Return to the CurtPalme.com main site CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum
A forum with a sense of fun and community for Home Theater enthusiasts!
Products for Sale ] [ FAQ: Hooking it all up ] [ CRT Primer/FAQ ] [ Best/Worst CRT Projectors List ] [ Setup Tips & Manuals ] [ Advanced Procedures ] [ Newsletters ]

 
Forum FAQForum FAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist  Photo AlbumsPhoto Albums  RegisterRegister 
 MembershipClub Membership   ProfileProfile   Private MessagesPrivate Messages   Log inLog in 
Blu-ray disc release list and must-have titles. Buy the latest and best Blu-ray titles to show off in your home theater!

Any PC Gamers Out There?
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer-friendly view    CurtPalme.com Forum Index -> Home Theater PCs
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 6:34 pm    Post subject: Any PC Gamers Out There? Reply with quote


        Register to remove this ad. It's free!
My 10 year old grandson is into video games. So I bring a gaming PC home from the pawn shop. I know nothing about gaming PCs but it has a window on the side and I can see a video card with a fan on it. So I assume, cool, this should handle most games.

Not! In fact not even close. My grandson tries to play Fortnite and it's really laggy. We watch a video about optimizing a PC for Fortnite and we get it playing good! But soon the fans start ramping up and end up cranked. It's getting really hot. I look at Task Manager and the CPU is over 90% and the video card is over 90% as well. I don't why it plays so well with those kind of numbers but it does. But I don't want to burn it up so I close Fortnite.

I always thought gamers spent so much on their PCs to get an advantage over other players. Now it seems, to a certain degree, it's required just to play PC games. I had no idea.

It's not like it's a terrible computer. A long ways from good one, but it seems like it should at least be able to play games at a decent level. Here's what I have:

AMD A10-5800B 3.8GHz FM2 socket 2 cores processor

Radeon RX 560 4GB graphics card

ASRock FM2A88X Pro3+ motherboard FM2+ socket

16GB DDR3 RAM

Should I forget this PC and look for a different one? Or is there hope for it.
Back to top
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's an 8 year old processor and a 3 year old video card so 90% makes sense.
_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
garyfritz




Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 11371
Location: Fort Collins, CO


PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The top games all push the latest/fastest hardware to the max. I'm surprised you got it working well at all. I doubt you would burn anything up, assuming it's got proper fans &etc. I'd keep an eye on the temps though.
Back to top
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garyfritz wrote:
The top games all push the latest/fastest hardware to the max. I'm surprised you got it working well at all. I doubt you would burn anything up, assuming it's got proper fans &etc. I'd keep an eye on the temps though.

Thanks for the responses.

That I always assumed was the reason for the mega dollar gaming rigs, Gary. What I didn't know is you had to have a pretty decent PC just to play PC games at all.

So you don't think it will toast itself? It has 3 large case fans but a smallish CPU fan. Maybe get a good CPU fan and hope for the best?

From what I've read it seems I'd have to spend at least $600 to get something that will play Fortnite. I'd like my grandson to have some PC experience but I don't know about spending that much on one.
Back to top
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnalogRocks wrote:
That's an 8 year old processor and a 3 year old video card so 90% makes sense.

Jeremy, here's a list of FM2/FM2+ socket CPUs that my MB should support. Mine is pretty low on that list. Will a higher rated CPU help my situation?

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/socketType.html#i16
Back to top
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil Smith wrote:
AnalogRocks wrote:
That's an 8 year old processor and a 3 year old video card so 90% makes sense.

Jeremy, here's a list of FM2/FM2+ socket CPUs that my MB should support. Mine is pretty low on that list. Will a higher rated CPU help my situation?

https://www.cpubenchmark.net/socketType.html#i16



More importantly what processores does the motherboard support:

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/FM2A88X%20Pro3+/#CPU

Yours is an A10 which means it has built in graphics on the CPU. 4 MB Radeon HD 7660D, also it's a 4 core 3800MHz with a single core turbo of 4200MHz.

I have the 4100MHz version at the office.

To upgrade this system I would go with an Athlon X4 AD880KXBI44JC 4000MHz, 2x2MB L2 cache and a bigger CPU cooler.

