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ChromaPure & Enhanced Chroma 5 questions

 
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Bob_Collins



Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 9



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 1:17 pm    Post subject: ChromaPure & Enhanced Chroma 5 questions Reply with quote


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My questions are in regard to an Enhanced Chroma 5 meter which was included in a CalMan bundle.

Before I start, it is my understanding that the “Enhanced” model was created by recalibrating the unit and writing the “corrected/enhanced” offsets into the meter. I also understand that the enhancement actually resulted in a possibly flawed calibration of the unit which results in an overall greenish tinge to the image produced after calibrating with an “Enhanced” meter (at least when used on Plasma or CRT types). So my questions are related to this “flawed” calibration specifically.

I understand that the meter must be unlocked in order for me to use it. I am currently awaiting the utility to test for this to be sure I can use the meter with ChromaPure, but going off the assumption that it is, and I can use it, here are my questions.

1. If I use an I1 Pro meter & ColorHCFR to create an offset profile and run this offset profile against the Chroma 5 using ChromaPure, will this remove the flawed calibration from the equation and give me proper results (no green tinge)?

2. If I send the Chroma 5 in to upgrade to a Chroma 5 PRO, does your calibration of the unit overwrite the internal settings which CalMan made to the unit and resulted in the flaw I mentioned above so that the meter will read properly in ANY software package, or will it result in the meter only being correct with ChromaPure?

3. This one is more general in nature, but can I take the same I1 Pro meter and after having correctly entered its readings into an offset to establish it as the reference meter, reference both the Chroma 5 and a DTP-94 against it, or does the profile apply to only 1 meter?

Thanks in advance!
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TomHuffman



Joined: 01 Jun 2010
Posts: 71
Location: Springfield, MO


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 1:39 pm    Post subject: Re: ChromaPure & Enhanced Chroma 5 questions Reply with quote

Bob_Collins wrote:
My questions are in regard to an Enhanced Chroma 5 meter which was included in a CalMan bundle.

Before I start, it is my understanding that the “Enhanced” model was created by recalibrating the unit and writing the “corrected/enhanced” offsets into the meter. I also understand that the enhancement actually resulted in a possibly flawed calibration of the unit which results in an overall greenish tinge to the image produced after calibrating with an “Enhanced” meter (at least when used on Plasma or CRT types). So my questions are related to this “flawed” calibration specifically.
I don't have any information about how successful their enhanced meter was. CalMan users would know more about that than I.

Bob_Collins wrote:
I understand that the meter must be unlocked in order for me to use it. I am currently awaiting the utility to test for this to be sure I can use the meter with ChromaPure, but going off the assumption that it is, and I can use it, here are my questions.

1. If I use an I1 Pro meter & ColorHCFR to create an offset profile and run this offset profile against the Chroma 5 using ChromaPure, will this remove the flawed calibration from the equation and give me proper results (no green tinge)?
Yes.

Bob_Collins wrote:
2. If I send the Chroma 5 in to upgrade to a Chroma 5 PRO, does your calibration of the unit overwrite the internal settings which CalMan made to the unit and resulted in the flaw I mentioned above so that the meter will read properly in ANY software package, or will it result in the meter only being correct with ChromaPure?
No. As I understand it, what SpectraCal did was use one of the two available areas in the Chroma5's EEPROM for storing calibrations to create a new one. This calibration would be ignored by ChromaPure. Our approach does nothing to the hardware. Our corrections are purely software-based. So nothing would be overwritten. On the other hand, it wouldn't be used either. After the PRO upgrade, the Chroma 5 would be extremely accurate.

Bob_Collins wrote:
3. This one is more general in nature, but can I take the same I1 Pro meter and after having correctly entered its readings into an offset to establish it as the reference meter, reference both the Chroma 5 and a DTP-94 against it, or does the profile apply to only 1 meter?
You could create offsets for any meter, but you would have to have a license for whatever meter you wanted to correct.
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kal
Forum Administrator


Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15709
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bob: I emailed you a link to download the Chroma 5 test utility to see if your Chroma 5 will work with ChromaPure. Heads up that every Chroma 5 sold by SpectraCal recently that we've tested has been locked or modified somehow such that it does not work with the manufacturer's tester application or with ChromaPure.

Let us know if you have any questions!

