CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

Hello everybody. I've owned a sony 1271 crt projector for ten years now. The tubes had just been replaced when I bought it and they were new. The tubes have been running for about 500 hours. I only use the pj to watch films, let's say twice a month. I've been using an HD fury and a blu ray player for a few months now and I have a question about the resolution. The player is set to 1080p and the image looks gorgeous to me. Does the HD fury change the resolution so that it fits the projector's specifications or could this projector be compatible with 1080p ? I have to add that when set to 720p or 1080i, the picture is definitely not as sharp as 1080p.
I have two other questions. After ten years, am I likely to have to change the coolant liquid soon ?
Do HD LCD projectors display a better picture than the sony 1271 (which is considered an entry level CRT) ?

gjaky · Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 920 Location: Budapest, Hungary

Wellcome to the Forum!
The sony is technically can handle 1080P signal, but it is very strange to me that you've found 1080P sharper than any other resolution. 1080I should look sharper in every case. Your machine has 8" tubes, but it is an electrostatic focusing set which is not as sharp as the modern electromagnetic focusing sets, and the electronic bandwidth of the projectopr is rather low to fully resolve 1080P. The Fury doesn't modify the resolution as I know.
The coolant only needs to replace if artifacts (fungus) are growing inside, you can examine this while looking in the lenses.
HD LCD projectors are sharper than the sony CRT, but the colors are better on your sony. a digital pj is brighter, but has worse contrast ratio. In it's price range the sony is unbeatable.

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

Thank you for your reply. Strange as it may seem, the picture looks sharper with 1080p resolution ! That's why I posted on the forum ! To try and understand if I ad missed something. As a matter of fact, when I bought the sony projector with new tubes, it actually cost me a lot more than what it costs now ! For the same price, I would have a 9" Em focus projector today ! I'm only considering getting a HD LCD for "space" related considerations. As far as the picture is concerned, I'm very satisfied.

draganm · Joined: 08 Mar 2006 Posts: 5080 Location: Colorado

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

Ideally, this is what should be done Draganm ! But I don't think I want to sit under the beast... Nor do I want to do the building work that would be necessary. As for the resolution issue, I've just checked and the picture looks sharper when player is set to 1080p. The picture doesn't look soft, or at least not as soft as 1080i or 720p.
Here's a screenshot. Can you tell me what you think of it. Does it look like 1080p ?

gjaky · Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 920 Location: Budapest, Hungary

Can you post pictures with 1080I and 720P resolutions?

prover · Joined: 07 Nov 2008 Posts: 152 Location: Stuttgart, Germany

I use a 1271 for almost ten years now and I must say that the 1080p image smears two much. Your picture isn't bad at all but in your case I would try 720p. 720p produced on my 1271 better and sharper results.

**kal** · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 1:10 pm Post subject:

If 1080p looks sharper than 1080i on that projector, I'd say that 1080i isn't set up right.

Kal

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

Thanks for your replies ! 1080p actually does display a better picture. here are two pictures. Unfortunately, my camera produces "grainy" pictures. I don't suppose you can see much difference between the two, but at least the 1080p doesn't look "smeared"...
Here's the 720p screenshot:

And here's the 1080p screenshot :

gjaky · Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 920 Location: Budapest, Hungary

Well looking at the pictures you're right. I'm wondering if the BR player's internal processor (while transcoding the resolution) worsen the picture. Have you tried these resolutions from a PC, and the effects are the same?

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

From a PC the results aren't the same... the picture looks better when set to 720p. You might be right but still, th epicture looks better with the Panasonic blu ray player set to 1080p than with a Pc set to 720p ! I've also noticed scanlines that are visible with 1080i and absent with 1080p... Since the pictures I've taken are quite useless, I'd say that the picture looks sharper with a 1080p signal than with a 720p signal. And the main difference between 1080p and 1080i are the scanlines... I must say I was much surprised to notice all this when I first connected my CRT to a blu ray player via HD fury... I didn't expect 1080p to be the best option !

gjaky · Joined: 05 Jun 2010 Posts: 920 Location: Budapest, Hungary

What is your projector saying about horizontal and vertical frequencies while the bluray player is set to 1080p?

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

horizontal : 67.5
vertical : 60

**Curt Palme** · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 2:21 pm Post subject:

Guys, keep in mind that new old stock 07MSP tubes with only 500 hours on them are REALLY sharp. I'll bet a lot of you haven't seen super low hour ES focus tubes, and they are fantastic... for about 2000 hours. I'll bet in another 2000 hours, 1080i will look better.

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

Thanks for your reply Curt... I guess I am lucky to have "new" tubes... I must admit the picture looks very sharp to me. I assume that if I keep watching two films a month, that leaves me another twenty-five years before the tubes lose their sharpness... providing they -or the Pj don't break down before year 2037 ! LOL

**ecrabb** · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:25 pm Post subject:

The subject of this thread is really, really surprising to me. I had a low-hour 1271 that I spent a lot of time tweaking, and I was never even able to see 1080i scan lines on the screen. Even though the scan lines were clearly visible looking into the tubes or using a magnifier in front of the tube glass, the screen was always soft enough to completely obscure the scan lines.

So, on my 1271, I guesstimated resolved resolution was probably below 1280x720, but above 960x540. So, I always ran 1080i because it gave a nice bit of "oversampled" sharpness.

I'd like to see a detail of the above screen shots in 1080i and 1080p. I'd be very, very surprised if 1080i wasn't sharper than 1080p, if for no other reason that the bandwidth and scan rate would be HALF the 1080p rate and therefore be sharper in the horizontal direction.

Remember... These machines were designed and manufactured when 640x480 was a popular computer display resolution.

SC

**kal** · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:01 pm Post subject:

It's not just about sharpness but about inner detail. The beam painting 1080p has to work twice as hard and go twice as fast as 1080i. The electronics just don't have enough time to change the signal quickly enough. It's called slew rate.

No different than driving a car: What's your turning radius when you're going 50 MPH vs 100 MPH? It's the same principle.

Kal

**ecrabb** · Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:20 am Post subject:

**kal** · Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:29 am Post subject:

Yup! Agreed SC... I just wanted to add something to hopefully augment your argument. I'm all for going "low and slow" when it comes to (analog) CRT projectors within reason. My current machine does 1080p just fine but when it run it at 1080i it just tends to resolve more since it has quite litterally twice as much time to paint the perfect picture.

While it may not be the case of the original poster here, too many people just want to run as high a resolution as possible without really understanding the detriments of doing so...

Kal

Nordeen · Joined: 04 Apr 2012 Posts: 11 Location: France

You're right Kal, my goal is to get the best possible picture from my 1271... And thanks to all of you for the explanations you've given me. The lenses are HACC and from what I've seen, I agree with ecrabb, they're not good. My camera isn't good enough to shoot the scanlines, but they are clearly visible if you stand 5 feet from the screen. I think I'll follow your advice and try 1080i since when sitting 13 feet from the screen (which is 100" wide), I suppose the scanlines are no big deal... It's just a matter of visual appreciation. So far, I've had the impression that 1080p is the best option as far as the picture quality is concerned... but I may be wrong.
Here's a black and white screenshot where the scan lines are slightly visible in the upper part of the picture. They're much more visible on the screen.