Return to the CurtPalme.com main site CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum
A forum with a sense of fun and community for Home Theater enthusiasts!
Products for Sale ] [ FAQ: Hooking it all up ] [ CRT Primer/FAQ ] [ Best/Worst CRT Projectors List ] [ Setup Tips & Manuals ] [ Advanced Procedures ] [ Newsletters ]

 
Forum FAQForum FAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist  Photo AlbumsPhoto Albums  RegisterRegister 
 MembershipClub Membership   ProfileProfile   Private MessagesPrivate Messages   Log inLog in 
Blu-ray disc release list and must-have titles. Buy the latest and best Blu-ray titles to show off in your home theater!

Crystalio II 3800 or Lumagen 2124...strictly for Laserdiscs

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer-friendly view    CurtPalme.com Forum Index -> Video Processors, Converters, Switchers, Cables
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Mechromancer




Joined: 19 Jul 2021
Posts: 20



PostLink    Posted: Sun Aug 15, 2021 12:09 am    Post subject: Crystalio II 3800 or Lumagen 2124...strictly for Laserdiscs Reply with quote


        Register to remove this ad. It's free!
I know these units are overkill to stick in a chain, purely to watch Laserdiscs. I've already had the "riot act" read to me on another forum (unsolicited and without any knowledge of my my budget, interests or intentions). But these are the only units consistently recommended as the best for laserdisc viewing.

The LD player is the Panasonic LX-900, the display is a Vizo 4K V505-H1 (yes it's a cheapy 4K, it's in my game room for casual watching if I don't wanna impose on the missus in the living room ;P ).

I also have a Radiance XE-3D which provides a noticeable (but not great) improvement to LDs.

This is my current chain:

LD >> XE (composite) >> Display

In my limited knowledge of the subject, here are my 3 options for a chain:

LD >> Crystalio >> Display
LD >> Crystalio >> Radiance XE (scaling, CMS) >> Display
LD >> 2124 >> Display (I don't think the XE needs to be involved in this chain, but please advise)

Would any of those examples provide a noticeable improvement (i'm not looking for 4K quality here) to the set up I already have?

If so, considering I can get the Crystalio for almost 1/2 the price of the Lumagen, which one would be the better bang for the buck?

Looking forward to your expert observations and suggestions. Smile
Back to top
Hulio




Joined: 15 Apr 2006
Posts: 371
Location: Belgium


PostLink    Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2021 6:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't have any experience with Lumagen processors, but I know that for SD, and especially for LD enthusiasts, Crystalio II-3800 is the way to go. It has one of the best adjustable comb filters in the consumer market.
Here a quote from someone on LD forum:

"I know not many people have these and they're getting harder and harder to find. However, they are one of the best options for LD processing. The people here who drove me to the madness of video processors have moved on to the next stratosphere of technology and I am happy to watch them try to reach the Sun.

The C2 is still a valid option for LD and still one of the best if you can find one. Part of the reason why is due to the fact that you can adjust the comb filter settings. Very few processors out there allow this. Some TVs will have these adjustments in the Service Menus but that isn't as convenient as a normal menu. Lumagen and the EVAL board are the only two that come to mind.

Anyway, I've read the threads here about the settings and also experimented myself. Some of the info seems unclear as presented and I'd like to share my own personal experience and settings. You don't have to use them and maybe they aren't correct for your system. Use these as a guide and a stepping stone.

There are 4 settings. Each setting is from 0-100 steps. They are:
Luma Gain
Chroma Gain
Luma Coring
Chroma Coring

Previously, I was using settings found here in other posts. While that was helpful it did not get me the results I had hoped for. So I re-read them and also re-read the TI TVP5160 3d Comb Filter Operation Guide and experimented on my own.

Here are my conclusions:

Think of Gain as a balance between 3D and 2D combing. Depending on the setting it defines how fast the filter switches between 3D/2D. But it doesn't just switch between them, it blends them together unless you're at the extreme ends like 1 or 100. In my mind I see it as a see-saw or a fulcrum. At 50 it has an equal bias toward either 3D or 2D and the change is blended so not a drastic change (no artifacts). At 1 it is locked to 3D all the time and at 100 it is locked to 2D. The switch is very visual and artifacts appear on screen. I have mine set somewhere between 25-50 depending on the disc. So a slight bias towards 3D combing."
Back to top
Mechromancer




Joined: 19 Jul 2021
Posts: 20



PostLink    Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hulio wrote:
I don't have any experience with Lumagen processors, but I know that for SD, and especially for LD enthusiasts, Crystalio II-3800 is the way to go. It has one of the best adjustable comb filters in the consumer market.
Here a quote from someone on LD forum:

"I know not many people have these and they're getting harder and harder to find. However, they are one of the best options for LD processing. The people here who drove me to the madness of video processors have moved on to the next stratosphere of technology and I am happy to watch them try to reach the Sun.