Kal

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Last edited by kal on Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bama29



Joined: 11 Dec 2009
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am a bit confused, which is nothing new. Rolling Eyes

I have an "Enhanced" Chroma 5 that I purchased with Calman Home a few months ago. I do know that it is locked or pass-worded, because Tom kindly sent me the test utility as a result of some previous email communications.

My question is: Can my Chroma 5 that is pass-worded be upgraded to a Chroma 5 pro and then work with Chromapure? Or am I just stuck in my current situation with Calman as the only choice. I am assuming that SpectraCal would not remove the pass-wording.

Thanks,

Michael
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15709
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Michael!

bama29 wrote:
I have an "Enhanced" Chroma 5 that I purchased with Calman Home a few months ago. I do know that it is locked or pass-worded, because Tom kindly sent me the test utility as a result of some previous email communications.

I was also not aware that this locking or modification feature existed with Chroma 5 meters. Tom was the first person to point this out to me.

bama29 wrote:
My question is: Can my Chroma 5 that is pass-worded be upgraded to a Chroma 5 pro and then work with Chromapure? Or am I just stuck in my current situation with Calman as the only choice.

Your Chroma 5 as it sits today obviously works with CalMAN. It does not work with ChromaPure or the manufacturer's tester application. We don't know why at this point.

Chroma 5 meters sold by Tom for use with ChromaPure are not locked or modified in any way. They may be used with any software that can use unlocked/unmodified meters. It is unsure if an unlocked meter sold by Tom for use with ChromaPure would work with CalMAN as CalMAN may look for a password or some sort of modification before allowing a Chroma 5 meter to be used. We don't know. You'd have to ask SpectraCal to know if their CalMAN software would work with unlocked/unmodified Chroma 5 meters.

Quote:
I am assuming that SpectraCal would not remove the pass-wording.

That is a question we cannot answer. You'll have to ask SpectraCal. We don't even know if they're actually password protected to begin with.

Some extra info: The Chroma 5 is the only meter that currently supports that 'locking' or password protection feature.

For more information see our ChromaPure/Chroma 5 page here: http://www.curtpalme.com/ChromaPure_Chroma5.shtm

Kal

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Last edited by kal on Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:28 pm; edited 2 times in total
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bama29



Joined: 11 Dec 2009
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kal,

Thanks for the very quick response! I guess as they say, that is that. Sort of makes me wish I had kicked in the extra cash for the i1Pro when I made the purchase last December.

Oh well, hind sight is 20/20.

Thanks again,

Michael
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15709
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi everyone,

There's been a lot of confusion about this password protecting or modification of Chroma 5's so here are some simple facts after testing was performed (no speculation - just facts!):

(1) Meters as shipped by the Xrite manufacturer work with Tom’s ChromaPure software and the manufacturer’s Chroma 5 tester application. (This is the utility we ask that people try before purchasing ChromaPure to make sure their Chroma 5 meter will work with ChromaPure).

(2) Meters that have been through SpectraCal’s hands no longer work with ChromaPure or the manufacturer’s tester application. They obviously still work with CalMAN.

(3) We've had one user tell us that if they load up CalMAN and take a reading with their Chroma 5 bought from SpectraCal and then try the manufacturer's Chroma 5 tester application, it now works.

So again, just the facts.

Kal

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Last edited by kal on Tue Jul 20, 2010 12:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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bama29



Joined: 11 Dec 2009
Posts: 6



PostLink    Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kal,

So apparently if Calman is running and it unlocks the meter, then it might be possible to run Chromapure with Calman still running?

Michael
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kal
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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 15709
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bama29 wrote:
Kal,

So apparently if Calman is running and it unlocks the meter, then it might be possible to run Chromapure with Calman still running?

Michael

Yes. I'm unsure if the CalMAN needs to continue running or only needs to be run once per session to 'initialize' the Chroma 5.

Kal

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Bob_Collins



Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 9



PostLink    Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:27 pm    Post subject: My Chroma 5 enhanced experience Reply with quote

Chroma 5 Enhanced meters from SpectraCal (CalMan) are indeed password protected. I got this answer from the SpectraCal calibration lab, and confirmed this with the C5 I just purchased from a buddy.

