|
 |
|
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2790
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
 Link Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:35 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| mp20748 wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | cmjohnson wrote: | But I can tell you that there's no point in posting a screen capture NOT from a projector in this thread,
when the point of this thread is not even to compare screen captures anyway.
|
Sorry for my ignorance, and with the greatest respect, but what other purpose could a screenshot have other than comparing it to the actual source material? |
I forgot to respond to this...
And what would be the reason to compare it to the actual source material (screencap), when it is impossible to duplicate the original using any single chip camera that is NOT really fully capable of first, capturing what's on the screen. and second, after the capture and the image processing done in the camera itself to include the image processing done in hosting (uploading and resized for posting on the forum) the shot itself, even be considered as a viable and reliable source for valid comparison?
Screenshots can never be used as a reference or valid material for proper evaluation or for proper comparison sake. They can only be used as a simulation or replica of what is actually on the screen.
And to answer this further. A proper "screenshot" comparison would involve two separate projectors, using the exact same source, projected on the exact same screen (not only same material) and in the exact same ambient environment.
And this is why comparing screenshots from two different locations, using different camera's or even camera's with different settings, different screens and room environment is just plain stupid. The comparison can never be fair or equal. And for technical qualifications, it would be an exercise of ignorance to believe otherwise.
Oh and before I need to keep reminding that my Green CRT is an LCP. The Red and Blue are LUG's. The Green blooms (as can be seen in my shots) as I've made clear throughout this forum. And unlike with stock neck boards, trying to get these combination of tubes to cooperate with each other is not going to happen on my setup. But that does not mean I'll not be able to show the many others virtues that are other than color balance.
And if you play around with this long enough, you'll also learn how difficult it is for these cameras to maintain that perfect color calibration though the multiple-image-processing-chain from screen capture to screenshot. |
I don't think anyone is seriously judging screenshots as an absolute measure of a setup. But generally our final goal with any display devices to reproduce the source material as faithful as possible. With test patterns we KNOW how it should look like, but less for the movies... Regardless, with movie screenshots I think the most valuable to compare the screenshot to the screencap because that would show the direction to go further.
Also if most factors of a setup (including the camera settings and source material) should be kept constant, then simple changes would directly transform to the screenshot as well even though a single screenshot alone is far from the screencap. So theoretically it could show an unmodded vs. modded situation for example.
I think most of the complaint on your screenshots are that some of them don't look as good as they should, but it is never expressed what is the key part on the actual screenshot that is worth looking at despite the falws, instead a good bunch of screen shots are posted without any notes, and sometimes the quality of the posted pictures vary a lot.
I also know how hard to take good screenshots off screen, this is why I don't get much involved in them, I simply don't want to spend that much time on them.
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| gjaky wrote: |
I don't think anyone is seriously judging screenshots as an absolute measure of a setup. But generally our final goal with any display devices to reproduce the source material as faithful as possible. With test patterns we KNOW how it should look like, but less for the movies... Regardless, with movie screenshots I think the most valuable to compare the screenshot to the screencap because that would show the direction to go further.
Also if most factors of a setup (including the camera settings and source material) should be kept constant, then simple changes would directly transform to the screenshot as well even though a single screenshot alone is far from the screencap. So theoretically it could show an unmodded vs. modded situation for example.
I think most of the complaint on your screenshots are that some of them don't look as good as they should, but it is never expressed what is the key part on the actual screenshot that is worth looking at despite the falws, instead a good bunch of screen shots are posted without any notes, and sometimes the quality of the posted pictures vary a lot.
I also know how hard to take good screenshots off screen, this is why I don't get much involved in them, I simply don't want to spend that much time on them. |
This I can appreciate, and it makes sense.
Because of so many variables, to include you can click the same scene with the same camera multiple times, and not every one of the shots will be the same. So trying to use these cameras for a rule or reference for measurement would be a wasted of time. And there are for some reasons, some scenes the cameras just will not capture. Things like hash noise, background detail and overall clarity are the things I'm trying to capture, and they turn out well most of the time. Colors on the other hand can be shifted by something as simple as ambient light in the room, and that's why I'm not so into trying to capture the correct color.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jbmeyer13
Joined: 03 Dec 2010
Posts: 1135
|
| Link Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mp20748 wrote: | | Things like hash noise, background detail and overall clarity are the things I'm trying to capture, and they turn out well most of the time. |
See Mike this is what I think causes great confusion. You've previously said that hash is a noise that we can't see in the image but now say that it's something you can capture in a screen shot. This is a contradiction in terms.