The C2 is still a valid option for LD and still one of the best if you can find one. Part of the reason why is due to the fact that you can adjust the comb filter settings. Very few processors out there allow this. Some TVs will have these adjustments in the Service Menus but that isn't as convenient as a normal menu. Lumagen and the EVAL board are the only two that come to mind.

Anyway, I've read the threads here about the settings and also experimented myself. Some of the info seems unclear as presented and I'd like to share my own personal experience and settings. You don't have to use them and maybe they aren't correct for your system. Use these as a guide and a stepping stone.

There are 4 settings. Each setting is from 0-100 steps. They are:
Luma Gain
Chroma Gain
Luma Coring
Chroma Coring

Previously, I was using settings found here in other posts. While that was helpful it did not get me the results I had hoped for. So I re-read them and also re-read the TI TVP5160 3d Comb Filter Operation Guide and experimented on my own.

Here are my conclusions:

Think of Gain as a balance between 3D and 2D combing. Depending on the setting it defines how fast the filter switches between 3D/2D. But it doesn't just switch between them, it blends them together unless you're at the extreme ends like 1 or 100. In my mind I see it as a see-saw or a fulcrum. At 50 it has an equal bias toward either 3D or 2D and the change is blended so not a drastic change (no artifacts). At 1 it is locked to 3D all the time and at 100 it is locked to 2D. The switch is very visual and artifacts appear on screen. I have mine set somewhere between 25-50 depending on the disc. So a slight bias towards 3D combing."


Thanx Hulio. Appreciate the info. I didn't know that the Crystalio had an adjustable comb filter. That certainly sounds interesting and might be the way I want to go...if I can figure out how to use the settings.
Back to top
nidi




Joined: 17 Aug 2008
Posts: 286
Location: Switzerland


PostLink    Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2021 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mechromancer wrote:


Thanx Hulio. Appreciate the info. I didn't know that the Crystalio had an adjustable comb filter. That certainly sounds interesting and might be the way I want to go...if I can figure out how to use the settings.



There's something new happening in the 3D Comb Filter world:

https://www.singmai.com/Modules/sm03.html


have a look at their manual


may become the best 3D comb filter ever designed.


the guy worked for Snell & Wilcox as a decoder engineer, so he knows what he's doing.
Back to top
Mechromancer




Joined: 19 Jul 2021
Posts: 20



PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2021 6:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nidi wrote:
Mechromancer wrote:


Thanx Hulio. Appreciate the info. I didn't know that the Crystalio had an adjustable comb filter. That certainly sounds interesting and might be the way I want to go...if I can figure out how to use the settings.



There's something new happening in the 3D Comb Filter world:

https://www.singmai.com/Modules/sm03.html


have a look at their manual


may become the best 3D comb filter ever designed.


the guy worked for Snell & Wilcox as a decoder engineer, so he knows what he's doing.


Oh, nice! Thank you so much for the heads up.

I have a friend that owns a business installing large-screen displays in casino sports books, here in Vegas, and high-end home theaters. He's looking for a Lumgan 2124 for me. He already got me a Crystalio II 3800 to try out. But this seems very intersting. Although I must say, they didn't do themselves any favors posting a 480p video.

Has anyone tried this unit? And how complicated (or easy) would it be to integrate into a system?

Thanx
Back to top
nidi




Joined: 17 Aug 2008
Posts: 286
Location: Switzerland


PostLink    Posted: Tue Aug 24, 2021 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mechromancer wrote:




Has anyone tried this unit? And how complicated (or easy) would it be to integrate into a system?

Thanx



I received the unit a couple of weeks ago.

FW is not yet finished, some menus are not yet active.

but sharpness and comb filter performance is awesome.
Back to top
Mechromancer




Joined: 19 Jul 2021
Posts: 20



PostLink    Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nidi wrote:
Mechromancer wrote:




Has anyone tried this unit? And how complicated (or easy) would it be to integrate into a system?

Thanx



I received the unit a couple of weeks ago.

FW is not yet finished, some menus are not yet active.

but sharpness and comb filter performance is awesome.


Nice!

Any chance you could post a couple of comparison screen shots or a better vid than they did (480p really wasn't helpful as the image was pretty terrible all around).

Thanx
Back to top
nidi




Joined: 17 Aug 2008
Posts: 286
Location: Switzerland


PostLink    Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2021 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sorry, I do not have an SDI capture card yet.
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic   Printer-friendly view    CurtPalme.com Forum Index -> Video Processors, Converters, Switchers, Cables All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum