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Yamaha DSP-3090

 
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betel



Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 449
Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:02 am    Post subject: Yamaha DSP-3090 Reply with quote


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Recently my NAD T752 receiver quit outputting any kind of surround sound although the stereo sound still works. I'm considering purchasing a Yamaha DSP-3090 integrated surround sound amplifier. In its day (vintage 1996) this was a high end unit. Of course it is obsolete for todays DSP formats but I'm wondering others opinions. I don't care about HDMI switching. It only does Dolby Digital so no DTS. I can pick it up for about $200. Is there much difference between DD & DTS. I suppose if I got it and decided it is just too obsolete, I could sell it but would rather not go through the hassle. Anyone familiar with this unit and what is your opinion.
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betel



Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 449
Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry but never paid much attention to the different DSP formats. Apparently it is generally recognized that DTS is superior to DD although many report they can't tell the difference. Mostly, from what I can tell, DTS is more dynamic resulting in a more realistic sound stage. Not sure if this judgement is based on reality though. Could be similar to someone walking into Circuit City and making an instant judgement LCD is superior to Plasma. I think I'll get the 3090 to use until I decide what is a better and more permanant solution. I've heard Blu-Ray is using lossless formats so it may be better to wait until the equipment that can process those formats become more affordable.
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Zebu Fellenz



Joined: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 2565



PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are your sources? Unless you use digital outputs it shouldn't matter what the receiver can decode.
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betel



Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 449
Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use two sources. Mostly from my PS3 optical out (video via HDFury). Occasionally I'll watch OTA (MYHD tuner card) in which case I use the digital coax out from the tuner card.

Zebu, I notice you also have a G70. What are you using as a source and at what resolution?
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Zebu Fellenz



Joined: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 2565



PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use a HTPC for HD-DVD, Blu-ray, and HDTV, I run 1080p 60.
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ecrabb



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 14679
Location: Utah

TV/Projector: None


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Betel,

OK, so PS3... You're limited to using SPDIF, then. That means you really should get something that can at least decode DTS. If you want older/higher-end, that's fine. But, you can do much better than something so old it doesn't even decode DTS. The problem is, with the PS3 and Blu-ray, on any movie with advanced audio, the PS3 is going to on-the-fly decode and re-encode to DTS @ 1.5 mbps. If you you have a processor that isn't DTS-capable, you may be limited 2.0 PCM and matrix processing for center and surround - i.e., NO discrete audio. YUCK! Somebody correct me if I'm wrong...

BTW, I'm running a G70 and PS3 and watch everything at 1080p. It's AWESOME. I can't believe I even have the HT I have. I recently switched from an AVR and separate amps to an Integra pre/pro and so have HDMI switching, advanced audio, etc. The Integra wasn't cheap (it was the most expensive piece of kit in the entire HT, in fact) but it also has a Reon scaler and ISF color controls. That was a nice upgrade, too.

Speaking of my AVR switch... Not to pimp my gear in your thread, but I still have my Marantz AVR. 7.1, DTS-ES, NEO, PL II, etc. It's only a few years old, but I'd make you a hell of a deal on it if you were interested. More money than the Yamaha you are talking about, but not a lot, and MUCH more modern. It was $1100 retail new, so not a cheap piece of gear. I bought it as a refurb for much less, but it is in 100% mint/like new condition. Heck, it was only in my HT for a year and a half. PM me if you're interested - I can send pics. Here's the link on the Marantz site:

http://us.marantz.com/Products/306.asp

Cheers,
SC
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betel



Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 449
Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was just reading a Wikipedia article on TruHD. Previously, I didn't understand the optical and coax cables don't have the bandwith to carry the lossless signals. Therefore the DSP device must have HDMI input at minimum. From what you're telling me SC, the 3090 may be only capable of producing a matrix surround from the PS3, which is unacceptable. I guess there is no point in wasting my time with the 3090.
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ecrabb



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 14679
Location: Utah

TV/Projector: None


PostLink    Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right. I'd amend your statement slightly to say, "To get advanced audio, the processor must be HDMI -OR- the source device must be able decode the advanced/lossless audio and output via analog". Regardless, SPDIF is out for advanced audio, unless you're talking 2-ch. I think you can do 24/96 2.0, maybe - I can't remember.

And yes, I'd pass on the 3090. If you don't want to spend a bunch of money on a new AVR that can handle advanced audio, you can always add a BD player that can decode and output via analog. Or, you can use an AVR that can handle DTS, and listen to either the "core" audio, or the converted audio. Lots of people here use their players one of those two ways.

Cheers,
SC
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betel



Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 449
Location: Maryville, Tennessee (Just South of Knoxville)


PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I removed the cover to the NAD receiver and found a ribbon cable dangling in mid air. Evidently it was not inserted into the connector very well and fell out. Re-inserted the cable and the fit was tight. The receiver works fine now.

I still want to get a DSP receiver capable of the advanced audio processing at some point in the near future. This will give me some time for the HD audio formats to mature a little more. Are they even including the HD audio formats in BD movies yet? I see where Onkyo makes a $1000 receiver that looks like it would fit the bill nicely. Onkyo seems to make a good mid-grade product.
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ecrabb



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 14679
Location: Utah

TV/Projector: None


PostLink    Posted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent! So nice when the fix is an easy one. Gotta love that.

Take a look at HighDef Digest:
http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/reviews.html

There plenty of movies out with high-res audio. Some are amazing. The Dave Matthews/Tim Reynolds disk for instance, has a 24-bit/96khz 5.1 TrueHD track that's absolutely awesome. Iron Man, Transformers, Cars, Ratatouille... There a bunch of BD's with truly amazing reference-quality high-resolution audio. So, no maturation necessary. What could use a little more maturing is the HDMI implementation in a lot of the CE products. This last year, things have really improved, though - significantly.

The Onkyos such as the 876 offer excellent bang for the buck for advanced audio and HDMI switching, but there are getting to be a ton of choices, all much better than a year or two ago.

SC
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