I 100% agree that there's too many variables when taking screen shots and as one of the few who has seen your projector in person I must say that they (screen shots) don't even come remotely close to displaying what is actually on screen. I've always felt that they don't do any justice to the quality of your work.
As Gabor said, you never post what we should be looking for either. For screen shots to have any merit you would need two images of the same shot, same camera settings and different boards and then notate the difference we should see. This would prevent your thread from getting derailed and/or unfairly criticized.
_________________
Projector: Modded 9501LC ULtra- MP VIM, Vold VNB, ETECH LVPS, Silver VIM Cables, HD10F's & a V1 case!
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 1:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jbmeyer13 wrote: | | mp20748 wrote: | | Things like hash noise, background detail and overall clarity are the things I'm trying to capture, and they turn out well most of the time. |
See Mike this is what I think causes great confusion. You've previously said that hash is a noise that we can't see in the image but now say that it's something you can capture in a screen shot. This is a contradiction in terms |
No it is not, if you guys would look at what I've been saying the many times I've mentioned what I've been doing to the Moome card, this would never come up. Hash noise can be seen if one knows what to look for, and when it cannot be seen, is when it affects the low end...please deal with this when I post about it and stop bringing it up when it's not relevant to the discussion.
The last picture I posted in this thread, I had mentioned here:
| Quote: | | Last week or so I posted some shots on the "shootout" thread, in those shots I used a Moome card that was not fully modified thinking someone would notice the noise in it. One of the shots is below. See if you can tell what the noise is. Look at the other shots that I posted (not on that same batch) as a reference: |
But nobody responds to the many and well mentioned things I've been posting in this thread, but instead bring up really ridiculous stuff like this, with all the stuff I've been posting on the Moome card and the abundance of explanation I've been posting with it. To include one of the workshops and even info on the class. But no one looks at that stuff, and then post stuff like:
| Quote: | | but it is never expressed what is the key part on the actual screenshot that is worth looking at |
Look at the many times I've discussed the noise in this thread, and the last picture I posted that ask the question on this. And if one would look at what I've been posting, maybe the constant nagging about the shots would not exist, because the noise has been talked about and explained in this thread..
And when no one responds, it would usually mean no one is interested. And with that I should I continue to post on the matter, when the only time this comes up is when someone seems to be attacking my shots.
| Quote: | | I 100% agree that there's too many variables when taking screen shots and as one of the few who has seen your projector in person I must say that they (screen shots) don't even come remotely close to displaying what is actually on screen. I've always felt that they don't do any justice to the quality of your work |
True, but the shots can never truly reveal what's on the screen, but rather than except why they are being posted, there are the request to try something that they themselves have never tried.
And when Gabor finally get his mods finished, I would love to see him try the things he thinks I should be doing. That would be the best way for him to find out the uselessness of doing it.
| Quote: | | As Gabor said, you never post what we should be looking for either. For screen shots to have any merit you would need two images of the same shot, same camera settings and different boards and then notate the difference we should see. This would prevent your thread from getting derailed and/or unfairly criticized. |
This sounds right, for anyone who has zero experience with this, but it is a wrong way to do this. My thread gets derailed because that is the intent of the people who keep bringing this up. Why else would someone post on something they have no experience with and why would someone agree with someone who has posted something that only makes sense in theory. And when will Gabor himself can post on this, then maybe it can be understood because he's speaking from experience. But speaking from my experience, swapping boards and taking shots to show the difference makes no sense.
Also, and I've just posted on this earlier. And this is from the industry itself. The only way to properly evaluate a projector would be to put two projectors together using the same source, screen and room environment. You can take a camera and point it at a stationary image and take five shots, and not all of the shots would be the same. So if doing the same after swapping boards, how would you know the difference between the boards?
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 2:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2790
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
| Link Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
>> You can take a camera and point it at a stationary image and take five shots, and not all of the shots would be the same.
If your camera lets you select all adjustments manually (white balance exposure and aperture), then not, all five shot will look the same and, however the same settings may not work on other movies that is true, but the camera itself is a machine so if you can controll it will do what you want.
>>But nobody responds to the many and well mentioned things I've been posting in this thread, but instead bring up really ridiculous stuff like this, with all the stuff I've been posting on the Moome card and the abundance of explanation I've been posting with it.
I think you’d have to be more specific than that. Background detail and noise are usualy mentioned that is true, but I myself have hard time to evaluate them. You should do a real workshop at least once with encircled parts on screenshots noting „look guys for the noise there” or „look the background detail there”. I only saw U-571 and 5th element of your conventional demo materials, I don’t even know the other movies’ titles, and even then I don’t know U-571 and 5th element inside and out. So looking at a screenshot you make of a movie I saw 2 years ago I have trouble to evaluate the noise or background detail because I don’t know what is contributed to what (camera, projector, setup, material).
