Are we just talking from the time the power button is touched and the time the PS3 interface comes up, or before a Blu-ray disk launches? _________________ Trust no one. Absolutely no one. Advice of the board.
Link Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:14 pm Post subject:
Got one Italian link, I don't think it useful here
They claim they compare a BD player capable of HD bitstream and the sound was WAY better then the PCM-converted from PS3.
Actually, in my Home Theater I have always been a bit disappointed with HD because I couldn't find so much difference between Dolby Digital/DTS and HD formats and I believe - but it's my creature, I cannot judge - that my sound system should be able to show the differences...
Joined: 20 Apr 2006 Posts: 449 Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)
Link Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 10:15 pm Post subject:
My PS3 Slim arrived today. It's updating to 3.0 firmware. I'm interested in the HD audio as well as I didn't think there was much difference from compressed. As soon as it completes its update, I'll check it out.
Link Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 4:14 pm Post subject:
I'm really curious about the lossless audio issue...I do think it's better, but I also think it could be better still. Still waiting for something that sounds as good as a laserdisc...I'm serious!
If you're serious, you're crazy, Ben! Most BD audio now completely obliterates the very best LD audio! DTS on LD was only about 1.3 mbps... That's six channels of compressed audio running inside the bandwidth of two stereo PCM channels of 44k/16-bit. So, compare that to most DTS-HD Master Audio tracks which are typically 6+ mbps and on up. 4 times the bandwidth or more. Plus, many of the best releases in PCM or lossless are practically bit-for-bit copies of the original studio masters. It doesn't get much better than that! Here are a few blurbs from Blu-ray Digest (and I agree with these):
Like the video, the uncompressed PCM 5.1 Surround audio track (48kHz/24-bit) on this Blu-ray disc is also terrific. Where 'Cars' is all dynamic and driving, 'Ratatouille' is more warm and subtle, but no less engrossing. This is a perfect example of how fantastic great sound design can be even when it's not ramming you over the head with bombast.
I hate to use silly cliches that sound like a TV commercial, but this soundtrack is not unlike a great fine wine. From every word of dialogue to the wonderful score by Michael Giacchino, it all just seems to slide out of the speakers. Completely constructed in the studio, it's just so clean and smooth. The use of surrounds is just as elegant. Atmosphere is king here, with transparent pans between channels and excellent spatiality, which delivers a constant sense of envelopment yet is never overpowering. And lest one think dynamics might be wimpy, low bass is certainly deep enough when needed (wait for the lightning bolt -- you'll feel it), and the robust highs are equally wonderful. And just as with 'Cars,' dialogue is perfectly rendered, and I never even thought of touching the volume button on my remote.
On Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds: Live at Radio City:
As great as the video is, the audio is perhaps even more impressive. Sony BMG offers an uncompressed PCM 2.0 Stereo mix (48kHz/24-bit), and -- in a first for the music label -- a Dolby TrueHD 5.1 Surround track at a hefty 96kHz/24-bit. As terrific as the PCM track is, I have to give the TrueHD mix the nod -- simply put, it's pitch perfect. (Note there is also a Dolby Digital 5.1 mix at a lowly 640kbps, but why would you want to listen to that?)
What dazzles the most is the transparent clarity of the presentation. The amazing, diverse sounds Dave Matthews and particularly Tim Reynolds are able to create with just a pair of acoustic guitars (and a few foot pedal-fueled effects) are as breathtaking as the sense of realism and purity to the TrueHD track. It truly feels as if sounds are simply hanging in the air, floating dreamlike, rather than emanating from a set of speakers. I couldn't even pinpoint their location in the soundfield, so transparent is the effect of one expansive wall of sound from the front stage, just as it would be if you were at the show yourself. Dynamics are terrific, too -- from the ultra-tight low tones with the warm, spacious highs, this is as good as it gets. The concert is also expertly balanced, with Matthews' vocals crystal clear and never fighting for dominance with the instrumentation or the crowd.
In comparing the discs two showcase tracks, in terms of envelopment there's surprisingly little perceivable difference between the PCM 2.0 Stereo and the TrueHD 5.1 Surround tracks. Perhaps its because the crowd is so subdued during this quiet show that the mix is almost entirely front and center. Having said that, I would still choose the TrueHD track, because its higher bitrate pays noticeable dividends in sounds quality. To be sure, neither track is a slouch, but the TrueHD is without a doubt the best audio presentation I've yet heard on a next-gen release. I mean it -- it's that good.
Marking Warner's first venture into the DTS-HD Master Audio codec, the lossless soundtrack on this Blu-ray edition of 'Watchmen' is nothing short of reference quality. The sound design isn't dependent on a loud, aggressive, in-your-face attitude. Rather, it remains focused on subtle ambiance and generating a believable environment for this parallel universe of masked avengers.
