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ChrisWiggles Opinionated SOB
Joined: 12 Mar 2006 Posts: 2529 Location: Seattle
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Link Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:42 am Post subject: Folks with JVC RS20/HD750-type DILA pjs: clean your optics! |
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Just a reminder. I remember doing this a couple hundred hours in some time ago when there were a number of discussions over at the A/V Sales web-dungeon. Long since forgot about that, things were fine for a long time. Anyway, noticed things were pretty dim lately such that I even kicked my bulb into high a couple weeks ago for a particularly dark movie, and was mainly figuring there was some natural light drop-off as the bulb aged (I'm at ~1190 hours). But I thought I'd take a peek in there to see what was going on.
So I pulled the projector down and yanked the bulb again and sure enough that front plate of the optics was heavily coated with gray sooty grime, along with the front glass element of the bulb assembly. Cleaned that right off, and BOOM there's all my brightness back! By eye looks about twice as bright as before (maybe an exaggeration), which means I was probably losing 75% of my light output. I probably should have done this quite a long time ago...
So folks running JVCs like my RS20: get ye some lens tissue and some cleaning fluid and keep her running nice and bright!
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WanMan
Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10273
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Link Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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I need to do this. While I also read the threads on AVS a while back, I too had forgotten all about it. On some occasions I think the same that a scene or movie appears dark, but then another scene in same movie or the movie in general is concluded dark. One of these days I'll actually overcome my laziness and have a look.
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ChrisWiggles Opinionated SOB
Joined: 12 Mar 2006 Posts: 2529 Location: Seattle
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Link Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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Do it do it do it! BIG difference! You should probably do it every few hundred hours. Considering how rarely you have to clean the lens on this thing because of the cover & airflow (I think I only cleaned the lens once), it's a small amount of upkeep compared to my CRT days of converging and re-doing setup and lens cleaning. So it's easy to just let it go by and do nothing, but don't! And run that little air filter under the faucet too for good measure. Shouldn't take more than ten minutes, plus a little bit of dry time for good measure.
It's like a free upgrade!
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 17860 Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 5643 Location: Comedy Central
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Link Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:35 am Post subject: |
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Maybe, but there are a lot of people getting dimming after only a couple of months. One guy on the AVS dimming thread used his JVC on average 7 hours a day since he owned it. That is a lot of hours in a short period of time. I don't think he checked, but I would guess it wasn't a huge build up inside the pj.
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ChrisWiggles Opinionated SOB
Joined: 12 Mar 2006 Posts: 2529 Location: Seattle
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Link Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:50 am Post subject: |
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Spanky Ham wrote: | Maybe, but there are a lot of people getting dimming after only a couple of months. One guy on the AVS dimming thread used his JVC on average 7 hours a day since he owned it. That is a lot of hours in a short period of time. I don't think he checked, but I would guess it wasn't a huge build up inside the pj. |
I would think that was buildup. The first time I cleaned it was 200 hours in, and the light output loss was HUGE from the gunk. Clean clean clean!
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:23 am Post subject: |
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I have a JVC DLA X7 who lost from 10FL at 500 hours to 5 FL at 700 hours on the lamp, it was not dirt, on the optics but dirt in the glass tupe inside the lamp.
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HogPilot
Joined: 21 Jan 2010 Posts: 2383
TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD
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Link Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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kal wrote: | I wonder if a lot of the talk of dimming JVC bulbs is due to issues like build-up like this that can be fixed with a cleaning? (Haven't really followed the details, I must admit).
Kal |
I asked the same question in the RS50/X7 owners thread prior to upgrading to my RS55, but the question didn't receive much attention. I do know for a fact that the RS40/50/60 dimming issues were primarily related to manufacturing defects in the bulbs - essentially certain parts were not withstanding the temps that they were supposed to be withstanding. JVC addressed the issue with the bulb manufacturer and fixed it, although they never publicly admitted to the problem (or that they fixed it) in the first place.
