Box you can set the 3D video output of the Radiance Mini to any video resolution and rate that your display can accept, not just 720p60 or 720p120. It can even do 720p72 or 720p96 for displays that can accept those but not 720p120 as these rates have far less flicker than 720p60. Far more more options available.

The CRT Glasses Sync Box is $399 but still requires a Radiance Mini which we sell at the lowest possible discounted price of $1499 USD.

They also have a Radiance Mini with the CRT Glasses Sync Box integrated called the "RadianceMini-CRT-3D" integrated for $1795 so you save about $100.

If interested email me at Lumagen@CurtPalme.com and we can take it from there.

Kal


Kal,

I really appreciate your assistance in helping me.

It appears the Lumagen product has HDMI outputs. My Pioneer has component inputs, no HDMI.

I wouldn't mind spending the money on a solution now if I can have an acceptable 3D experience on my Pioneer now and it could be used in the future if I upgrade my TV to something larger, perhaps a Sharp LC-80LE632U.

If that is not possible, I will wait to purchase a 3D ready TV in the future.

Thanks again for your help.

Bob
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kal
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Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correct, it has HDMI outputs. Everything today has gone HDMI. There are manufacturerse that make HDMI to component converters. I've used the Moome EXT-FULLHD v3 myself in the past and it works well. Available only from their website.

Kal

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