You make modifications, a modification is supposed to give an improvement over the stock machine, otherwise why anyone would bother buying it? And this calls again for the fact of comparing things, even remotely (because in my head I compare what I see on your screenshots to how I can recollect from my memories: how it looked then, however this is not very precise comparison I admit). But I sure can’t do anything with screenshots I don’t even know…
OFF:
Generally: you can say an apple is tasty or not by the knowledge that you tasted good and bad apples before. When people make judgement on anything they always actualy comparing things internally. Let’s evaluate the statements/questions below:
The background detail is good.
The picture noise is low.
My sallary is bad.
Today the weather is cold or hot?
->Can you set a question (or statement) which qualifies something that does not imply -not even remotely- a comparison? -I can’t…
Would you try to eat a blue glowing apple? Without knowing the apples are not blue and not glowing you may find it appealing and try it, otherwise probably not.
So every decisions are driven by past experiences and your mind actualy always comparing/weighing things one way or another.
ON:
So what a screenshot can actually tell without comparing to anything? But don’t get over this too: comparing two non relevant screenshots of two different movies one with stock cards the other with modified cards will tell simply nothing.
As I find screenshots of movie materials may look good or bad but they tell actually nothing, never. Even screenshots of test patterns are problematic in most cases…
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 8:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
| gjaky wrote: | >> You can take a camera and point it at a stationary image and take five shots, and not all of the shots would be the same.
If your camera lets you select all adjustments manually (white balance exposure and aperture), then not, all five shot will look the same and, however the same settings may not work on other movies that is true, but the camera itself is a machine so if you can controll it will do what you want.
>>But nobody responds to the many and well mentioned things I've been posting in this thread, but instead bring up really ridiculous stuff like this, with all the stuff I've been posting on the Moome card and the abundance of explanation I've been posting with it.
I think you’d have to be more specific than that. Background detail and noise are usualy mentioned that is true, but I myself have hard time to evaluate them. You should do a real workshop at least once with encircled parts on screenshots noting „look guys for the noise there” or „look the background detail there”. I only saw U-571 and 5th element of your conventional demo materials, I don’t even know the other movies’ titles, and even then I don’t know U-571 and 5th element inside and out. So looking at a screenshot you make of a movie I saw 2 years ago I have trouble to evaluate the noise or background detail because I don’t know what is contributed to what (camera, projector, setup, material).
You make modifications, a modification is supposed to give an improvement over the stock machine, otherwise why anyone would bother buying it? And this calls again for the fact of comparing things, even remotely (because in my head I compare what I see on your screenshots to how I can recollect from my memories: how it looked then, however this is not very precise comparison I admit). But I sure can’t do anything with screenshots I don’t even know…
OFF:
Generally: you can say an apple is tasty or not by the knowledge that you tasted good and bad apples before. When people make judgement on anything they always actualy comparing things internally. Let’s evaluate the statements/questions below:
The background detail is good.
The picture noise is low.
My sallary is bad.
Today the weather is cold or hot?
->Can you set a question (or statement) which qualifies something that does not imply -not even remotely- a comparison? -I can’t…
Would you try to eat a blue glowing apple? Without knowing the apples are not blue and not glowing you may find it appealing and try it, otherwise probably not.
So every decisions are driven by past experiences and your mind actualy always comparing/weighing things one way or another.
ON:
So what a screenshot can actually tell without comparing to anything? But don’t get over this too: comparing two non relevant screenshots of two different movies one with stock cards the other with modified cards will tell simply nothing.
As I find screenshots of movie materials may look good or bad but they tell actually nothing, never. Even screenshots of test patterns are problematic in most cases… |
This is what happens when someones post their opinion of something they have no experience with to debate something they know absolutely nothing about, in an attept to make someones posting appear as if they don't know what they are doing...simply, how much sense does it make to claim to know something and post your opinion, when you have zero experience with what you're talking about?
And for me to to keep going over this with you is a waste of time...can you link me to a thread anywhere, that shows that you have experience with screenshots?
And since you're the guy that your cohorts keep saying is working on a set of mods that will blow what I'm doing away, why not start or go to one of those many threads that were started to announce your more superior mods, and then open a discussion on something you could have first hand experience with?
BTW, I'm still waiting for your superior mods to be announced. Maybe then, you can demonstrate what you've been trying to tell me, and you'll be able to come from a real experience in doing so. Or you can stop wasting time coming after me and get back to making your work happen. Because what makes your posting here look really funny, is that you're the guy that's supposed to have been working on the better mods for the past 9 months, that's supposed to blow away what I'm doing...why not start a thread to explain what is going on with that, or go open one of those many threads that was already started and bring people up to date on where you are with things. That's what I've been trying to do with this thread, but the trolling is getting to be too much.