Other than that or replacing the video card there's not much upgrading to be done.

Alternativly just do the CPU heatsink and fan then use it as is.

The other thing you can do it play older games. Goto GOG.com and check out more period correct games say 2005-2013ish that will run better on that system. You can also hit thrift stores for CD-ROM and DVD-ROM coppies or, you know, a local pawn shop. Very Happy

_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
garyfritz




Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 11371
Location: Fort Collins, CO


PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeremy, isn't the GPU more likely the bottleneck? I have no idea how CPU-intensive current games are, but I know they put a lot of load on the graphics processor. But most games can be throttled back (less graphic effects) so it's not quite so photo-realistic, and that takes much less GPU power.
Back to top
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

garyfritz wrote:
Jeremy, isn't the GPU more likely the bottleneck? I have no idea how CPU-intensive current games are, but I know they put a lot of load on the graphics processor. But most games can be throttled back (less graphic effects) so it's not quite so photo-realistic, and that takes much less GPU power.


Yeah, as I mentioned. He can upgrade the video card but, seeing as his is 'only' 3 years old and the processor is a business class econo job I would recommend a snapier processor. If he did both a processor AND a graphics card then it would really wake up that old system. Have to make sure there's enough power supply for the video card too.

On older less capable cards you can go into the game settings and turn off/down graphic settings to make it run better. You are correct.

_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeremy that CPU doesn't look to be much of an improvement.

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Athlon-X4-880K-vs-AMD-A10-5800K-APU-2012-DTr/m121029vs2007

I can't find one anyway, which is the case with a lot of the FM2 CPUs. Long outdated I guess.

One of the things we did to improve performance was to turn video card setting *up*! The CPU was running at plus 90% and the video card at ~ 35%. That was suppose to throw some of work load on to the video card, which it seemed to do and it did make performance better. But CPU usage didn't go down for some reason. Now instead of one being maxed out they're both maxed out.

I think I'm going to blow this project off. I've been effing with it for 3 days with no improvement in site. That's enough time wasted.
Back to top
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil Smith wrote:
Jeremy that CPU doesn't look to be much of an improvement.

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Athlon-X4-880K-vs-AMD-A10-5800K-APU-2012-DTr/m121029vs2007

I can't find one anyway, which is the case with a lot of the FM2 CPUs. Long outdated I guess.

One of the things we did to improve performance was to turn video card setting *up*! The CPU was running at plus 90% and the video card at ~ 35%. That was suppose to throw some of work load on to the video card, which it seemed to do and it did make performance better. But CPU usage didn't go down for some reason. Now instead of one being maxed out they're both maxed out.

I think I'm going to blow this project off. I've been effing with it for 3 days with no improvement in site. That's enough time wasted.


$100 ebay. it has faster memory support. EDIT: so depending on the speed of your 16gb RAM you could eek out a little more speed.

Just grab a bigger CPU cooler and use the PC as is.

As for 3 days. it took me 30 days, 8-10 hours per day to get my GForce 4600 card running right back in 2003. Good times.

_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 16754
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The term "Gaming PC" can mean whatever you want it to be. Some companies realize that people have no idea what they're doing so they slap a 50 cent plastic window on the case with a few LED lights and market it as such. Walmart seems to get this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWHlPH23P-w

You can buy a "gaming pc" for $200-300, and you can also spend $5000+. All depends on what you're after, no different than buying a car. But just like buying a 1972 Yugo with a spoiler on it doesn't make it a race car, a plastic window and some lights on a PC case doesn't make it a gaming PC. Wink

The PC you have Phil was probably from some years ago and was probably low end for gaming to begin with. That doesn't mean it can't be used for gaming, especially for a 10 year old who probably has somewhat low expectations anyway. Hes not going to notice the difference between anisotropic filter off and at 16x. Wink
I would just turn the game settings down and use it "as is". Fortnite isn't overly taxing with settings turned down, especially if you go 1080p or lower. Gaming PCs components (mostly the GPU) start to get really expensive if you expect 60+ FPS at 4K.