It may be that the excessive dimming seen in above models could be a combination of premature (faulty) bulb dimming and off-gassing "fogging" up the optics. Even if that were true, the old bulbs still had output issues as they began to age, and cleaning your optics wouldn't do anything for this. In the RS40/50/60, replacing the bulb normally solved the brightness issues (albiet temporarily until JVC started supplying updated bulbs), which tells me that the optics remained largely un-clouded. In the RS20 people were putting new bulbs in and getting only half the lumens of their previous new bulb, which can be traced to clouded optics rather than bulb problems.
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 17860 Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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ChrisWiggles Opinionated SOB
Joined: 12 Mar 2006 Posts: 2529 Location: Seattle
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Link Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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And to be clear: you have to clean the glass face of the bulb assembly, AND the square colorful glass plate that the bulb points at (that's the worst part!) from the offgassing/etc.
The glass face of the bulb assembly on mine is actually cracked, but doesn't seem to have any visible impact on anything, so I've ignored it until the bulb needs to be replaced.
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WanMan
Joined: 19 Mar 2006 Posts: 10273
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 9:09 am Post subject: |
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Chris, without going back and reading those old threads what did you use to do the cleaning?
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 17860 Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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Threads like this are reasons why I'm torn between where I want to go with the digital projector I'm buying in a few months... I'm not sure if I should go with what I want (the JVC RS45 or more expensive RS55) or go with the Sony HW30 or more expensive VW95.
Sony just doesn't seem to have the same problems, but then Sony doesn't have quite the same black level /native contrast ratio that I know I want for excellent film type quality. (Not saying the Sony is 'bad' - it's just different and not what I'm after. The fact that they include an auto-iris goes against my 'principles' too).
I haven't seen any of these in action of course. Which makes it even more confusion. *sigh*. Sorry. Off-topic.
Kal
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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kal wrote: | Threads like this are reasons why I'm torn between where I want to go with the digital projector I'm buying in a few months... I'm not sure if I should go with what I want (the JVC RS45 or more expensive RS55) or go with the Sony HW30 or more expensive VW95.
Sony just doesn't seem to have the same problems, but then Sony doesn't have quite the same black level /native contrast ratio that I know I want for excellent film type quality. (Not saying the Sony is 'bad' - it's just different and not what I'm after. The fact that they include an auto-iris goes against my 'principles' too).
I haven't seen any of these in action of course. Which makes it even more confusion. *sigh*. Sorry. Off-topic.
Kal |
Kal do you have HCFR, then i can sende you some calibration mesurements from my X7, i have mesured it from cold in 15 min interval to 180min so you will see how much its drifting. Its absolutly amasing when its spot on but you wont see that very often.
I hope the new models are better, but doubt it. Looks like the difference is the convergence adjustment, and the e shift lense.
Ill recomend the JVC X7 when its calibrated and there is light enough in the lamp, but if there is any problems, dont count on JVC douing any tecnical support for you. and ill recomend douing a touchup calibration at least every 50 hours.
You will not be able to calibrate to delta e under 2, but close, but only at a given time.. and a stable room temperature.
Sorry for staying off-topic.. but i need to do 5 posts before i can sende PM..
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kal Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006 Posts: 17860 Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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As the author of the Greyscale & Colour Calibration for Dummies guide, I most certainly have HCFR.
Having to recalibrate every 50 hours is (IMHO) crazy. That's unfortunate. I think most people would like a projector that doesn't have dE's that drift so much that it's noticeable every 50 hours.
dE under 3 or so is fantastic. In fact, under 10 is (again IMHO) acceptable. You want to get as close to 0 as possible of course but that's not always possible. You have to assume the meter's not 100% accurate either unless it's a spectroradiometer or you're using a recently recalibrated colorimeter.
What sort of dE drift are you seeing over the first 180 minutes when it's turned on?
Post the files right here in the thread if you don't mind so that others can see too. Just click "Go Advanced" and then the "Add attachment" option.
Thanks!
Kal
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Last edited by kal on Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:27 pm; edited 2 times in total
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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Cold
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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30 min
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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60 min.
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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120 min.
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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180 min
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stridsvognen Guest
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Link Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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340 min All with my new lamp at around 50 hours,
And there is a perfectley good reason that the rgb and gamma is not compleetley tight, im trying to controle the placement of the colors, so its ok to start looking a movie after around 45 min.
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