I asked the calibration lab contact I spoke with about having the password removed, and he agreed to do so free of charge (I had to ship the unit back at my expense, but the return shipping was done at their expense). SpectraCal was extremely helpful, and pleasant, and I commend them for the ease with which they agreed to remove the password from my meter. I cannot say whether this is policy for them, or if I was an exception; I don't know what their official stance/policy is on this subject, or if they've developed one. I can only to speak to MY personal experience.

Upon the return of the Chroma 5 meter it was confirmed to be unlocked and usable with ChromaPure, so I have just purchased my second meter license and am looking forward to trying it out with ChromaPure (especially with a USB extension cable)!

Note: I am not here to throw stones at one company over another, or to debate why the C5 was set with a password in the first place, or anything else in this regard. I am just stating the facts of my situation and how it was handled.

Bob
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louerhardt



Joined: 05 Aug 2010
Posts: 2
Location: Seattle


PostLink    Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:24 pm    Post subject: SpectraCal Meters Ship UNLOCKED Reply with quote

SpectraCal does not ship ANY meter with any type of locks enabled. All meters we ship are fully functional to work with any software that supports them. It *is* possible for software to lock out certain meter serial numbers (so that the software manufacturer can require you purchase meters through them), but neither SpectraCal, nor CalMAN Software, make use of this practice either.

Therefore, the meter you purchased from your friend most definitely came from a different source. It is true we can unlock meters from other sources to allow them to work on software that does not make use of the locks.

Also, unlike a recalibration, a SpectraCal Enhancement on a Chroma5 DOES NOT affect any of other LUTs shipped from X-rite.

An "enhanced" meter simply adds an additional LUT for LED-based LCDs. We use a Konica-Minolta CS-2000 as a reference.

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Lou Erhardt
SpectraCal, LLC
www.spectracal.com
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Bob_Collins



Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 9



PostLink    Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No sir, you are wrong.

The meter came directly from SpectraCal and was part of a bundle with the I1 Pro, the Chroma 5 Enhanced, and the CalMan Enthusiast license. According to the date on the calibration report, it was purchased in October of 2009. SpectraCal shorted him the C5 projector kit on the initial shipment, and apparently the white diffuser too since neither he nor I have that piece, but he did receive the mount (but no diffuser was included).

The Chroma 5 is (to my knowledge) the only meter capable of being locked or having a password set, so it is the only one which SpectraCal could lock. The SpectraCal calibration lab admitted on the phone that they do indeed password protect the meter to "give them a tighter control over the calibration". In fact, the calibration report received with the Chroma 5 Enhanced shows right in the report "Password set". Lastly, if the meter were not password protected by SpectraCal and was done by some unknown 3rd party, how then was SpectraCal able to remove the password? To remove it, you'd have to have known what the password was to begin with.

I cannot speak directly as to what the "enhanced" mode adds or does not add. My previous comment about it resulting in a flawed calibration or bad offsets was based off something I had heard and was told (hearsay), so I will not argue on that point.

Again, the C5 came directly from SpectraCal; the SpectraCal calibration lab admitted they password protect the C5 meters, and they unlocked it which would obviously require knowing the password to clear it, unless SpectraCal "hacks" the meter to clear it.

These are the facts!

I suggest you speak with the calibration lab to check for yourself.
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louerhardt



Joined: 05 Aug 2010
Posts: 2
Location: Seattle


PostLink    Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correction:

After speaking with the calibration labs, the Chroma 5's are in fact renamed in hardware to allow the meter to be recalibrated. This could be called a password, but it is essentially just a name not recognized by other programs. Being authorized distributors, it is also a necessary step as part of our OEM agreement with X-rite. As previously stated, this can be removed, however the recalibration offered by our labs does provide a measured improvement in accuracy across all display profiles.

I also looked into the green "tinge" you asked about a bit further, which I did not address in the first response. Apparently there were a couple (maybe 3?) very loud forum posters that were making these claims, and rumors were floating about with these Chroma 5 meters. Derek Smith has responded to this in several posts and offered anyone with a recent C5 calibration who has a concern with its accuracy to return it to us, and we would recal or replace it (if required) for free. To date, I have confirmed with our labs no one has taken advantage of this offer, including anyone to whose threads we specifically replied.

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Lou Erhardt
SpectraCal, LLC
www.spectracal.com
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randy



Joined: 10 Aug 2010
Posts: 1



PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 3:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also buy "Enhanced" Chroma 5 and same to other, I dont know that it is locked and passworded.
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