Kal

_________________

Support our site by using our affiliate links. We thank you!
My basement/HT/bar/brewery build 2.0
Back to top
View user's photo album (18 photos)
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kal wrote:
The term "Gaming PC" can mean whatever you want it to be. Some companies realize that people have no idea what they're doing so they slap a 50 cent plastic window on the case with a few LED lights and market it as such. Walmart seems to get this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWHlPH23P-w

You can buy a "gaming pc" for $200-300, and you can also spend $5000+. All depends on what you're after, no different than buying a car. But just like buying a 1972 Yugo with a spoiler on it doesn't make it a race car, a plastic window and some lights on a PC case doesn't make it a gaming PC. Wink

The PC you have Phil was probably from some years ago and was probably low end for gaming to begin with. That doesn't mean it can't be used for gaming, especially for a 10 year old who probably has somewhat low expectations anyway. Hes not going to notice the difference between anisotropic filter off and at 16x. Wink
I would just turn the game settings down and use it "as is". Fortnite isn't overly taxing with settings turned down, especially if you go 1080p or lower. Gaming PCs components (mostly the GPU) start to get really expensive if you expect 60+ FPS at 4K.

Kal


My 2nd gaming PC 1999-2003, $20 000. Sooo much fun!

_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeremy I saw that on ebay. Those are used from China, which seems kind of odd. Not comfortable buying that.

I paid $100 for the whole PC with gaming headphones. It has one of those cases with 3 color change fans you were talking about. My grandson loves it. I can sell it at the shop for at least $200. I'll just go that route.

Kal, I've built a lot of computers. Just never been a gamer and know nothing about them. I built 2 HTPCs back in the day which I overclocked to get decent ripped DVD playback. Spent a fair amount of money on both of those. I had pricey video cards in them. I guess they were basically gaming PCs.

I spent at least a couple of grand, probably 3, on this DAW. It's old and not worth much these days. An old 4 core i7, 32GB RAM, 2 or 3TB SSDs.

I haven't had it fully set up in 3-4 years. I might give it a try for gaming.

Also, my grandson has an i5 w/8GB RAM laptop he saved up for and bought from the pawn shop. It runs Fortnite just fine. I just wanted a full PC he could tinker with at my house.



Back to top
kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 16754
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil Smith wrote:
Kal, I've built a lot of computers. Just never been a gamer and know nothing about them. I built 2 HTPCs back in the day which I overclocked to get decent ripped DVD playback. Spent a fair amount of money on both of those. I had pricey video cards in them. I guess they were basically gaming PCs.

No, not gaming PCs. Gaming PCs have a disproportionate amount of funds that go just towards the graphics card (GPU) usually as that's where the action is. 50% of the cost is an often quoted amount but it will vary depending on the games you want to play. That's separate from anything not in the tower (monitor/keyboard/mouse/etc) not included.

HTPC has very little GPU requirements at all. Often the video card was dirt cheap. I build a few as well, and mod'ed the video cards various ways to bypass filters. The video cards were always a very inexpensive portion of the build.

Quote:
I spent at least a couple of grand, probably 3, on this DAW. It's old and not worth much these days. An old 4 core i7, 32GB RAM, 2 or 3TB SSDs. I haven't had it fully set up in 3-4 years. I might give it a try for gaming.

Throw in a $300-500 video card and it'll likely be fairly good if 1080p gaming is all you need. If you want 4K, you're looking at $1000 or more just for the video card. Really depending on the games he plays and what resolution/refresh rate he expects. Given he's 10 and this is probably his first gaming PC (?), I'd say 1080p is more than adequate. Wink

The i7 won't help at all in most cases. i5 is fine for most games or even i3. If he gets into highly CPU intensive simulation games like Space Engineers, or possibly massive strategy games, things may change and a better CPU can help.

Quote:
Also, my grandson has an i5 w/8GB RAM laptop he saved up for and bought from the pawn shop. It runs Fortnite just fine. I just wanted a full PC he could tinker with at my house.

Again, the CPU and RAM are somewhat meaningless when gaming is concerned (within reason). It's all about the GPU in most cases. There are lots of YouTube videos showing fairly high end (graphically speaking) games being played on various CPUs from i3s to i7s showing fairly similar refresh rates. Same with RAM: 8Gb most of the time is all you need and more won't give you faster frame rates, though I've typically always put in 16 just because it's reasonably cheap.

