CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

noos@xp37+ · Joined: 17 Jun 2008 Posts: 293 Location: Munich

Well,

I more and more like the idea of a blend, especially because of the short throw. But the blend viedeo processors are luxury items, as they are rare, expensive, limited or sometimes buggy if you want certain resolutios (diventix) or just high refreshrates (like 3d) via single link DVI. (In my understanding they accept resolutions and refrashrates above 165mz, and put them out, only via analog RGB?)

If I would do a blend, I would like to do 3d, and sth. going in the direction of 4k. So at 2,39:1 that would be 4096 × 1714 at 48hz. I guess there is no blend processor on the horizon being able to to that, that costs less then 20000. No idea if and how a high bandwidthCRT with highrez tubes and lenses looks when feed 2048x1714 48hz (hard edge), and if that is possible via single link dvi (168mhz? instead of 165). But any multi head pc graphic card will support hard edge, at any resolution up to the single link limitation per output. So with a PC I could get at least very close to 4k, and also do stereoscopic 3d with lower resolutions. Or a third CRT for 4k (3 x 1365x1714 48hz or 72hz at 168mhz?), as most ggraphic cards support three devices now. As long as it is hard edge, and no software is used like sol7 or ntusim, I can do anything that is supported via a htpc, without the need of the software supporting it. I could even use a dscaler input card like the sweetspot or the pdi deluxe for SD, or blackmagicas hd input source, if the source is not available directly on pc.

But back to topic, can hard edge look good, if carefully carefully carefully done with a good crt?

thanks for reading

barclay66 · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 10:42 am Post subject:

Hi,

I think that this will be very difficult. Every analog CRT PJ (although digitally controlled) will have some inevitable drift in either geometry, convergence and maybe other parameters too. Unfortunately the human eye is very well designed for recognizing patterns and therefore even a small amount of error at the edges between two projection areas will be really annoying. Still I think it's possible, but maybe only with digital projectors...

Regards,
barclay66

P.S.: When You will be visiting my home in some near future, I can show You what can be done to reduce the already low drift in a Marquee even further.

noos@xp37+ · Joined: 17 Jun 2008 Posts: 293 Location: Munich

Thanks for the post. I just found this paragraph:

A soft-edge blend is most appropriately used when content is continuous across the entire screen, such as with motion video, high definition video, or when the transition from one projector to the next must be minimized. Properly executed, soft-edge blend applications provide maximum immersive impact.

...as you said barclay66.

I'm looking forward...

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

gjaky · Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 927 Location: Budapest, Hungary

CIR Engineering · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 1:05 pm Post subject:

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

Craig - I couldn't have said it better. There are two reason why some are coming out with 4K:
1 - So that you can get closer to the screen without seeing the screen door effect.
2 - So that they can brag about the pixel count and people will buy replacements for their existing projectors. Pure specsmanship!

Bob

CIR Engineering · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 1:29 pm Post subject:

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

Damn - You got me thinking!

Lets say you went with a rear projection setup so that the projectors could be mounted on stands so that they are perpendicular to the screen on the vertical centerline of the screen which would negate the use of any keystone. Then, if you add the three AR of the tubes sideways, you would end up with a sum AR of 2.6 which is not too far from 2.4.

I have enough space in my unfinished basement to do a rear projection setup. Hmmm!

I can only imagine how incredible this would look, and how big and bright a screen you could have and each projector would only see about 50 MHz video signal.

Long live analog!

Bob

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

Sorry - I meant to say Horizontal centerline, not vertical!!!

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 3912 Location: Comedy Central

Both you and Craig make good points regarding 4k. My only disagreement is the timeline for 4k source material. I just have a feeling that there will be 4k sources available in the next two to three years. I think there is already some high rollers getting in on some of the digital distribution of 4k to theaters.

I hope no one has taken my comments in the past about 4k being great and used it with a broad brush. I have only seen the Sony and JVC 4ks. My opinion is that a 4k pj with native 4k source is incredible. Upscaling BR to 4k didn't really look that much better than 1080p. Using JVCs faux 4k pj at Cedia last year, a couple of us found it only useful when closer than 1 screen width. Those over at AVS that aren't selling the Sony would agree with this. I think Kris Deering said it best. Since he sits further than 1 sw, the last thing he is concerned about is increased resolution. Give us more bits, expanded color, etc.

As for a 3 pj blend, you could probably do it with one of those vertical case Barcos or Marquees. I seem to recall VDC having one setup at their facility.

dturco · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 3:31 pm Post subject:

CIR Engineering · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 3:38 pm Post subject:

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

CIR Engineering · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 3:52 pm Post subject:

Boilermaker · Joined: 21 May 2006 Posts: 527

I'll bet we could talk Nash into doing this. There isn't anything he won't try, and he has plenty projectors!
Are you listening Nash!

Bob

Spanky Ham · Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 3912 Location: Comedy Central

noos@xp37+ · Joined: 17 Jun 2008 Posts: 293 Location: Munich

Thanks for the data generated. Certainly, a blender is the best way to go. I am with that, as I have a champangne taste. But only the beer budget is my problem.

I saw the Sony 4k at the Highend show in Munich. When they did upscale 1080p to 4k, and switched between them, they did excessive edge enhancement or something similar to the 4k version. There were only 10 people in the room, and I asked the man doing the show about this. No comment! The thing I liked most on 4k, was something that comes free with a CRT: No raster.

I am very lucky with the soft CRT look as I sit closer to the sreen than the screen is wide. Especially now with rp. 4k is just sth. to play with, plus software rendering, and to compete in the future with my digital friends. They see the "real", crt picture at my place, and start quoting the specs of their 2011/2012 digitals. No way to make them understand the digital problems. The best thing was the introduction of my 1989 HDIH, and the presentation I did. We were sitting 100" way from a 140" screen. The picture was a Lumagen downscaled 1080p to 660lines. They thought it was, as they call it, Full HD, until I did hit the ok button on the HDP: 660P .

Nashou66 · Posted: Sun May 27, 2012 7:34 pm Post subject:

It could be easily done with the Marquees as VDC has a software written for stop light configurations with Tube in normal position or rotating them 90 to keep the normal aspect. But I dont think Id try it Bob Wink

Nashou