I'm done with the discussions on screenshots. If you want to continue to challenge me on nonsense, go right ahead, my work is finished and I'm able to at least post something on it..
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2790
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
| Link Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | This is what happens when someones post their opinion of something they have no experience with to debate something they know absolutely nothing about, in an intent to make someones posting appear as if they don't know what they are doing...simply, how much sense does it make to claim to know something and post your opinion, when yiou have zero experience with what you're talking about? |
This might be true, but what makes me feel better about this is that seemengly I’m not the only one in this thread who have zero experience with screenshots then.
| Quote: | | And for me to to keep going over this with you is a waste of time...can you link me to a thread anywhere, that shows that you have experience with screenshots? |
It is right inbetween two of your posts in the Official CurtPalme.com CRT screenshot thread. I also have to admit that those shots were made still using the original neckboards of my XG.
On the other points you are absolutely right as well. Beside having a full time work as an electrical engineer and taking care about my family I really should update my thread with more oscilloscope shots, transfer characteristics and more explanations* on what I’m doing at least twice a day, sorry.
*: I still stand by my statement that I don’t address much -if any- value to movie screenshots.
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| gjaky wrote: | | Quote: | | This is what happens when someones post their opinion of something they have no experience with to debate something they know absolutely nothing about, in an intent to make someones posting appear as if they don't know what they are doing...simply, how much sense does it make to claim to know something and post your opinion, when yiou have zero experience with what you're talking about? |
This might be true, but what makes me feel better about this is that seemengly I’m not the only one in this thread who have zero experience with screenshots then.
| Quote: | | And for me to to keep going over this with you is a waste of time...can you link me to a thread anywhere, that shows that you have experience with screenshots? |
It is right inbetween two of your posts in the Official CurtPalme.com CRT screenshot thread. I also have to admit that those shots were made still using the original neckboards of my XG.
On the other points you are absolutely right as well. Beside having a full time work as an electrical engineer and taking care about my family I really should update my thread with more oscilloscope shots, transfer characteristics and more explanations* on what I’m doing at least twice a day, sorry.
*: I still stand by my statement that I don’t address much -if any- value to movie screenshots. |
I admire what you do, both as an engineer and what you've been posting on the forums, and hope the best for the changes you'll bring to others with CRT. Screenshots should be looked at as a means of looking at the image, but not with any real expectations of accuracy. And that's why I don't get into proper color balance and other nonsense things that seem like should also apply when properly calibrating a setup.
It is what it is, and that's all I use them for.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2017 3:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
A few to warm things back up...
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 11:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
A few more that shows an entirely unique image intensity. Fully loaded images with zero clipping or peaking. Contrast at 68.
This version drives so hard it actually triggers the beam limit. And will still maintain focus and sharpness at contrast 100.
Couldn't find the LVPS schematic, so I'll have to make the changes without them...hope to have a fully turn on/off LVPS in the next couple of days. But I must add, my green CRT is blooming again (glycol).. 
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2790
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
| Link Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 5:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mp20748 wrote: |
Couldn't find the LVPS schematic, so I'll have to make the changes without them...hope to have a fully turn on/off LVPS in the next couple of days. But I must add, my green CRT is blooming again (glycol)..
|
Mike if you want to turn off fan and filament in standby:
-remove D9, this will disable the fans in standby.
-Cut the trace between U20 pin 2 and C128 (leaving R224 connected to U20 pin 2 still). Install a P-channel MOSFETbetween the cut trace that is able to carry more than 2A and low R-DSon (IRF4905), source to U20 pin 2, drain to C128. Install an 1k Ohm resistor between gate and source, install a wire between gate and U26 pin 2. This will disable filament in standby.
EDIT: I rewrote to P-MOSFET only
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
Ok, I'll give that a look at later. I've already disabled the standby (3.9) so far. Now need to turn it off/on
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmjohnson
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 5180
Location: Buried under G90s
|
| Link Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I always hated the fact that a Marquee is not silent in standby. My usual practice is to unplug the PJ when not actively using it.
A mod that makes it truly silent in standby is very welcome news. Something I would probably do to every LVPS I own.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5681
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
|
| Link Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
The below shot is from the first of my recent group of shots earlier today. It represents my projector. The shots in the second group don't..
The second group were posted showing something entirely different, and that's why they are so different from the first group, yet they are both from the same setup.