Kal

_________________

Support our site by using our affiliate links. We thank you!
My basement/HT/bar/brewery build 2.0


Last edited by kal on Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:46 pm; edited 3 times in total
Back to top
View user's photo album (18 photos)
kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 16754
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnalogRocks wrote:
My 2nd gaming PC 1999-2003, $20 000. Sooo much fun!

Things were definitely crazier back then. I remember in the mid 90s spending $1500 for a CPU.

Kal

_________________

Support our site by using our affiliate links. We thank you!
My basement/HT/bar/brewery build 2.0
Back to top
View user's photo album (18 photos)
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah my 128meg 4600 video card was $850 in 2002
_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
kal
Forum Administrator



Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 16754
Location: Ottawa, Canada

TV/Projector: JVC DLA-RS56


PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In case you haven't seen it Phil, a great website for PC parts pricing and to ensure parts work together: https://pcpartpicker.com/

Kal

_________________

Support our site by using our affiliate links. We thank you!
My basement/HT/bar/brewery build 2.0
Back to top
View user's photo album (18 photos)
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kal, yes gaming PCs I would say. Like you and Jeremy build? No, but they both had fairly pricey MBs that could be overclocked and came with overclocking software for the MB and CPU. At least one of them had a heat pipe on the chipset chip. The $180 NVidia cards had big heat sinks on them and I think fans as well.

Well I couldn't leave it alone. Last night after some more tweeking I got Fortnite playing well. Surprisingly well. And with no heat issues. Then it really went to hell. Fortnite wouldn't load right. That got worse until Fortnite wouldn't play at all. Nothing would fix it.

But I was encouraged. I had removed Fortnite and updated Windows on Monday. The PC never has auto- restarted. It boots down and hangs on a blank screen, or shuts off entirely. That might have screwed up the update process. There were some odd problems with windoes after updating.

I wanted to eliminate that as a possible source of my problem. So I check update and there's still updates to be loaded. I download them and they won't run! I try some fixes from MS's website to no avail. So after hours of fighting that, I decide to try the windows repair option. That seems to be working (it's doing it as I type) but as far as I can tell it downloaded the updates again! That's 3 times in 3 days. And each time takes a long time. Frustrating!

I would have been better off if I hadn't got it to briefly play well last night. I wouldn't have spent yet another day on this. And who knows if any of this is going to work.

PS: This is a possible reason it not auto-restarting. At least I hope it is. I can't try it until it completes the repair process.

https://www.tenforums.com/general-support/19805-windows-10-wont-do-restart.html
Back to top
AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26022
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahhh Windows 10. I am so glad I never went down THAT rabit hole.
_________________
Tech support for nothing

CRT.

HD done right!
Back to top
View user's photo album (27 photos)
Phil Smith




Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 7593



PostLink    Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I spent almost all day Wednesday working on it but finally got everything sorted out. Thumbs Up

More tweaking (lots of youtube videos on the subject) and I got Fortnite running pretty good. Not perfect but decent.

So I can't do much about my CPU without changing the motherboard, which will probably require new RAM as well. I don't want to do that. You guys say the video card matters most. What about upgrading that?

All I need to run is 1080 @ 60Hz. That's what my 80" TV is. This page ranks video cards by what resolution and refresh rate they'll run. Would I benefit form any of these? They are listed as the minimum required to run what I need.

https://www.logicalincrements.com/articles/graphicscardcomparison

50%
GTX 1060 6GB
GTX 690
GTX 1060 3GB
GTX 780 Ti

50%
RX 5500 XT
RX 580
RX 480 8GB
RX 480 4GB
R9 390X

Xbox One X GPU

45%
GTX TITAN (Kepler, 2013)
GTX 970

45%
R9 390
R9 290X
RX 570

40%
GTX 1650

40%
R9 290
RX 470

35%
GTX 780
GTX 590

35%
R9 380X
R9 280X
HD 7970 GHz
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer-friendly view    CurtPalme.com Forum Index -> Home Theater PCs All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 1 of 4
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum