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Soundcard Confusion
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Joemarzen




Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 66
Location: Edgerton, Wi (Near Madison)


PostLink    Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 6:58 pm    Post subject: Soundcard Confusion Reply with quote


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What do you guys think is the best way for me to hook my computer to my home theater receiver? Most sound cards don't seem to have the type of output jacks necessary. I've seen a couple Soundblaster kits that have some extra jacks for the 5.25" bay that would seem to work. Also, what seems like a cheaper option would be an external USB sound card, like the Creative Labs USB SoundBlaster Live! 24-Bit External Sound Card. Anyone have any experiences?

Also what sort of output jack should I look for? Optical seems to be fairly universal...
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JustGreg




Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3098
Location: Kenosha, WI


PostLink    Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't have anything about connectivity to offer but I will offer my caution against one particular SB card. I'd stay away from the Audigy 2ZS THX certified model. It may be fixed now seeing as the one I have is about 3 years old but there are snaps and pops from this card that Creative doesn't seem to give a sh*t about fixing. The problem is heavily talked about in a slew of forums so I know it's not just my card or a bad power supply. I bought it for an HTPC and it sat in a closet while I was gathering parts so of course by the time I discovered it was problematic it was too late to RMA it back to Creative. I never did go the HTPC route tho because of the labor intensive nature of using one.
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Greg

"Is it ignorance or apathy? Hey, I don't know and I don't care!" --Jimmy Buffett
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AFryia




Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 956
Location: S.E. Michigan VPH-G70Q


PostLink    Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

S/PDIF Tos Link, just one connection.

That way the receiver will switch automatically between PCM, Pro-Logic 5.1 DD etc.

The only down side I'm aware of are some DVDs like T2 The Ultimate edition. Audio from the HD movie does not play back, you need to run the analog audio cables.

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MikeEby




Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 5238
Location: Osceola, Indiana


PostLink    Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did run S/PDIF in PowerDVD, until recently when I got a new to me Pre/Proc with analog in I think it sounds much better. Problem is PowerDVD right now does not output lossless audio. So I need to know more about how Mark_A_W rips HD-DVD/Blu-ray and encodes with FLAC. Right now this is the only way to get lossless audio from a PC that I know of.
I use the Sound Card that was bundled with the motherboard below:

http://usa.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=3&l2=11&l3=572&l4=0&model=1889&modelmenu=1

It’s actually a separate card. To my ears it sounds very good. Much better then S/PDIF.

Edit: You were asking about making the connection. I use 3 of these if you are running 5.1 to the analog in on my Pre/Proc.

http://www.cablestogo.com/product.asp?cat%5Fid=2009&sku=03178

You can get them at Walmart for $4.00 each. The ones Walmart sells are 6 feet long.

Mike

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AFryia




Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 956
Location: S.E. Michigan VPH-G70Q


PostLink    Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MikeEby wrote:
I did run S/PDIF in PowerDVD, until recently when I got a new to me Pre/Proc with analog in I think it sounds much better. Problem is PowerDVD right now does not output lossless audio. So I need to know more about how Mark_A_W rips HD-DVD/Blu-ray and encodes with FLAC. Right now this is the only way to get lossless audio from a PC that I know of.


Mike, this something I was not aware of Confused

Is this unique to PowerDVD, not outputting lossless audio?
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MikeEby




Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 5238
Location: Osceola, Indiana


PostLink    Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, There is a 25 page thread on the "A" site called "FACT: You cannot listen to High Resolution HD audio via PowerDVD"

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=892863

Mark_A_W probably knows more, the problem is in the PowerDVD decoder or lack of a HiRes decoder. The thing about using analog output is you really don't know what you have coming out of the analog jacks, because it's analog. I do feel analog sounds better but it is subjective I have no way to prove it.

Mike

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AFryia




Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 956
Location: S.E. Michigan VPH-G70Q


PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike,

Forgive my ignorance.

I use MCE 2005 with nVida codecs and and couple others.

Are you saying I'm not getting lossless audio? That link talked about PowerDVD
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MikeEby




Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 5238
Location: Osceola, Indiana


PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AFryia wrote:
Mike,

Forgive my ignorance.

I use MCE 2005 with nVida codecs and and couple others.

Are you saying I'm not getting lossless audio? That link talked about PowerDVD


Don’t feel alone about your ignorance, I am not an expert I only know what I read. The threads on AVS get so convoluted and large it’s hard to make sense out of anything. What type of files/disks do you play with Nvidia codecs?

I think it's only PowerDVD that does not output lossless audio. But there are not a lot of choices right now, PDVD is about the only game in town for HD-DVD or Blu-ray, unless you had better luck with Arcsoft than I did. I don't know if it outputs lossless audio, the trail version of a couple of months ago was so unstable on my machine it was worthless I have heard it was better now but have not tried it.

I think Media Center Classic will output whatever it’s encoded with. Mark_A_W has devised a method of ripping and recoding to lossless.

Mike

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AFryia




Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 956
Location: S.E. Michigan VPH-G70Q


PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike,

Got it.

I'm only playing standard DVD's or HD *.TS streams recored with my fussion HD card.

I haven't made the jump to BR or HD DVD. 30$ a pop is a little steep!

Anthony

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perisoft




Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY


PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The whole lossless audio thing is a complete load of crap. Unless you're chomping audio down to 128k CBR MP3, you'll be REALLY hard pressed to tell the difference with ideal source material in ideal circumstances.

Let me answer this for you first - you have neither; I don't care what kind of HT you have.

I'll sum up all audio discussion and product development beyond basic functionality and acoustics:


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AnalogRocks
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Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26690
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Geeze that took me a few seconds to get your summary
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AFryia




Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 956
Location: S.E. Michigan VPH-G70Q


PostLink    Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

can I get that on a tee shirt. Very Happy

perisoft wrote:
The whole lossless audio thing is a complete load of crap. Unless you're chomping audio down to 128k CBR MP3, you'll be REALLY hard pressed to tell the difference with ideal source material in ideal circumstances.

Let me answer this for you first - you have neither; I don't care what kind of HT you have.

I'll sum up all audio discussion and product development beyond basic functionality and acoustics:

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David_Web




Joined: 02 May 2007
Posts: 418
Location: Sweden


PostLink    Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

" The whole lossless audio thing is a complete load of crap. Unless you're chomping audio down to 128k CBR MP3, you'll be REALLY hard pressed to tell the difference with ideal source material in ideal circumstances. "

If you can't hear the difference then good for you. You just saved yourself a lot of hassle.


I can clearly hear the difference and I'm no "gold ear". And I do have a good rig. But even on a "low end" rig the compression can add horrible distortion.

v0 on the other hand will be a hard time to tell the difference, it does depend on decoder though.

DD 192 vs lossless? Well guess.
DTS vs lossless? The new DTS might be nice and fully acceptable especially the HD variant. Depends on the decoder.

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oliverg




Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia

TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1


PostLink    Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The better your audio chain, the more you will be able to hear the difference between compressed/uncompressed sources

I'm not someone that buys 'high end' speaker cables (or even interconnects) - as far as I'm concerned, Monster is way good enough - as are Blue Jeans.

But there is an audible difference between heavily compressed material and lossless.

PowerDVD isn't meant to be able to do lossless - (at least not 3 months ago) - the developers have effectively placed a bottleneck in the chain to conform to their intepretation of perceived copy protection requirements.

You wont be able to do lossless using SP/DIF (coax or optical) anyway - there isn't the bandwidth for LPCM.

I use an Asus Xonar. It is a great performer. I use the analog audio outputs directly into the 7.1 analog input on my preamp. The sound is nothing short of stunning. Having said that, SQ is almost as good (still superb) using bitstream over SP/DIF - DD+ is 640k and DTS 1536k ...

The Xonar can do all the processing (including DTS-HD MA) and output via analog to any pre-amp you have.

Even the motherboard on board soundcards are pretty good these days.

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deronmoped




Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 1154
Location: San Diego


PostLink    Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I used a Turtle Beach Riviera sound card. Just hooked up the optical out, works great. It's a pretty cheap solution, $35.00 at Fry's.

Deron.
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AnalogRocks
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Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26690
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada

TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G


PostLink    Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just curious. If you are using the SPDIF output is the soundcard doing much of anything other than providing an interface?
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MikeEby




Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 5238
Location: Osceola, Indiana


PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnalogRocks wrote:
Just curious. If you are using the SPDIF output is the soundcard doing much of anything other than providing an interface?


I would think so, seems like it would just be digital bit stream to the receiver. I would hope the sound card does nothing but pass it to the receiver.

Mike

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AnalogRocks
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PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right, so I see why guy's on the other forum just looked for a motherboard with SPDIF out and called it a day.
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MikeEby




Joined: 24 Jun 2007
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Location: Osceola, Indiana


PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Its truly subjective but I do honesty think the analog out on my sound card does sound better then SPDIF, but I cannot back it up with any kind of data. Sad

Mike

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AnalogRocks
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PostLink    Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MikeEby wrote:
Yes, Its truly subjective but I do honesty think the analog out on my sound card does sound better then SPDIF, but I cannot back it up with any kind of data. Sad

Mike


Yeah I bought an Auzentech for the analog out's. I have an older preamp with 2 set's of 5.1 analog input's.

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