The shot also shown below, has a very deep BLACK reference, while the second group, barely shows any black at all. And aside from why I posted the second group, they are not what I would call what my setup would usually be showing, which can be seen between the two groups.
Now, take a good look at the black in the bee shown in that shot, because that level of deep black represents some very special about the video chain I'll get into later on a different day, but for now, I'll not say what is really going on with these shots. Only that I marvel of the deep black in this last shot..
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmjohnson
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 5180
Location: Buried under G90s
|
| Link Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm only seeing one photo there, Mike.
I really wish that you two would play nice together. I for one am glad that we have two people who are actively involved in trying to improve the image of CRT projectors here and now in 2017. Your approaches are different, you both get results, you should both be happy that there are other minds working toward similar goals, and decide to be happy about it.
At this point the commercial value of any CRT projector mods or new developments is minimal. You would not be doing this if it were not a personal interest, dare I say even a personal PASSION, for the betterment of something you both appreciate, and I'm glad you're at it and would be even more glad if you were to decide to develop a true mutual respect for each other and leave all trace of negativity behind.
I myself have not given up on making focus better for Marquees. And I've come up with another experimental change that just
MIGHT finally have a Marquee focusing like a G90, and if I'm right it's actually trivially simple. I hope to put it to the test within a week now.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
greg9518lc
Joined: 19 Apr 2016
Posts: 360
|
| Link Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
GIJAKY has helped with Kurts question why lugs don't focus and together they have solved it. I have respect for
all develolers on this forum and I am sure Gjaky will be glad to share this . Look forward to mp/gjaky/kurt continued
passion to push the marquee to the next level. It is now obvious that the stock marquee magnetics are not the problem
as we are now able to acheive 10frtl on 110".
_________________
VDC 9518LC modded: I do not sell or promote mods only interested in the best PQ possible......
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cmjohnson
Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 5180
Location: Buried under G90s
|
| Link Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yes, the stock magnetics ARE a problem. They were never designed to work on Panasonic tubes, they were designed to work on Thomson tubes, which are considerably different despite their outward physical similarities.
Note that NO OTHER user of Panasonic projection CRTs selected Thomson focus yokes. They ALL went with Panasonic's partner magnetics company, Kanto-Denshi. And note that Marquees do not focus like Barcos or like Sony G90s. Not even like AmPros, come to think of it.
I have test run G90 magnetics in a Marquee and the result was that the tube and magnetics under test focused like a G90.
That means it was sharp, it was stable, and sharpness barely changed as contrast was increased to max. Of course there was SOME loss of sharpness, but that is inevitable given that the scan lines become thicker as beam current increases for multiple reasons including coulombic scattering within the electron beam, and the effect of higher drive current on the phosphor, with a larger area of the gaussian profiled beam spot diameter driving a larger area of the phosphor.
While there is room for focus improvement using the stock Marquee Thomson focus yokes, your'e still limited by the INFERIOR design of the Thomson yokes and not getting the best possible results.
As for LUGs having a lack of sharpness, I myself have not experienced this issue except when using OLD versions of Marquee circuits. The newer revision boards made for Ultras seem to handle LUGs just fine, and there are simple ways to optimize the
neck cards even further for use with LUG tubes.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
greg9518lc
Joined: 19 Apr 2016
Posts: 360
|
| Link Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 4:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
Sorry to say it's a focus board mod and nothing more. All the attention to trying
to improve the neckboards to focus is unesary. The best aproache is to minimize
neckboard modifications and the best practice is to just match them but as we
know it's a marquee and it takes 9 neck boards to actually make a matched set..
We now have 30% more uniform light out put and corner focus on 110" screen in part
to kurt and gjaky and I am postive this will make mp mods even better with the new developments.
Hence 8ftl which I have on lugs to Kurts 10ftl on 110" screen. So Gijakys fix works. Like I said
I want the cleanest and most dynamic image possible that why I am sharing this info and I am sure
Mp and others can use thus update. I just want the best image possible for all crt users nothing more
_________________
VDC 9518LC modded: I do not sell or promote mods only interested in the best PQ possible......
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2790
Location: Budapest, Hungary
|
| Link Posted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 5:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| mp20748 wrote: | | Ok, I'll give that a look at later. I've already disabled the standby (3.9) so far. Now need to turn it off/on |
You may have to add a resistor instead, between the gate and U26 pin2 depending on the Vgs threshold of the FET. The FET serves as a series switch in the filament line that is triggered by any of the switched secondary voltages, one could use a simple relay as well.
I unplug the projector...
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
Forum powered by phpBB © phpBB Group
|
|
Forum FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Photo Albums
Register
Profile
Private Messages
Log in