Dialogue reproduction and character interaction is perfectly discernible, even in the whispered conversations of Laurie and Dan, and remains fixed in the center of the screen. Dynamic range is clean and spacious, conveying terrific differentiation between the highs and mid-levels while in the middle of all the thunderous action. The original musical score by Tyler Bates fills the entire soundstage with great separation and room penetration, feeling warm and wide. Imaging is convincing as atmospheric effects nicely extend the soundfield into the background, enveloping the listener with great depth, clarity and definition. Pans are smooth and seamless, with no loss to details as objects move between the channels. Low-frequency effects carry a hefty and nicely refined punch, adding serious weight to each action sequence.
I've only warched a couple of movies on the Slim so far. As far as the sound, if there is a difference, I can't tell. I need to get a disc with known good audio. Any suggestions?
Oh, man - there are a whole a slew of BD's with awesome, reference-quality audio - and yes, they smoke even the old DTS laserdiscs. Sorry, Ben!
Here are a few:
A Bug's Life, Cars, Ratatouille, Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds at Radio City Music Hall, Watchmen, Dark Knight... Go read some reviews over at BD Digest. Lots to choose from!
Link Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 4:17 pm Post subject:
I don't see how bitstreaming could sound any different...it becomes PCM either way.
In theory, you could get clock jitter between source and processor... So, if you bitstream and decode at the processor instead of the source, the PCM could arrive at the D/A converter in a cleaner state. In theory. Also, won't some prepros give you the ability to apply processing to a bitstream at decode time, but not raw PCM? That could give you some additional flexibility.
That said, PCM from my fat PS3 sounds incredible. I'd like to try a slim or another player to try bitstreaming to my prepro to see if could tell a difference.
Joined: 22 Mar 2006 Posts: 1473 Location: ottawa, canada
Link Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:37 pm Post subject:
Until someone can routinely pick the bitstreamed soundtrack in a double blind test...then this is just the usual bunch of bs where people want to see the DTS light on their receiver...and choose to therefore think it sounds better.
Link Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject:
And in which case I am not even going to worry about it. In fact, I finally pulled the PS3 Slim out of its box after it sat there on the breakfast table for a week. _________________ Trust no one. Absolutely no one. Advice of the board.
Joined: 20 Apr 2006 Posts: 449 Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)
Link Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 12:57 am Post subject:
I had an issue my PS3 Slim yesterday. I attempted to play a blu-ray of 1998's "The Big Hit". The Slim not only wouldn't playthe movie, but I had to restart the machine. I tried it several times with the same result. Put the same disc in my 60gb PS3 and it played just like its suppose to. The Slim will play other disc without issue. Anyone experience anything like this with a Slim?
Link Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 1:31 am Post subject:
LD's were uncompressed....not the DTS or DD ones...but a good LD would have L/R uncompressed audio. The guys at Widescreen review could likely agree.
That being said, I think Blu-Ray is likely there...I just haven't tested it out to its max yet.
OMG, you were talking about stereo LD's? Yeah, those were uncompressed... 44.1khz/16-bit CD-quality audio. But, who cares? That's not HT!!! If they were surround at all, it was crappy matrixed Pro Logic. Other than perhaps the odd live concert disc or musical, I'll take a well-done discrete compressed DTS or AC-3 over uncompressed stereo for movies any day!
And yes, not only is BD "there", 96khz 24-bit lossless multichannel on BD has far eclipsed what we had at our disposal with LD. Higher sample rate and resolution gives us better dynamic range, better s/n ratio, better high-frequency response, and obviously discrete multi-channel. There is simply no comparison for a superior HT experience.
Link Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2009 1:52 am Post subject:
I had an issue my PS3 Slim yesterday. I attempted to play a blu-ray of 1998's "The Big Hit". The Slim not only wouldn't playthe movie, but I had to restart the machine. I tried it several times with the same result.
Wow, that's weird. Being an old BD, it certainly shouldn't have anything but really simple authoring... It is MPEG-2 and not AVC or VC-1. So, what does it do, just lock up on a black screen? Not play the menu?
Reading the High-Def Digest review, maybe the Slim is actually saving you from yourself!
I can't disguise my complete disregard for 'The Big Hit' -- I thought it was pretty awful. But hey, we all have our likes and dislikes, so if you dig this movie then by all means, jump in. However, the video and audio here seem just a little bit dated to me, and the two audio commentaries are also no great shakes. So unless you just have to own 'The Big Hit' on high-def, you may want to relegate this one to the "Tarantino Rip-off" section of your Netflix rental queue.
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